Wells Fargo rant...

[Buftex]

So, I have been banking with Wells Fargo for 19 years. This bank has gotten progressively worse by the year. Anyone else bank with them?

 

Now, mind you, I am an insignificant customer to Wells Fargo, as I don't deal in high finances, and have very moderate income. This weekend, I think, is my final straw with this bank.

 

On Friday, I needed to deposit a check, part of which would cover my rent check.

 

As I was at work, I couldn't make it to the bank until about 5pm, the branch is closed. I go through a drive-thru ATM, to make the deposit, as I have done 100's of times before. This time, there is a catch. There are no deposit envelopes in the dispensary. No big deal, I will go to another machine. Second machine, no envelopes. Christ, I think, what are these people up to? I go to another machine, three envelopes, all sealed by humidity of the hot sun. I go to a fourth machine, out of order...it is pouring rain outside, and getting late. I had somewhere to be. I figured, ok no problem, it is a holiday weekend, nothing is going to happen with my rent check before the weekend is over.

 

Saturday morning, I go back to one of the same ATM machines, figuring, maybe someone has filled the envelope dispenser up again. No such luck. Rather than try the other two again, I go to another machine I have not tried yet, a bit out of my way, but I really wanted to get this check deposited.

 

I drive up to the machine, put my card in. I check my balance, on screen, before making my deposit. It asks me if I want another transaction. I press "Deposit with envelope"...nothing happens. I press it a few times, nothing...it is all touch screen. After about 20 seconds, I am asked if I "need more time"? I try "yes"...no response. Then, I get a message that my card will be confiscated if I don't make a selection. I tried "return card"...no response...you guessed it, it ate my card. Now, I am stuck with $29 in my pocket to get through a holiday weekend, no ATM card.

 

I drive around to the bank entrance (the bank is closed) and it says that the bank is closed on July 4th, for independence day. No ****, I think to myself, banks are always closed on Sunday. Are they open Monday?

 

I had to get to work, so, when I get home, I check the Wells Fargo web-site, to find out their hours. No luck. It only says that they are closed for Independence Day, no mention of the date.

 

Monday morning, I call the bank "Customer Service" line, and hold for 12 minutes, as they are "experiencing an unusually high volume of calls", something their Customer Service line always claims. I should also mention, I first called the branch where my card was eaten, but no answer, no voice message explaining that they were or were not open.

 

Anyways, a girl gets on, and can't answer a simple question like "are the banks open today?" until I give her my account number. I also have to give her the last 4 digits of my SSN#. She then starts reading to me the official bank holiday schedule. I thank her, and, in a calm manner, tell her that I am pretty unhappy with the service that the bank has been giving, particularly in the last three years or so. Her response, in a pleasant robot voice "Thank you. I am glad I could help you today." I don't know why, but that just pissed me off more than anything. I hung up...

 

Sorry for the rant...I realize malfunctioning equipment, is something you can't necessarily blame on somebody, but this is just the latest in frustrating episodes that I have had with Wells Fargo... they seem more and more out of touch with the human race.

 

Anyone have a bank that they are happy with? I realize this is likely a silly question, but I have accepted that banks are a necessary evil. Unfortunately, my current employer, a small independent business, does not offer direct deposit.

[The Dean]

I switched to using Credit Unions years ago, and its made a huge difference in my frustration level with baking institutions. I have used CUs in WNY, Long Island, SF and now Florida. I find them to be very friendly and helpful. The tellers know my name, even though I rarely have to go inside.

 

The downside of CUs (for me, at least) used to be the dearth of ATM's that I could use for no charge. That has changed quite a bit over the past few years. Now there are plenty of no-charge ATM's I can use all over the country.

 

Of course you should be as careful when picking a CU as you would be in selecting a bank. Do some research, compare their services, fees, hours, etc. Talk to some friends and see if they are happy with who they use, etc.

[Chilly]

In my experience, CU's are a pain in the ass for checking. Online banking sucks, customer service can be limited (not 24/7) because of the lack of resources, annoying policies, can't use all of the teller services except at their branches, etc. That's one big reason why I like Bank of America for my checking.

