pBills Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 I just dont understand something...where does the optimism come from with Trent Edwards? Seriously, I cant find a single thing he has done since high school to have the kind of "potential" label and optimism placed on him like it does on this board. I mean even comparison threads to playes elite QBs like Brees come up for him, but his college career was bad and so is his NFL career... So I decided to dig a little bit to see what I was missing. Turns out it just got worse...here are some overlooked facts about Trent...seriously, read these as they are not very encouraging to say the least... Only had more TD's than INTs just ONCE in college (17-7) Only had more TD's than INTS's just ONCE in NFL (11-10) Only had more than 11 TD's in a season ONCE since HIGH SCHOOL Only had a 300 yard game ONCE since HIGH SCHOOL Has ZERO winning seasons since HIGH SCHOOL Has ZERO .500 seasons since High School Has thrown for more than 1 TD only 15 times since HIGH SCHOOL (6 of those were in 1 season at Stanford) Has alomost the same number of games with more than 1 turnover (14 times) in that same span Has ZERO seasons without injury since High School Stanford won just 1 game his last year, and it a game he did NOT play in due to injury. Serous question...where on Earth does the "potential" come from? Why does this guy who was not good in college or the NFL get so many excuses made for him and then players like Lee Evans who were studs in college and started off great in the NFL (until he started catching passes from Trent) get slammed for not catching more imginary passes that dont get thrown to him by this inept QB? Is it the Bill Walsh endorsement? I mean Walsh is the same guy who said Jim Drunkenmiller would be the next great SF QB and that JJ Stokes was going to be the next Rice (even trading up for him)...I mean, he had a great eye and was one of the best, but he was wrong plenty of times. Not to mention had been away from football for a while when he endorsed Trent. Never have I ever seen someone survive so loooonnnnggg on their high school hype, becaue I cant find anything to warrant it from his college career nor NFL career thus far. I get so tired of seeing these posts. Yes, we know people don't like Trent. Really people are going to start judging him by what he did in High School? Everyone here knows that 99% of the Bills problems for the past few years were due to coaching and injuries. So relax and enjoy training camp.
JohnC Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 I get so tired of seeing these posts. Yes, we know people don't like Trent. Really people are going to start judging him by what he did in High School? Everyone here knows that 99% of the Bills problems for the past few years were due to coaching and injuries. So relax and enjoy training camp. Relax, Trent is going to be our starting qb. What most of the critics should be more concerned about is the play of the OL. That is even a bigger question mark. Trent is not going to be the starting qb because he is merely designated by the HC to take the reigns. He will be starting because he will beat out the other two challengers. The people who don't like Trent are going to squawk no matter what. Even if he clearly wins the competition. The truth of the matter is this team has a long way to go before it can be considered a serious team. It is understandable that the qb position is a focal point. There are many more areas which need to be upgraded to make it competitive.
Ronin Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Thanks for the great dig. I love the research you did in exposing Trentative's past. I hope Gailey reads this before he announces the pecking order. Isn't it incumbent upon the scouting staff to research this prior to consuming a day one draft pick on a guy? This was all known long before they picked him.
Ronin Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Is it the Bill Walsh endorsement? I mean Walsh is the same guy who said Jim Drunkenmiller would be the next great SF QB and that JJ Stokes was going to be the next Rice (even trading up for him) Yes. He also said much more favorable things about Mirer back in the day. Great career he had.
DarthICE Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Relax, Trent is going to be our starting qb. What most of the critics should be more concerned about is the play of the OL. That is even a bigger question mark. Trent is not going to be the starting qb because he is merely designated by the HC to take the reigns. He will be starting because he will beat out the other two challengers. The people who don't like Trent are going to squawk no matter what. Even if he clearly wins the competition. The truth of the matter is this team has a long way to go before it can be considered a serious team. It is understandable that the qb position is a focal point. There are many more areas which need to be upgraded to make it competitive. Then this team won't win more than 5 games tops.
Mr. WEO Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Then this team won't win more than 5 games tops. If they do, where do you go?
