Why are some of you so Pessimistic?

[BB Fan 4 LIFE]

I'm just curious about the make up of some of the people on here. Is it in your genes that some of you are so pessimistic of the Bills? Is it so deeply ingrained in your souls that the outlook is so bad?

 

I know that most of us here have an optimistic outlook of the Bills, no matter how bleak things have looked for a while. The majority of us have read up and studied our team and know things haven't worked out the best for years. But we realize things can go better. How can things go worse?

 

We've upgraded our D and we have a man in charge who is known for making the most of an O. If we had upgraded our O in the draft instead of the D, I bet some of you would still find something to complain about.

 

Seriously though, I'm just curious, have some of you been so pessimistic all your life?

 

I'm not saying at all that you shouldn't post. I actually like reading your points of views at times because it's good to see different aspects and views of the game. But really, pessimism can go too far.

 

I'de much rather read optimistic posts from people who do their research (like a lot of people here do).

 

Thoughts?

 

I am not a pessimistic or optimistic person, I'm objective.

 

I strip away personal feelings and passions and just look at facts.

 

Based on those facts, I predict, this year, like the past 10 years, will not be good.

 

We did not have the personnel to compete last year, and we really haven't done anything that will change that (for this season anyway).

 

That, and we are in arguably the toughest division in football.

 

I got a little passionate and excited when we brought Marv back and went optimist for a season.

 

Forgive me.

[Thurman#1]

If your son played little league soccer and you knew that soccer wasn't his game and that his team was going to get beat every game, would stop rooting for him?

 

Loving a team to death doesn't mean you are blind willfully or otherwise to their shortcomings.

 

Realistically, I think this team is a huge question mark mostly. This is a league of QB's and we don't have one who has proven himself to be a quality starter. As Buddy said, "...those that have one is winnin and those that don't aren't..."

 

We are radically changing our defense and it seems silly to me to think that you can make that kind of transition personnel wise all in one year. Could it happen? Sure, but the odds aren't good. We don't have a single solitary pass rusher on the team with any proven ability to get to the QB. The one decent threat we had there was Schobel and he is all but retired.

 

There have been no drastic improvements to what was a pretty sorry OL last year. And you have guys on the line coming off major surgeries in Wood and Bell. For rookies, Levitre and Wood did all right last year but that was grading on the rookie curve. They need to take big steps forward this year.

 

I do think that Spiller will add some options and that Chan is everything Jauron wasn't when it comes to understanding how to score points in this league.

 

Against this background, we are playing in a division full of solid teams who all appear to have made some good offseason moves to improve themselves.

 

Overall, my prediction is that they are going to have a rough year, maybe even epically rough. But I also think they are going in the right direction. They will need more than one year to get where they want to go.

 

 

Another excellent post.

[Pilsner]

Why are some of you so Pessimistic?, Dear God, good heavens why?

 

Are you for real? Do this-Get the book "The Buffalo Bills History" (if it really exists), check the Bills records for the past decade or so and see what they have in common. Ok, now if you have half a brain when you look over the past decade, you can answer your own question.

 

 

My question asked for more of an in depth reply than your answer showed. Some people here understood what I was getting at. I was asking for something

further than simple optimism or pessimism. And seriously is it too much to ask for a civil discussion

instead of barbaric personal attacks?

[Thurman#1]

...

Right now our goal should be watching players who will be around for a Super Bowl run, not getting on the case of people who think the W-L record is going to be dismal. The odds are pretty good the record will be dismal. If it's the 1st year of a rebuild, so be it. Here's something to think about. In the 1990s I used to look at old programs from the mid 80s & see how many of the guys on our really bad teams were destined to play in the Super Bowl as Bills. The 1984 team had 2 guys who made it, 1985's team had 7, and the 1986 team had 16. That 1986 team had almost 1/3 of the Super Bowl teams, yet still won only 4 games-with Jim Kelly. How many of the current Bills could be on a Super Bowl team in 3-4 years? Here's my estimate: QB -none; RB Spiller; WR Evans, Easley; TE Nelson; OL: Wood, Levitre, Meredith, Wang, Calloway; DL: Troup, Williams, Carrington; LB: Batten, Posluszny, Maybin(?), DB: Corner, Langster, McGee, McKelvin, Byrd, 1 more who stays among vets. So my total is 21, about 40% of a potential future Super Bowl team. Take 2-3 away for the optimism I have on this rookie class & it would be closer to 1/3rd. A little better numbers for the 2010 team over the 4-12 1986 team, but that team had future HOFers at QB & DE, and some more wall of famers.

