NASA (Not About Space Anymore)

[TheMadCap]

Wow. Those idiots there make our idiots here look coherent in comparison.

 

 

heh, yeah, but I take them all with a grain of salt, and do get a chuckle out of both...

[Adam]

The majority doesn't matter too much if your head is rolling down a flight of stairs.

It hasn't so far.....

[OCinBuffalo]

I will relay that to all of my Muslim friends and hope they don't try to convert or kill me. The real world isn't black and white and you can't paint a minority of idiots (terrorists) into the majority, nor can you say what that idiot did to the doctor in Kansas City a year or two represents the will of Christians.

 

I am sure you won't believe this, since you think everything is black and white, but a good number of Nazis actually helped Jews to escape concentration camps before their executions.

 

By the way- those "Users Manuals" have actual names.........but I guess it isn't just Muslims, you just disrespect everyone.

Nothing you have said here is relevant to my point. The only thing we have is what is written down in these sacred(feel better?) books. So, please understand, I am not talking in terms of black and white....I am merely referring to the books themselves, and if they see some things in black and white, and others not so definitively, then so be it, none of that has anything to do with me, or my point.

 

The simple fact is: you will not find instructions on who to kill and how coming from Jesus Christ.

The simple fact is: you will find both of these things coming from Mohamed.

 

Babble all you want, try to make this about me, instead of my point, when you get done, this two facts will remain as they are: undeniable.

There we go again- blame the politician. Obama and Bush are the type of politician that America calls for. It isn't a conservative or liberal issue- it is American society. They appoint these figurehead leaders and blame them when things aren't perfect. America acts like they want a monarchy, so one leader has the power to fix everything and takes the blame when it doesn't work out.

Speak for yourself, please. I never, ever, ever am going to subscribe to this point of view, nor will I ever be ok with sub-standard leadership coming from the President, regardless of party. You want to criticize Bush for making mistakes(Iraq), fine, just make sure you give him credit for doing something about them(the Surge). I am merely suggesting that we hold the same standards for Obama that were set for Bush.

 

You know one difference between a King and a President? The King doesn't get to choose whether he wants the job, the President does. Obama wanted the job, and now he either needs to do it, properly, or he needs to seek life elsewhere.

[OCinBuffalo]

Actually, being a little more open-minded and level headed; I prefer to wait until I actually see NASA's list of priorities on some official document before I jump off the bridge and stoke the fires of a good rant. I can tell you this though... the guy was giving an interview on an all the time, pro muslim news station. Would you expect anything less than a lot of glowing praise for muslims?

 

I know from first hand experience that press releases and interviews are almost always scripted and tailored for a specific audience, message, even specific time and place. And that script will very often change from day to day depending upon the circumstances and audience you're targeting. So, it's very likely, almost a certainty, that he was given a very precise script on what to say - regardless of any official policy.

 

Now did he go too far with his language and statments. In our eyes, yes. In the muslim world, I'd guess no.

 

Oh and by the way, I think the trap has long since snapped shut.

Now it's about how the message is constructed, and not the message itself? WTF? Again, we aren't talking about some peripheral nuance here. Were are talking about the PRIORITIES of NASA as set by the President, and you don't localize the friggin mission statement of NASA to suit a bunch of people who will have exactly 0 bearing and relevance on its operations. Again, this is an example of bad leadership, and frankly? This is ego-maniacal hubris, as in: "I am so big, my political agenda goes everywhere, even in places others' can't, like NASA".

 

This is retarded, and you know it, and I am starting to think that you are simply making excuses for voting for Obama. The fact that he is saying this to Al Jeezera makes it worse, not better, and certainly doesn't provide a rational explanation as to why the #1 priority of NASA has been changed.

 

So, last time around you wanted to focus us on giving Obama credit for handling the last 10% of the problem properly. What "nuance" are we all missing this time? Muslims did a good job holding onto the science the West gave them before the Dark Ages, and then got back from them after, so what? The need to "make them feel good about it" is the most condescending thing I have heard from this Administration, or any, in my life time.

 

About the trap: I suppose it would make sense if you made up your mind whether it was big, or small, first. Traps actually have to exist, for people to fall into them. This trap, and the reasons you voted for Obama, are figments of your imagination.