JohnC Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Then this team won't win more than 5 games tops. Let's get serious here and stop BSing. Whether Trent, BB or Fitz is the starting qb this team is not going to win much more than five games. This is a team with a very hollow roster. If you haven't figured where this team really ranks then you are clueless. As it presently stands the Bills are slightly better than an expansion team. Our OL is suspect. Our DL is suspect. Our LBing core is average at best. Our receiver corps is suspect. Our backfield is three deep, but only two can get meaningful touches. The only high quality unit on this team is its defensive backfield. The Bills are in a multi-year rebuilding process under an owner who is nearly 92 yrs. old. So much for urgency. No matter who is the starting qb the Bills will not make the playoffs. No matter who is the starting qb the Bills will be last in its division. No matter who is the qb the Bills will probably lose more games than they will win. You can neurotically fixate on TE all you want. It is simply a distraction from the present reality of this franchise. This team needs to get better in a lot of places before it can be taken seriously. If you haven't figured that out by now when it is so obvious then that is an issue you have to come to terms with on your own.
CarolinaBill Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 So are you saying that even if the team around him truly sucked, he should be faulted for his "lack of productivity"....because he didn't transfer? And should he just picked up the phone to a top program and say "OK, I've had enough with Stanford. I'm coming next week."? no, what i'm saying is that great players produce, and make those around them better, trent failed to do that. i'm also saying that the excuse of his team sucking is just that, an excuse, he chose stanford, so dont give me that ****, he had his chance at a winning program, and more than likely couldve transferred out if he wanted to be with a winner.
CodeMonkey Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Everyone here knows that 99% of the Bills problems for the past few years were due to coaching and injuries. So relax and enjoy training camp. 99% huh ... well don't count me among "everyone". So if the Bills manage to stay reasonably healthy you must be expecting a playoff appearance this season then. We will see about your coaching hypothesis soon enough I suppose.
Alphadawg7 Posted July 26, 2010 Author Posted July 26, 2010 Did you look that up or did you assume it? 2007: 5-4 (GS) 2008: 7-7 (GS) Thanks for catching that...I updated it. When I was thumbing over his pro stats I missed a couple on the GS. I didnt assume it, I was just going through his game log stats and miss tallied a couple he played in but didnt start.
Alphadawg7 Posted July 26, 2010 Author Posted July 26, 2010 I get so tired of seeing these posts. Yes, we know people don't like Trent. Really people are going to start judging him by what he did in High School? Everyone here knows that 99% of the Bills problems for the past few years were due to coaching and injuries. So relax and enjoy training camp. Huh? This isnt about what he did in high school, its about what he hasnt done since high school where he was a top 5 recruit. The point was that his resume in college in the NFL is not really impressive, so if his resume isnt creating the optimism then what is? All the potential and stuff seems to stem from his grading as a top 5 recruit coming out of HS, so I found that interesting. I just cant think of another player I have ever seen in the NFL really have the optimism follow them this long based on HS accomplishments. And 99% huh? So, only 1% was the collective QB play and the OL? You have to be kidding... Me personally, I cant wait for training camp and will enjoy it. If Chan can turn Trent around, then I will be a happy camper. I dont care if Trent wins the job as long as we dont get the Trent of the last 3 years. If Chan can mold him into a solid QB then I will stand up and cheer. IMHO, I dont think he will because I long lost faith in Trents ability to lead a team, and witth no prior track record to inspire hope I just have a hard time seeing him turn it around.
SuperKillerRobots Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 I've got to admit, I liked T. Edwards when he took over for J.P., and the Walsh endorsement only helped. But, I liked J.P. when he first started, too. Watching T. Edwards last year was, in my opinion, watching the worst play of any QB I've ever seen. It was painful to watch. It was obvious he had some kind of mental problem, fear related, going on. What I liked about him when he started, though, was that despite not doing anything overwhelming, the offense stayed on the field longer, much more so than with J.P., and was consistent - not great, but consistent, and therefor the defense played better. The whole team played much better. It might be that his limitations were found out quickly by opposing defensive coordinators, or that he just fell apart mentally after getting hit too much - I don't know, but I think if he starts this year over a guy who could have potential (in Brohm), then he better play really good, much better than average, because we know what he has, and we've seen him fall apart, and that isn't worth holding someone else back (Brohm) from developing or not. I don't want to have any excuses next offseason for not drafting the top QB - like not having evaluated our guys enough. Either we have a star QB, or we need one. It's that clear to me. I liked the look of him at first too. I think it's presumptive to assume that he was affraid to get hit, which is what was causing him to throw short/checkdown. I think a lot of people don't fully appreciate the pressure he was under being a young starting QB running a new offense for a team with unreasonably large expectations and with a coaching staff that probably wasn't qualified to be in that position. I also think he was having troubel dealing twith the treat of being pulled from any of those games. It's not easy to take chances when one mistake could get you pulled or demoted for good. Obviously there are flip sides to these arguments, so I'm not trying to say that he's a great QB who was the victim of poor circumstances. In the end, I'm just saying it's tough to draw any conclusion fromt he way he played last year.