 

If I conclude 4 to 5 wins for this team, it doesn't make me a pessimist if I have an eye towards the future. The optimists around here who are thinking they have to win every week, even though they know they won't will look at the small picture, "feel good" the week the Bills win that 4th game and miss the bigger picture. As I've said before, Herm Edwards had it all wrong, you don't "play to win the game" you play to win the Championship. The record a year, 2, or 3 years before that championship becomes irrelevant when you've got the Lombardi Trophy.

 

 

Yet another great post. This is a heckuva thread.

 

Great point about those late '80s teams. Some bad teams with some players who turned out to be franchise cornerstones. It's what happens when you switch systems and bring in a lot of good young players. It takes them a year or three to develop together.

 

I'd add Stroud to your list, even though there's a chance he will be too old. I think playing DE will extend his career, and he's a terrific athlete, especially for his size. Good list, though.

 

I disagree with you about the Herm Edwards quote, though. The team and the coaches should always be playing to win the game. At the same time, the front office and head coach should be planning for a future championship. On the field, though, they should play to win, but we fans can occasionally hope for losses for better draft choices and that kind of long-term thinking.

[Pilsner]

Yet another great post. This is a heckuva thread.

 

Great point about those late '80s teams. Some bad teams with some players who turned out to be franchise cornerstones. It's what happens when you switch systems and bring in a lot of good young players. It takes them a year or three to develop together.

 

I'd add Stroud to your list, even though there's a chance he will be too old. I think playing DE will extend his career, and he's a terrific athlete, especially for his size. Good list, though.

 

I disagree with you about the Herm Edwards quote, though. The team and the coaches should always be playing to win the game. At the same time, the front office and head coach should be planning for a future championship. On the field, though, they should play to win, but we fans can occasionally hope for losses for better draft choices and that kind of long-term thinking.

 

I agree. Albany made some very good points. Excellent list.

[Bill from NYC]

My question asked for more of an in depth reply than your answer showed. Some people here understood what I was getting at. I was asking for something

further than simple optimism or pessimism. And seriously is it too much to ask for a civil discussion

instead of barbaric personal attacks?

 

LOL! "Barbaric personal attacks?" Obviously you were never married.

[Thurman#1]

Nice World Cup article in ESPN by Bill Simmons... but take a look at this part... it made me laugh.

 

Question No. 11: What was the funniest thing you've read about the World Cup this month?

 

I liked Michael Davies' take on England's demise: "Americans will never completely understand how crap it is, most of the time, to be English. We might have cute accents and be good at cocktail parties. But we are mostly losers." That slayed me. England's fatalistic, self-loathing, S&M-style attitude toward its national team tops Buffalo Bills fans, Minnesota Vikings fans or even Cleveland fans.

 

 

Hah! Funny. A British friend of mine says sentiment over there is overwhelmingly in favor of Americans becoming great soccer fans and a great soccer country. My friend tells his friends at home not to wish for that because if/when America becomes good, they're going to become very very good.

 

But he says that it's not fair how Americans get the best of both worlds. When the American team wins, we gloat, and when the American team loses, we don't care, while they feel agony for the next four years when the Brits lose.

 

He had a good point.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." Winston Churchill

 

I would add (to all of you who claim to be realists or "objective") that a realist sees both sides of each issue and acknowledges them.