[ieatcrayonz]

It hasn't so far.....

Good. Because you don't get two chances.

[Adam]

Nothing you have said here is relevant to my point. The only thing we have is what is written down in these sacred(feel better?) books. So, please understand, I am not talking in terms of black and white....I am merely referring to the books themselves, and if they see some things in black and white, and others not so definitively, then so be it, none of that has anything to do with me, or my point.

 

The simple fact is: you will not find instructions on who to kill and how coming from Jesus Christ.

The simple fact is: you will find both of these things coming from Mohamed.

 

Babble all you want, try to make this about me, instead of my point, when you get done, this two facts will remain as they are: undeniable.

 

Speak for yourself, please. I never, ever, ever am going to subscribe to this point of view, nor will I ever be ok with sub-standard leadership coming from the President, regardless of party. You want to criticize Bush for making mistakes(Iraq), fine, just make sure you give him credit for doing something about them(the Surge). I am merely suggesting that we hold the same standards for Obama that were set for Bush.

 

You know one difference between a King and a President? The King doesn't get to choose whether he wants the job, the President does. Obama wanted the job, and now he either needs to do it, properly, or he needs to seek life elsewhere.

People have killed in the name of Jesus Christ and still do- as a matter of fact, wasn't he killed by his eventual followers? The fact is that the majority of Christians and Muslims are good people, but are besmirched by psychotic killers. If people actually realized this, the war on terror would be a lot easier to fight.

 

I think Bush is a good man who got some bad advice. the majority of people just want to simplify things and place blame on one person- which makes it easy- replace that one problem and everything is fixed. I prefer to look at our government as a whole and judge the entire thing.

[Magox]

My father has the same belief that OC does, that somehow the Muslim religion is a violent one and that the Christian religion isn't. Sorry, but the facts don't support this argument. For !@#$ing crying out loud, what about the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, and there many many more examples?

 

It all depends on how you interpret the writings of man. Some people see it one way, others see another way. Just like in any society, you have moderates and fringe lunatics, fringe lunatics are in the lime light because that's what gets covered by the media, and then somehow people categorize that religion or group with the fringe lunatics . The reality is that most of these religions were founded to provide guidance, direction and a form of "better" living. Unfortunately there are some parts of these writings that don't fall under the mainstream, but we have to understand that they were written by man. Which means that it may be possible that the person who wrote that part of those writings may have been off kilter, couple that with some wacko's interpretation, next thing you know, The Spanish Inquisition or some nutjob ramming a plane into the Towers.

[OCinBuffalo]

And why is there a "New" Testament? Did "God" suddenly feel the need to censure himself? Nope. There is a "New Testament" because of changes in politics and philosophy. The Inquisition. What a show.

Which does nothing to detract from my point. Whether you like the New/Old Testament, the Koran, None of the Above, etc. doesn't change the fact that the material is in written form. It's in black and white, and no, Adam, I am not the one who chose to put in black and white, the authors did.

 

The words are the words, and words mean things. You want to tell me that the message of Jesus Christ is the same as the message of Mohamed? Go blow that right out your azz.

Good thing you're not a total hypocrite, "Islam is a religion of violence" guy.

Good thing you only want to play the "nuance" game when it suits you, only when it's a convenient way to concoct yet another single sentence response, "ALL religion is 100% bad, but, there's nuance in science" guy.

I don't give a flying crap what you "think".

And I don't give a flying crap what you "think". See, I can do it too.

History is rife with "Christians" killing in the name of their God.

History is rife with Communists killing in the name of their God. So what? How does this disprove that one book says "do unto others" and another books says "kill the infidel wherever you find him". It doesn't, and it's a sorry-assed excuse for an argument. Stop arguing against what I am not saying.

I'm sure the Muslims are sorry that they didn't get on that bandwagon a little sooner. Congratulations on your religion of choice losing it's overwhelming influence and the violence that goes with it a few hundred years earlier than the others. That's a big win because now you can pretend your flying spaghetti monster is wicked superior.

You mean to tell me you missed the point? After all this you don't even get what I am saying do you? For the last time: I would never dare to hold one religion as "superior" over another, on this board, or anywhere else, even if I became convinced that was the case, which I haven't been, btw.

