Thurman#1 Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 well, GB had an awful line that gave up a ton of sacks last yr, but that didnt stop rodgers from putting up big #'s. Now i'm not saying trent is aaron rodgers, but just cause our oline is apparently sub par at pass blocking doesnt mean we are one dimensional and doomed. GB's offensive line was not great, but Rodgers made them look worse than they were by holding the ball a long time. If you looked at PFF last year when they had individual rankings, the GB guys were ranked above the Bills at every position on the line but one, if I remember correctly, and I'm not counting Butler, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGB Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 GB's offensive line was not great, but Rodgers made them look worse than they were by holding the ball a long time. If you looked at PFF last year when they had individual rankings, the GB guys were ranked above the Bills at every position on the line but one, if I remember correctly, and I'm not counting Butler, either. Rodgers held the ball while his receivers got down field - because he actually threw it more than ten yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fixxxer Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 So how come Belichick isn't still winning championships? He hasn't got the players anymore. Coaches might make a difference of a game or two per year. But they're greatly overrated. The Jets aren't some wild turnaround story. They're a young team that changed their defense three years ago and has played together and grown from young pups into their primes together. They're the story of a smart rebuild, including a couple of smart pickups. Calvin Pace was a great pickup and last year he had had a year in the system. Revis going from elite to simply the best in the game, a "forget the side of the field with the #1 WR" guy is a huge part of it also. David Harris maturing into one of the best in the game made a huge difference, not to mention picking up starters Bart Scott and Marques Douglas and Jim Leonhard from Baltimore and Lito Sheppard from Philly. That's four of 11 new guys, and throw in Revis and Harris in their third years and Lowery in his second, and throw in Jenkins and Pace as second year FAs who know the system cold now and you see this is a team that has had massive change and maturation over the past two years. Jets run defense: 2007: 29th 2008: 7th 2009: 8th Jets pass defense: 2007: 9th 2008: 29th 2009: 1st The run defense was 7th in the league in 2008 and the pass defense was 9th in 2007. This was a team that was reasonably close and has had new guys brought in and young guys brought up. Coaching sure didn't hurt, but yeah, the players were the key. As for the Dolphins, you said it yourself. Pennington. Hello. They went from Cleo Lemon and a burnt-out Trent Green to Chad Pennington, protected by Jake Long. The coaching staff made a much bigger impact than just about any other coaching staff in recent memory by absolutely winning that first Pats* game by unveiling a new/old wildcat. How many other coaches change the game like that? Basically none. And even then, the Wildcat was a terrific surprise for two or three games and then defenses figured it out. As for new Fin starters in 2008, I see Lousaka Polite, Camarillo, Davone Bess, Fasano, Jake Long, Justin Smiley, Ndukwe and Vernon Carey, and that's just on offense. On defense, Langford, Traylor, Ferguson, Roth, Ayodele, Goodman, and Yeremiah Bell. So, yeah, players had something to do with that too. I just wanted to make clear that the Dolphins and Jets had the turnaround they had or are viewed as good/solid teams because they changed their attitude, from top to bottom. From FO to the janitor. They found their identity, that is why they believe what they are trying to do. Should I consider Calvin Pace, Litio Sheppard, Jim Leonhard, Marques Douglas, star players? I'm confused if that is what you tried to imply. Granted, they're solid players but the playmakers on that defense are Revis, Jenkins and maybe Harris, he's still developing, he is a good one. One thing is certain about the Jets they have a damn good OL, that is for sure. I don't see the dolphins roster as, wow, what a bunch of talented guys, sure Long is amazing, Carey when fosused can dominate, but he doesn't. Ronnie Brown and Ricky are a nice combo, Bess is clutch. But I don't consider Ayodele or Crowder better than Mitchell or Poz. Bell is a nice player but we have at least two players equally talented or more. If don't feel threatened by their roster. Bottom line, I feel we don't have the worst roster in the NFL, we have very good players accross the board waiting to find a direction, a purpose, will Gailey and Nix deliver? Who knows, so far so good. I would have done some things differently but I believe that they believe in what they are doing and they will give their best to accomplish it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fixxxer Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 and about Bellichick, he's not winning more championships, that is true, but the guy will still field a competitive team, and probably win 10 games a year, because he knows what he's looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 Very witty, I liked that. Hey, you are entitled to you opinion and I will