 

A person who opines but doesn't cite both sides of a discussion, is (because he is not omniscient and all-knowing) either an optimist or a pessimist.

[Pilsner]

LOL! "Barbaric personal attacks?" Obviously you were never married.

 

 

Haha! You're right. And now getting hitched is even less enticing to me.

[Pilsner]

"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." Winston Churchill

 

I would add (to all of you who claim to be realists or "objective") that a realist sees both sides of each issue and acknowledges them.

 

A person who opines but doesn't cite both sides of a discussion, is (because he is not omniscient and all-knowing) either an optimist or a pessimist.

 

 

Well made point and an awsome quote as well. Churchill was a wise fellow indeed. I'm glad he was there

to lead when he was.

[San-O]

The Buffalo Bills haven't appeared in a playoff game in over ten years, will not this year, and

haven't won a playoff game in over 15 years.

 

Add to that the facts that Ralph won't sell and nobody wants to come here and you start to

see the picture.

 

 

Don't confuse pessimism with objectivity.

 

 

 

 

Jan. 2, 1999 AFC Wild Card Miami 24, Buffalo 17

 

Dec. 28, 1996 AFC Wild Card Jacksonville 30, Buffalo 27

 

Jan. 6, 1996 AFC Divisional Pittsburgh 40, Buffalo 21

 

Dec. 30, 1995 AFC Wild Card Buffalo 37, Miami 22

 

Jan. 30, 1994 Super Bowl XXVIII Dallas 30, Buffalo 13

[tonyjustbcuz]

I never said I prayed for us to win. I'm a realistic optimist. Nothing less and nothing more.

please don't put words in my mouth.

 

 

I've never heard of a realistic optimist before? Maybe the term exists, but it's new to me. I try to be a realist generally speaking and I am optimistic or pessimistic at times based on educating myself on the subject matter prior to forming my opninion. I want to be optimistic about this year's team and the directiion that we are heading into the future, and do appreciate what you are trying to convey. I cannot say at this time that I share your realistic optimism in the product that the Bills will likely offer in the upcoming season. I guess, based on the points I tried to make in my other reply I am a realistic pessimist based on what I have observed. I won't put everyone through a long blog like the other one, but I think I am not a pessimist by nature and am very well adjusted and optimistic about many other things. I hope you continue to drink from the fountain of eternal optimism pilsner, and look very much forward to your comments at the end of week #17

to see if you remain optimistic about the Bills and their future. Hope you had a nice 4th of July

[bbillyfootballcoach]

I never said I prayed for us to win. I'm a realistic optimist. Nothing less and nothing more.

please don't put words in my mouth.

i didnt say pray, i said "pray" which meant that you seem to think it matters how pessimistic we all are, it doesnt, it depends whether the bills lose or win, if they won more, we wouldnt be. U asked why, thats why, or did you just want to bash the pessimists here? Are you a trent supporter too, is that the real truth youre hiding and asking "why?" hes alot to do with it.

[Pilsner]

I've never heard of a realistic optimist before? Maybe the term exists, but it's new to me. I try to be a realist generally speaking and I am optimistic or pessimistic at times based on educating myself on the subject matter prior to forming my opninion. I want to be optimistic about this year's team and the directiion that we are heading into the future, and do appreciate what you are trying to convey. I cannot say at this time that I share your realistic optimism in the product that the Bills will likely offer in the upcoming season. I guess, based on the points I tried to make in my other reply I am a realistic pessimist based on what I have observed. I won't put everyone through a long blog like the other one, but I think I am not a pessimist by nature and am very well adjusted and optimistic about many other things. I hope you continue to drink from the fountain of eternal optimism pilsner, and look very much forward to your comments at the end of week #17

to see if you remain optimistic about the Bills and their future. Hope you had a nice 4th of July

 

 

I respect your reply Tony. I think our team will be struggling less

at week 17 than at the beginning of the season. But that goes without saying.

It will be a learning

process for the young Bills. I'm not sure yet how much we'll struggle

but I imagine it will be a lot this year. I think the ship is being righted

tho. I was out in the back yard watching the fireworks and having a good

introspective talk with my brother and checking postings on here too.