 

That being said, I love my credit union for my loan.

[Rubes]

I've been a WF customer for about 11 years now. I've been pretty happy with the service in general. The branch and ATM is a quick walk from my house, and the online banking is, IMO, very good. I've had similar problems with empty deposit envelope containers, but it hasn't happened in a while. Other than that, no complaints.

 

We refinanced our home with them last year and got a great rate...better than we could get with the local credit union nearby.

[The Dean]

In my experience, CU's are a pain in the ass for checking. Online banking sucks, customer service can be limited (not 24/7) because of the lack of resources, annoying policies, can't use all of the teller services except at their branches, etc. That's one big reason why I like Bank of America for my checking.

 

That being said, I love my credit union for my loan.

 

 

My CU has the best checking I have ever had. 7.5% interest up to $500, then down to a normal rate. No minimum, No fees. Bank is open until 5pm M-Th and Saturday, til 6PM on Friday. I can use teller services at any CU that has a CU Service Center (over 4,000 locations nationwide). I haven't encountered any "annoying policies" at my CU, but maybe yours has some.

 

I have online banking and bill pay that seems to have all the capabilities of my mother's BOA online account. However, there may be services missing that I don't use.

[linksfiend]

http://moveyourmoney.info/

[Albany,n.y.]

I bank with SEFCU & have been pretty happy. Last month I moved some money into a CD & got charged a $15 fee for being under a required balance on the account I closed. It took about a minute on the phone to get the $15 back into my account. Around here SEFCU has many locations, including at a supermarket 2 miles from my house. They have Saturday & Sunday hours at that branch. In the past I've been able to borrow money from them easily. I opened an account with them 12 years ago & got an unsecured loan for over $14,000 the next day, I had never banked with them before that. When it came time to buy a new car 10 years ago, I got pre-approved for over $30,000 & had no problems with my car purchase. Also got a mortgage 7 years ago that was easy too-however, I locked into a rate that I got stuck with after rates went down between the lock-in & the closing date. Checking is easy too. I can go on-line and transfer $ between accounts with the click of a mouse.

[Phlegm Alley]

I bank at TD Bank and I couldn't be happier. They are open 7 days a week and open until 8pm Monday-Friday, 7pm on Sat, and 5pm on Sunday.

 

The hours a bank keeps is the most important reason why I bank there.

[The Tomcat]

In the future, put some extra emergency envelopes in your glove box. This will pay off more then you think.

[The Dean]

In the future, put some extra emergency envelopes in your glove box. This will pay off more then you think.

 

 

Another thing about my CU that I like. No envelope needed to deposit at their ATM.

[Chilly]

My CU has the best checking I have ever had. 7.5% interest up to $500, then down to a normal rate. No minimum, No fees.

 

Yep, that's what CU's are good for: great rates.

 

Bank is open until 5pm M-Th and Saturday, til 6PM on Friday.

 

Do they have phone support after those hours? If you're traveling and something happens after that time, can you call them? I know with a couple CUs I've dealt with, I can't.

 

I can use teller services at any CU that has a CU Service Center (over 4,000 locations nationwide). I haven't encountered any "annoying policies" at my CU, but maybe yours has some.

 

Me too, but those teller services are heavily limited. They can only provide limited amounts of cash when cashing checks, for example. My girlfriend's ran into this more than I have, as she uses the credit union as her primary checking account, but it's been pretty inconvenient for her (she uses a CU based out of Austin, but lives in San Antonio). Lots of restrictions on that network.

 

Last year, over 4th of July weekend, we decided to spend the weekend at South Padre Island, TX at the beach. We were leaving, and I swung by the ATM on the way to pull out some cash. As I was wrapping up, an elderly lady asked me the time, and I left my debit card in the ATM.

 

Once we got to Corpus Christi (a few hours away), we stopped for lunch. I went to pay, saw my card was missing from my wallet, and realized immediately what happened. I looked up the nearest Bank of America branch on the phone, saw it was only a few miles away, and drove over there.