Adam Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 I just dont understand something...where does the optimism come from with Trent Edwards? Seriously, I cant find a single thing he has done since high school to have the kind of "potential" label and optimism placed on him like it does on this board. I mean even comparison threads to playes elite QBs like Brees come up for him, but his college career was bad and so is his NFL career... So I decided to dig a little bit to see what I was missing. Turns out it just got worse...here are some overlooked facts about Trent...seriously, read these as they are not very encouraging to say the least... Only had more TD's than INTs just ONCE in college (17-7) Only had more TD's than INTS's just ONCE in NFL (11-10) Only had more than 11 TD's in a season ONCE since HIGH SCHOOL Only had a 300 yard game ONCE since HIGH SCHOOL Never had a winning season or .500 season in college Has thrown for more than 1 TD only 15 times since HIGH SCHOOL (6 of those were in 1 season at Stanford) Has alomost the same number of games with more than 1 turnover (14 times) in that same span Has ZERO seasons without injury since High School Stanford won just 1 game his last year, and it a game he did NOT play in due to injury. Serous question...where on Earth does the "potential" come from? Why does this guy who was not good in college or the NFL get so many excuses made for him and then players like Lee Evans who were studs in college and started off great in the NFL (until he started catching passes from Trent) get slammed for not catching more imginary passes that dont get thrown to him by this inept QB? Is it the Bill Walsh endorsement? I mean Walsh is the same guy who said Jim Drunkenmiller would be the next great SF QB and that JJ Stokes was going to be the next Rice (even trading up for him)...I mean, he had a great eye and was one of the best, but he was wrong plenty of times. Not to mention had been away from football for a while when he endorsed Trent. Never have I ever seen someone survive so loooonnnnggg on their high school hype, becaue I cant find anything to warrant it from his college career nor NFL career thus far. Alpha- don't read into stats so much. If your eyes tell you he is a good QB, believe them. If they tell you he isn't, then go with that too. Stats are based on the talent level of the team. You know the game well enough to know what you are watching.
Alphadawg7 Posted July 26, 2010 Author Posted July 26, 2010 Alpha- don't read into stats so much. If your eyes tell you he is a good QB, believe them. If they tell you he isn't, then go with that too. Stats are based on the talent level of the team. You know the game well enough to know what you are watching. I definitely hear ya...I was just searching for something to substantiate the optimism because I thought I was missing something. This was actually brought on because of some Evans bashing that was going on. It was just mind boggling that a guy who produced at a high level in college and a high level to start his NFL career doesnt get any breaks for his struggles while catching passes from struggling QBs...then to see threads for a guy with a poor NFL resume and marginal college resume having excuses after excuse made for him.
ExiledInIllinois Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Anybody mention the late great Bill Walsh?
CarolinaBill Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 Anybody mention the late great Bill Walsh? yes, and druckenmiller, and rick mirer. Bill walsh was a great coach, but he got this one flat wrong.
ChasBB Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 I'm really hoping it can all be chalked up to very poor coaching. This is Edward's LAST chance to prove himself IMO. If he does not shine this year, I think the TE experiment must come to a close.
Adam Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 I'm really hoping it can all be chalked up to very poor coaching. This is Edward's LAST chance to prove himself IMO. If he does not shine this year, I think the TE experiment must come to a close. I fail to see a lot of examples of poor coaching. Over the last three seasons, I think we have really overachieved. A lot of fans really overestimate the talent level of the team. Parrish and Schobel aren't exactly Reed and Bruce......results bear that out with a number of different coaches
ExiledInIllinois Posted July 26, 2010 Posted July 26, 2010 yes, and druckenmiller, and rick mirer. Bill walsh was a great coach, but he got this one flat wrong. He was ill and suffering too...
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