not take that away from you. As a Bills fan, I take my football seriously and maybe a little too seriously. Your point is well taken but I still do worry about the team being successful and winning games. I can't help it.... Mpl a couple of things...... - Its not that you wont take away his opinion you CAN NOT take it.........just like the rest of us cant take away some of your "opinions" even though they at times make my hair hurt. - Second....if you would just approach this season in the way it truly is....you will feel much better. - We dont have a legit left tackle.....Bell or Meradith MIGHT grow into that role but we dont know - Our QB's are horrible...not one franchise one in there...I had hopes for Brohm but it looks like he is giving ground to Edwards....thats bad news. - Our receiving threats with the exception of a couple of guys are young and green - We are installing a brand new defense...... Lets just take this season for what it is.....the coaching staff and players are going to get to know each other......they will probably be picking high enough in the next years draft to get a legit franchise QB in a year of good QB prospects.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 I just wanted to make clear that the Dolphins and Jets had the turnaround they had or are viewed as good/solid teams because they changed their attitude, from top to bottom. From FO to the janitor. They found their identity, that is why they believe what they are trying to do. Miami and the Jets to a lesser extent are what happens when proven football people are permitted to make football decisions. In the case of Miami, the former owner delegated the building of a team to an experienced football guy who had rebuilt multiple teams (cue the diminishing returns crowd). Nix has never done that as the head of football for any team and Gailey hasn't started from the ground floor as a HC either. That's not to say it can't be done, but with a 92 year old owner and an expiring stadium lease, the likelihood of even having another 3 years to rebuild is not there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fixxxer Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 Miami and the Jets to a lesser extent are what happens when proven football people are permitted to make football decisions. In the case of Miami, the former owner delegated the building of a team to an experienced football guy who had rebuilt multiple teams (cue the diminishing returns crowd). Nix has never done that as the head of football for any team and Gailey hasn't started from the ground floor as a HC either. That's not to say it can't be done, but with a 92 year old owner and an expiring stadium lease, the likelihood of even having another 3 years to rebuild is not there. That is your opinion and belief, I gently disagree. Not everything is painted black, and the future is neither black or white, good or bad, it is just uncertain and I would not dare, for better or worse, to speculate about it at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 - Second....if you would just approach this season in the way it truly is....you will feel much better. ... Lets just take this season for what it is.....the coaching staff and players are going to get to know each other......they will probably be picking high enough in the next years draft to get a legit franchise QB in a year of good QB prospects.... I'm with mpl6876. I want to win. We've been rebuilding for going on 6 years now. Enough. We've got the talent. We have holes, but who doesn't? The coaching staff and players need to "get to know each other"? Isn't the what they've been doing for the last 6 months? I think we got a chance to make some serious noise in the AFC East this year. I don't want us to be in a position to "get a legit franchise QB in a year of good QB prospects", I want us to be able to sign a quality FA or trade for a vet and they'll want to come here because we got something going on. I see no reason that we can't play meaningful games well into December this year. If we get some mojo going and the ball bounces our way a little bit, we couldn't be duking it out for the last playoff spot on the last game of the season. Taking a year to "get to know each other" and playing for a good QB in the draft is for losers. I don't think Coach Gailey and Buddy Nix are losers. When Coach Gailey goes out on the field, he doesn't think he's going to win, he expects to win. Or at least what he says anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 I'm with mpl6876. I want to win. We've been rebuilding for going on 6 years now. Enough. We've got the talent. We have holes, but who doesn't? The coaching staff and players need to "get to know each other"? Isn't the what they've been doing for the last 6 months? I think we got a chance to make some serious noise in the AFC East this year. I don't want us to be in a position to "get a legit franchise QB in a year of good QB prospects", I want us to be able to sign a quality FA or trade for a vet and they'll want to come here because we got something going on. I see no reason that we can't play meaningful games well into December this year. If we get some mojo going and the ball bounces our way a little bit, we couldn't be duking it out for the last playoff spot on the last game of the season. Taking a year to "get to know each other" and playing for a good QB in the draft is for losers. I don't think Coach Gailey and Buddy Nix are losers. When Coach Gailey goes out on the field, he doesn't think he's going to win, he expects to win. Or at least what he says anyway. We all want to win....but it is what it is.... We have talent in certain spots that is good enough and in certain spots it is not.......I am usually one of the most optomistic people on this board...... If I have a choice between doing poorly or going 8-8 ish I choose the doing poorly......we dont compete for top free agents and we have need for franchise types in a couple of areas...... I get sick of hearing how badly our QB'd do in PRACTICE....they are doing bad because they are not very good..