 

Unfortunately, all the big bank's computer networks have problems talking to each other (it's a complicated history of mergers and acquisitions that pretty much every large bank has). So, they couldn't just give me a temporary debit card. However, instead, they opened up a brand new checking account for me right then and there (with nice Longhorns themed checks & card). She then spent the time looking through my account history to make sure we knew all my recurring payments, added some buffer money to that, and transferred the remaining of my cash to the new account. They issued me a new temporary debit card that worked with the new account until my real debit card arrived, immediately canceled my old card, and give me a hotdog, cookies, and soda for my trouble.

 

They also left my old account open until my first direct deposit went through on the new account, so I wouldn't have to worry about my paychecks bouncing.

 

Credit Unions don't have the resources to do something like that. When I was 3 hours out of my trip, my options would have been to drive back to San Antonio (at which point all the credit unions would have been closed anyhow) or not be able to use my debit/ATM card for the rest of the trip. Neither would have been very good options.

 

Another example: I was in Vegas in April, and pulled out a bunch of money from an ATM late at night. BoA flagged this as suspicious (which is correct - I'm far from home, pulling out a significant amount of cash - something I never do, and it's at a god-awful hour). Within a minute after the ATM transaction, they sent me an email saying they locked my account for suspicious activity, which I got on my Blackberry. I immediately called them up, and within 2 minutes they had re-activated my card and put a trip notice on my account for the rest of the trip so it wouldn't get flagged again. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have been able to get in contact with a credit union at midnight, if they even had taken the precaution to turn off the card.

 

I have online banking and bill pay that seems to have all the capabilities of my mother's BOA online account. However, there may be services missing that I don't use.

 

My experience with my credit union's online banking is that the interface is confusing, it's not very polished, the numbers aren't exactly "real-time" like Bank of America's is, it takes several days to process anything you submit (instead of it being instant like Bank of America), and other small convenience problems.

[Buftex]

In the future, put some extra emergency envelopes in your glove box. This will pay off more then you think.

 

I always used to have some in there...but I ran out, and somehow, forgot to get more. I used to keep them there just to save time, more than anything.

[Chilly]

Another thing about my CU that I like. No envelope needed to deposit at their ATM.

 

Yeah, same at Bank of America. It's pretty sweet - they even print the images of the checks you deposit on the receipts. They have handwriting recognition in the ATMs that automatically reads the amounts so you don't have to type it in, and Cash in the ATM is essentially an instant deposit into your account.

[DrFishfinder]

I switched from WaMu to Wachovia about 4 years ago. WaMu was the epitome of "bad service." I could go on for paragraphs in excruciating detail, regaling you with the innumerable ways they demonstrated their utter contempt for customers.

 

One day, I received an expense check from work that was from Wachovia. I went to a local branch and great googly moogly, what a night and day difference. They had me at a window in about 30 seconds, and I am not kidding here.....actually apologized for making me wait. Whereas at WaMu, I would regularly see tellers close their windows and sneer at the 25 people standing in line as they strutted off to pick nose goblins or think up new ways to ignore customers. I've been with Wachovia ever since and have received the same great customer service....I would say 95% of the time, no matter which branch I happen to be at.

 

That being said, I sure hope WF doesn't screw this up because they sure have the potential to.

[The Dean]

Yep, that's what CU's are good for: great rates.

 

 

 

Do they have phone support after those hours? If you're traveling and something happens after that time, can you call them? I know with a couple CUs I've dealt with, I can't.

 

 

 

Me too, but those teller services are heavily limited. They can only provide limited amounts of cash when cashing checks, for example. My girlfriend's ran into this more than I have, as she uses the credit union as her primary checking account, but it's been pretty inconvenient for her (she uses a CU based out of Austin, but lives in San Antonio). Lots of restrictions on that network.

 

Last year, over 4th of July weekend, we decided to spend the weekend at South Padre Island, TX at the beach. We were leaving, and I swung by the ATM on the way to pull out some cash. As I was wrapping up, an elderly lady asked me the time, and I left my debit card in the ATM.