 

Please don't extrapolate my argument and then start arguing against what I haven't said.

 

All I am saying is the same thing I said to Adam:

 

The simple fact is: you will not find instructions on who to kill and how coming from Jesus Christ.

The simple fact is: you will find both of these things coming from Mohamed.

 

Babble all you want, try to make this about me, instead of my point, when you get done, this two facts will remain as they are: undeniable.

[Adam]

Which does nothing to detract from my point. Whether you like the New/Old Testament, the Koran, None of the Above, etc. doesn't change the fact that the material is in written form. It's in black and white, and no, Adam, I am not the one who chose to put in black and white, the authors did.

 

The words are the words, and words mean things. You want to tell me that the message of Jesus Christ is the same as the message of Mohamed? Go blow that right out your azz.

The only thing that is undeniable is that people don't live by a book- that is ludicrous. People are good or bad on their own merits.

 

Did Jesus Christ teach people to torture and murder him in cold blood?

[OCinBuffalo]

People have killed in the name of Jesus Christ and still do- as a matter of fact, wasn't he killed by his eventual followers? The fact is that the majority of Christians and Muslims are good people, but are besmirched by psychotic killers. If people actually realized this, the war on terror would be a lot easier to fight.

That is a fact, but again, it has nothing to do with my point.

 

Since you are such a fan of nuance, let's do it this way: How far do I have to deviate from the teachings of Jesus Christ if I kill a Muslim neighbor? How far do I have to deviate from the teachings of Mohamed if I kill a Christian neighbor?

 

Get it? Killing your neighbor is 180 out of what Jesus said = "love thy neighbor".

-vs-

"Make war on the infidels living in your neighboorhood".

 

Just ask Darin: the above statements are the exact same thing.

 

These are the words that were chosen. Words mean things. There is not "context" excuses here. These words are instructive, and therefore, mean what they say. You have to bastardize the teaching of Jesus to justify killing people. Mohamed? Nope.

I think Bush is a good man who got some bad advice. the majority of people just want to simplify things and place blame on one person- which makes it easy- replace that one problem and everything is fixed. I prefer to look at our government as a whole and judge the entire thing.

So, you are a real "black and white" kind of guy? When it comes to government? or all the time? I thought you were about looking a nuance?

[Adam]

That is a fact, but again, it has nothing to do with my point.

 

Since you are such a fan of nuance, let's do it this way: How far do I have to deviate from the teachings of Jesus Christ if I kill a Muslim neighbor? How far do I have to deviate from the teachings of Mohamed if I kill a Christian neighbor?

 

Get it? Killing your neighbor is 180 out of what Jesus said = "love thy neighbor".

-vs-

"Make war on the infidels living in your neighboorhood".

 

Just ask Darin: the above statements are the exact same thing.

 

These are the words that were chosen. Words mean things. There is not "context" excuses here. These words are instructive, and therefore, mean what they say. You have to bastardize the teaching of Jesus to justify killing people. Mohamed? Nope.

 

So, you are a real "black and white" kind of guy? When it comes to government? or all the time? I thought you were about looking a nuance?

I really pity you

[OCinBuffalo]

The only thing that is undeniable is that people don't live by a book- that is ludicrous. People are good or bad on their own merits.

 

Did Jesus Christ teach people to torture and murder him in cold blood?

Irrelevant to my point, still.

 

There are a whole lot of people who "live by the book". Whether that is a good thing, or a bad thing, comes down to their actions. Period. If one book says its OK to kill people who don't agree with you, and another says, THE EXACT OPPOSITE, then we can assume that the people who live by the first's actions will tend to be violent and immoral, and the second's?

 

Well, anybody can bastardize anything. I suppose I could code viruses that would go after Microsoft, and find justification for that in an old programming textbook that instructs programmers to test their code before they deliver it. It wouldn't change the fact that my actions are those of a d-bag, and that the author of the text book in no way intended it be used that way.

 

The difference is clear. One book literally instructs followers to kill, the other doesn't.

[OCinBuffalo]

I really pity you

nah, you just can't argue with the logic. And you know it. Oh, and way to, again, lamely try to make this about me and not the clear logic that is confronting you.