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpl6876 Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 Mpl a couple of things...... - Its not that you wont take away his opinion you CAN NOT take it.........just like the rest of us cant take away some of your "opinions" even though they at times make my hair hurt. - Second....if you would just approach this season in the way it truly is....you will feel much better. - We dont have a legit left tackle.....Bell or Meradith MIGHT grow into that role but we dont know - Our QB's are horrible...not one franchise one in there...I had hopes for Brohm but it looks like he is giving ground to Edwards....thats bad news. - Our receiving threats with the exception of a couple of guys are young and green - We are installing a brand new defense...... Lets just take this season for what it is.....the coaching staff and players are going to get to know each other......they will probably be picking high enough in the next years draft to get a legit franchise QB in a year of good QB prospects.... Excellent post and I agree with your assessments. Just difficult to go into a season "knowing in my mind" that there is a great likelihood that the Bills aren't going to the playoffs. Kinda sucks but I will look for the positives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 Excellent post and I agree with your assessments. Just difficult to go into a season "knowing in my mind" that there is a great likelihood that the Bills aren't going to the playoffs. Kinda sucks but I will look for the positives. Well if it is any concellation have been and continue to be wrong quite a bit....... At one time I said Aaron Maybin was going to be a stud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 Excellent post and I agree with your assessments. Just difficult to go into a season "knowing in my mind" that there is a great likelihood that the Bills aren't going to the playoffs. Kinda sucks but I will look for the positives. Come on mpl6876, don't got over to the dark side. I'm not going into the season "knowing in my mind" that there is a great likelihood that the Bills aren't going to the playoffs, because I don't know that and neither does anyone else. We won 6 games last year with firing our OC and LT before the season, firing DJ in the middle, so many injuries we had guys we picked up off waivers starting on the OLine etc. That shows we got talent. We got holes, but guess what, so does everyone else. We can do this. We just gotta BILLIEVE !! Go Bills !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyC81 Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 Why I am not so worried about LT situation ? You must be in denial. Any reasonable Bills fan should be and has to be worried about our offensive Line. They might step up and play well but I am worried as hell they won't. It almost like saying as a Bills fan I am not worried about our QB situation. I know you didn't say that. Can someone help me understand how you as a Bills fan are not worried about our OL? Every time it's discussed, I still just can not believe that they "address" the OT position by signing an unimpressive Green and thru the use of 5th (Wang) and 7th rnd picks. Again, Spiller could turn into Chris Johnson & we'll all love the pick but with the OT need, even if u believe in Bell and/or Meredith, at least get somebody like Stafford or Charles Brown in the 2nd round. Worst case is you have great depth. They could've found a very good scatback (versus a great one in Spiller) in the later rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 Every time it's discussed, I still just can not believe that they "address" the OT position by signing an unimpressive Green and thru the use of 5th (Wang) and 7th rnd picks. Again, Spiller could turn into Chris Johnson & we'll all love the pick but with the OT need, even if u believe in Bell and/or Meredith, at least get somebody like Stafford or Charles Brown in the 2nd round. Worst case is you have great depth. They could've found a very good scatback (versus a great one in Spiller) in the later rounds. I prefer 1 great player to 2 mediocre players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGB Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 It is a team game and it is all about the wins. Sure someone might step up and prove to be a good LT. How many people are ready to go to Vegas and bet the house that the Bills make the playoffs with who they have right now and all the changes that they have experienced this year. The odds are not great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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