 

Once we got to Corpus Christi (a few hours away), we stopped for lunch. I went to pay, saw my card was missing from my wallet, and realized immediately what happened. I looked up the nearest Bank of America branch on the phone, saw it was only a few miles away, and drove over there.

 

Unfortunately, all the big bank's computer networks have problems talking to each other (it's a complicated history of mergers and acquisitions that pretty much every large bank has). So, they couldn't just give me a temporary debit card. However, instead, they opened up a brand new checking account for me right then and there (with nice Longhorns themed checks & card). She then spent the time looking through my account history to make sure we knew all my recurring payments, added some buffer money to that, and transferred the remaining of my cash to the new account. They issued me a new temporary debit card that worked with the new account until my real debit card arrived, immediately canceled my old card, and give me a hotdog for my trouble.

 

They also left my old account open until my first direct deposit went through on the new account, so I wouldn't have to worry about my paychecks bouncing.

 

Credit Union's don't have the resources to do something like that. When I was 3 hours out of my trip, my options would have been to drive back to San Antonio (at which point all the credit unions would have been closed anyhow) or not be able to use my debit/ATM card for the rest of the trip. Neither would have been very good options.

 

Another example: I was in Vegas in April, and pulled out a bunch of money from an ATM late at night. BoA flagged this as suspicious (which is correct - I'm far from home, pulling out a significant amount of cash - something I never do, and it's at a god-awful hour). I called them up, and within 2 minutes they had re-activated my card and put a trip notice on my account for the rest of the trip so it wouldn't get flagged again. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have been able to get in contact with a credit union at midnight, if they even had taken the precaution to turn off the card.

 

 

 

My experience with my credit union's online banking is that the interface is confusing, it's not very polished, the numbers aren't exactly "real-time" like Bank of America's is, it takes several days to process anything you submit (instead of it being instant like Bank of America), and other small convenience problems.

 

 

You can get $500 from a CU Service Center Teller, plus whatever you can take from an ATM. That has always worked out for me.

 

There is a 24-hour emergency telephone number for reporting lost/stolen cards. Dunno about the procedure for replacement, though. As for getting flagged, and having it lifted, I have no idea. Something to research for someone considering moving their $$, though.

 

Bill pay seems to be the same, as far as real-time transactions, as BOA's bill pay. The GI isn't as fancy, but it gets the job done.

 

I even get a personal telephone reminder from a CU employee if a loan, or overdraft, isn't paid right away. They try to get a hold of you before any fee incurs to remind you of the due date. Very nice, IMO.

 

I'm sure there are advantages and disadvantages, depending on the CU and bank you use. But to me the advantages of very personal service (at a CU you get treated like a real customer, in my experience) and low/no fees far outweighs any negative I might encounter down the road. Like I said, I have used both and will never go back to a huge national bank.

[Nanker]

In the future, put some extra emergency envelopes in your glove box. This will pay off more then you think.

Also, drug stores sell #10 envelopes. I'm sure the bank's ATM would accept that.

Bummer though. Nothing quite like feeling you're getting drubbed on by a faceless monolith that has your money and you by the short and curlies. I bank with the former Wachovia - now WF. I can't wait for the fun to begin.

[Chilly]

You can get $500 from a CU Service Center Teller, plus whatever you can take from an ATM. That has always worked out for me.

 

The ATM withdrawls aren't always useful. One scenario that my girlfriend ran into was I wrote her a $1500 check. She wanted to take out $700, and put the rest in her checking account. As you said, they limited her to $500. She didn't want to pull the other $200 out of her checking account, as it can take a while for checks cached at affiliated credit unions to clear. She had no choice, though, because of the low teller limits.

 

There is a 24-hour emergency telephone number for reporting lost/stolen cards. Dunno about the procedure for replacement, though. As for getting flagged, and having it lifted, I have no idea. Something to research for someone considering moving their $$, though.

 

Yep, there's the 24-hour emergency number, but they wouldn't have been able to give me a replacement card within 30 minutes of me calling. Best scenario was I would have had to drive to my Credit Union to pick it up (a 3+ hour drive and they would have been closed), or go without it for the weekend.