[Adam]

nah, you just can't argue with the logic. And you know it.

You can't argue with fact. The majority of muslims are not terrorists. You are a biggot, plain and simple.

[OCinBuffalo]

My father has the same belief that OC does, that somehow the Muslim religion is a violent one and that the Christian religion isn't. Sorry, but the facts don't support this argument. For !@#$ing crying out loud, what about the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, and there many many more examples?

 

It all depends on how you interpret the writings of man. Some people see it one way, others see another way. Just like in any society, you have moderates and fringe lunatics, fringe lunatics are in the lime light because that's what gets covered by the media, and then somehow people categorize that religion or group with the fringe lunatics . The reality is that most of these religions were founded to provide guidance, direction and a form of "better" living. Unfortunately there are some parts of these writings that don't fall under the mainstream, but we have to understand that they were written by man. Which means that it may be possible that the person who wrote that part of those writings may have been off kilter, couple that with some wacko's interpretation, next thing you know, The Spanish Inquisition or some nutjob ramming a plane into the Towers.

Again, there is no literal "go kill people in your neighborhood" coming from Jesus. Clearly, that is literally stated by Mohamed.

 

I am merely trying to make that distinction as plain as the words themselves.

 

Every single thing you are referring to is a bastardization of what Jesus taught. The same simply cannot be said for what Mohamed wrote. It's really not that hard to see the clear difference, unless, you are intentionally trying to ignore the words that were used, and prefer to paint with a 10 ft. brush.

[OCinBuffalo]

You can't argue with fact. The majority of muslims are not terrorists. You are a biggot, plain and simple.

Laughable. First of all I never said anything of the kind. Your characterization is as accurate as your spelling.

 

Try using your head, and not your knee, re-read what I am saying and actually think about it.

[Adam]

Laughable. First of all I never said anything of the kind. Your characterization is as accurate as your spelling.

 

Try using your head, and not your knee, re-read what I am saying and actually think about it.

Yes, you care about what is written and you want to judge people by what was written thousands of years before they were born- something that was neither written by Jesus Christ nor the Prophet Mohammed.

[Magox]

Again, there is no literal "go kill people in your neighborhood" coming from Jesus. Clearly, that is literally stated by Mohamed.

 

I am merely trying to make that distinction as plain as the words themselves.

 

Every single thing you are referring to is a bastardization of what Jesus taught. The same simply cannot be said for what Mohamed wrote. It's really not that hard to see the clear difference, unless, you are intentionally trying to ignore the words that were used, and prefer to paint with a 10 ft. brush.

Right, there was no such thing as an "Eye for an Eye" in the Old testament. Ok

[OCinBuffalo]

Right, there was no such thing as an "Eye for an Eye" in the Old testament. Ok

The Old testament is not "coming from Jesus". Jesus Christ, are you guys even trying today?

[Dan]

The simple fact is: you will not find instructions on who to kill and how coming from Jesus Christ.

The simple fact is: you will find both of these things coming from Mohamed.

Are you absolutely certain that there are no references to killing unfaithful people in the Bible? Seriously?

 

 

 

Now it's about how the message is constructed, and not the message itself? WTF? Again, we aren't talking about some peripheral nuance here. Were are talking about the PRIORITIES of NASA as set by the President, and you don't localize the friggin mission statement of NASA to suit a bunch of people who will have exactly 0 bearing and relevance on its operations. Again, this is an example of bad leadership, and frankly? This is ego-maniacal hubris, as in: "I am so big, my political agenda goes everywhere, even in places others' can't, like NASA".

From Reagan, 1985, referring to our long term cold war enemy:

"In science and technology, we could launch new joint space ventures and establish joint medical research projects."

 

So was Reagan a bad leader because he advocated that we exchange many more of our citizens from fraternal, religious, educational, and cultural groups. Or when he suggested the exchange of thousands of undergraduates each year, and even younger students who would live with a host family and attend schools or summer camps. That our two countries look to increased scholarship programs, improve language studies, conduct courses in history, culture, and other subjects.

 

Why was he pandering to the communists? Was Reagan really a closet commie? Or was he just a bad leader that had no idea how to defeat our enemy? I think the evidence there is quite conclusive, he was.