 

Bill pay seems to be the same, as far as real-time transactions, as BOA's bill pay. The GI isn't as fancy, but it gets the job done.

 

That's because "Online Billpay" is just a fancy word for "fill out a form to send someone a check". I was more referring to the accounting procedures - if I make a transaction with my debit card, at the ATM, or teller services, I can immediately see the transaction online.

 

I even get a personal telephone reminder from a CU employee if a loan, or overdraft, isn't paid right away. They try to get a hold of you before any fee incurs to remind you of the due date. Very nice, IMO.

 

The personal touch is nice, for sure, but I don't think that's all that different from Bank of America sending me an email when my credit card bill with them is due.

 

I'm sure there are advantages and disadvantages, depending on the CU and bank you use. But to me the advantages of very personal service (at a CU you get treated like a real customer, in my experience) and low/no fees far outweighs any negative I might encounter down the road. Like I said, I have used both and will never go back to a huge national bank.

 

I find the "treated like a real customer" comment intriguing. I'd argue that "personal service" doesn't define whether they treat you as a customer or not.

 

I also wanted to mention that I haven't encountered a fee from Bank of America in a good 5+ years. They don't charge me for anything.

 

In my experience, companies that try to differentiate themselves on service do it one of two ways:

 

1.) Charge significantly more then their competitors, allowing them to have a similar quality product and much better service.

2.) Have products and services that meet most of their customers needs, but lack overall compared to other companies; try to overcome this with top notch personal care.

 

With the CUs that I've encountered, they fall into that 2nd category. They provide better prices (interest rates primarily) and personal customer care, but lack in overall features and services when compared to the national banks.

 

For me, that's great for loans. It's not like I need or want to access my loan 24/7/365 from anywhere in the country by any means I want. However, with a checking account, it's a different story. I don't really care that I'm not getting personal service - I have no complaints about Bank of America's debit/checking customer care - but I do want all the positives that come along by being with one of the big national banks.

 

It sounds like for you, the credit unions are what you are after, and that's awesome. There's lots of downsides to using CUs for checking accounts, though, and I'd heavily caution anyone used to a big bank to fully understand all of what they are giving up when they switch.

[John from Riverside]

Back when Washington Mutual was Washington Mutual I used to take a stack of the deposit envelopes for the ATM and keep them in my glove box for this very reason......never a envelope when I went to make a depost.

 

Now that WAMU is now Chase.....they take your check in WITHOUT AN ENVELOPE at the ATM.....now how cool is that?

[The Dean]

That's because "Online Billpay" is just a fancy word for "fill out a form to send someone a check". I was more referring to the accounting procedures - if I make a transaction with my debit card, at the ATM, or teller services, I can immediately see the transaction online.

 

No. What I am saying is the accounting is real time. I make an ATM withdrawal or POP transaction and it is reflected immediately online. No different from BOA, from what I can see. A few years ago I had a different CU that had a delay in their accounting.

 

 

Yep, there's the 24-hour emergency number, but they wouldn't have been able to give me a replacement card within 30 minutes of me calling. Best scenario was I would have had to drive to my Credit Union to pick it up (a 3+ hour drive and they would have been closed), or go without it for the weekend.

 

Like I said, you may be right about this. It may depend on the size of the CU. But things may also have changed. There is a huge difference in the availability of ATM's from what there was just two or three years ago. Credit union associations seem to be getting better at delivering their services.

 

The personal touch is nice, for sure, but I don't think that's all that different from Bank of America sending me an email when my credit card bill with them is due.

 

...I find the "treated like a real customer" comment intriguing. I'd argue that "personal service" doesn't define whether they treat you as a customer or not.

 

Small depositors aren't the preferred customers of commercial banks. When a major account holder has a problem, or potential problem, with their account do you think they simply get an email? They have an account manager taking care of their issues. Wtih a CU, customers like me are their bread and butter. They are designed to cater to people like me, not simply tolerate my business.

 

Once when I got a call about my overdraft payment coming due I was out of town and low on funds. I asked if I could have two extra days, to get the cash when I returned. "No problem", I was informed. "Is there anything else I can help you with?"

 

The other day I stopped at the bank to get a cashier's check. The teller, who knows me by name, noticed I had yet to sign a form allowing me to use the overdraft protection on the ATM's. This was always fine, but a new law, or policy, made signing a form a prerequisite before using ATMs for overdrafts. I'm sure I got the notice in the mail and ignored it, or didn't open it yet. Anyway, the teller noticed, told me of the procedure and opted me into the program on the spot.

 

Like you say, it all depends on your needs and expectations. All I can say is I had a ton of problems, fees (I never keep a minimum balance), policy changes that I never found out about, etc, at commercial banks. I have none of these issues with my current CU.

 

When you say there are "lots of downsides to using CUs for checking accounts" I think that is a HUGE exaggeration. I also think your experience may be based on some old info, or maybe experience with a substandard CU.

 

Now, if you are a high dollar client, tie your accounts (savings, money market, etc) together and/or use many of the commercial services supplied by commercial banks, I can understand using them for checking. I think many of us have simpler needs in that dept.

[KD in CA]

As I was at work, I couldn't make it to the bank until about 5pm, the branch is closed. I go through a drive-thru ATM, to make the deposit, as I have done 100's of times before. This time, there is a catch. There are no deposit envelopes in the dispensary. No big deal, I will go to another machine. Second machine, no envelopes. Christ, I think, what are these people up to? I go to another machine, three envelopes, all sealed by humidity of the hot sun. I go to a fourth machine, out of order...it is pouring rain outside, and getting late. I had somewhere to be. I figured, ok no problem, it is a holiday weekend, nothing is going to happen with my rent check before the weekend is over.

 

Saturday morning, I go back to one of the same ATM machines, figuring, maybe someone has filled the envelope dispenser up again. No such luck. Rather than try the other two again, I go to another machine I have not tried yet, a bit out of my way, but I really wanted to get this check deposited.

 

I drive up to the machine, put my card in. I check my balance, on screen, before making my deposit. It asks me if I want another transaction. I press "Deposit with envelope"...nothing happens. I press it a few times, nothing...it is all touch screen. After about 20 seconds, I am asked if I "need more time"? I try "yes"...no response. Then, I get a message that my card will be confiscated if I don't make a selection. I tried "return card"...no response...you guessed it, it ate my card. Now, I am stuck with $29 in my pocket to get through a holiday weekend, no ATM card.

 

I drive around to the bank entrance (the bank is closed) and it says that the bank is closed on July 4th, for independence day. No ****, I think to myself, banks are always closed on Sunday. Are they open Monday?

 

I had to get to work, so, when I get home, I check the Wells Fargo web-site, to find out their hours. No luck. It only says that they are closed for Independence Day, no mention of the date.

 

Monday morning, I call the bank "Customer Service" line, and hold for 12 minutes, as they are "experiencing an unusually high volume of calls", something their Customer Service line always claims. I should also mention, I first called the branch where my card was eaten, but no answer, no voice message explaining that they were or were not open.

 

Anyways, a girl gets on, and can't answer a simple question like "are the banks open today?" until I give her my account number. I also have to give her the last 4 digits of my SSN#. She then starts reading to me the official bank holiday schedule. I thank her, and, in a calm manner, tell her that I am pretty unhappy with the service that the bank has been giving, particularly in the last three years or so. Her response, in a pleasant robot voice "Thank you. I am glad I could help you today." I don't know why, but that just pissed me off more than anything. I hung up...

In all fairness, it sounds like most of the problem was yours for not getting to the bank on time and for somehow missing that today is a federal holiday -- of course banks are not open today.

 

In the future, it might be a good idea to grab a bunch of deposit envelopes to keep in your car.

 

Anyone have a bank that they are happy with? I realize this is likely a silly question, but I have accepted that banks are a necessary evil. Unfortunately, my current employer, a small independent business, does not offer direct deposit.

Yes, I use a mid-sized regional bank that is well capitalized, has excellent customer service and didn't need any bailing out. That's the kind of bank you might want to consider looking for instead of the behemoths like WF, Citi, BoA, etc.