I hope you had a good 4th too Tony.

I hope you had a good 4th too Tony.

[Pilsner]

i didnt say pray, i said "pray" which meant that you seem to think it matters how pessimistic we all are, it doesnt, it depends whether the bills lose or win, if they won more, we wouldnt be. U asked why, thats why, or did you just want to bash the pessimists here? Are you a trent supporter too, is that the real truth youre hiding and asking "why?" hes alot to do with it.

 

 

How do I reply to such fabrication?

[mpl6876]

I honestly think age has some factor in all of this.

 

If you've been following this team long enough to have been a serious football fan when this team was very good some 20 years ago and not just a little kid who kind of remembers it or went to a game or two back then youunderstand just how far this organization has fallen. You also understand that while other organizations have risen and fallen in most cases many times during that period, Buffalo never seems to have been able to rebuild. I'm not saying that it's easy to get to a level of the Super Bowl Bills in the era of free agency, but to come nowhere close for such a long time really wears you down.

 

To flip it around, I'd ask the optimists what makes them think that any of the changes we've seen this year make you believe the team is finally on the right track?

 

New coach? Been there - before they were run out of town people felt Wade/Greggo/Mularkey/Jauron was the fresh faced guy who could get the most out of the talent and pull something together. Excuse me if I'm not buying it with Chan until I actually see it.

 

Front Office changes? Been there - remember when Ralph finally gave in and gave controll to Tom Donahoe and everyone thought we would soon be back on top because he was a real GM who could evaluate talent - how'd that work out? Excuse me if I don't give Buddy Nix a pass until he shows me something.

 

Young players with potential? Seen plenty of these over the years, too - from consensus picks at positions of great need (Mike Williams) down to talented guys at positions where we seemed to be OK (McGahee) to guys who we seemed to value more than other organizations (Losman, McCargo, Whitner) - how'd that work out? How many Pro Bowlers have we drafted in the past decade vs. how many guys when cut from the Bills can barely scrape a roster spot from another team in the league? You'll have to excuse me if I want Spiller to show me something before I'm ready to call it a great pick.

 

Point is, every year I see the same thing - optimists go around and slam people for being pessimistic while they tout all the reasons why "this year it's going to be different - we're going to surprise". Their reasons are straight of ouf a Mad Libs fill in the blank sheet. Then the Bills actually start playing games and get overmatched by stronger organizations and they slowly progress from cheeleaders to suicide hotline callers and end up being some of the most miserable amongst use when the team loses to Cleveland in a 6-3 home game stinker.

 

When the season ends, the only game the Bills are playing in January is golf and people are screaming that we need a new coach/GM and more talent on the team. In the offseason we'll make some moves - maybe replace the coach, maybe bring in a free agent who has nowhere else to go, draft some new kids with potential and it starts all over again - the circle of life is complete for Bills fans.

 

Personally I've learned that it's better to be a realist (you call it a pessimist) as I take another ride of this same damn broken merry-go-round and understand that when the season's over I'm pretty sure I'm going to get off the ride just about where I got on it rather than think it was actually going to take me Pasadena/Miami or where the Super Bowl was held. I still enjoy riding every Sunday and cheering for the team but I have my expectations in order that that makes the experience better overall. I'd love for things to get better and to change my approach as a fan, but at this point I'm not going to do that based on the promise of change or potential - somebody's actually got to SHOW ME SOMETHING.

 

I'd also kindly ask all the optimists to quit questioning whether realist/pessimists are "true fans" - nothing worse than a punk who was in diapers in 1990 questioning the 40 years I have invested in this team because he feels it appropriate to appoint himself some sort of Bills Taliban because he's a "diehard fan", but that's a whole separate rant....

 

Thank you for a great post. I feel some sort of vindication from the guys who have "slammed" me on my previous negative postings...

[Thurman#1]

I think many of the perpetual pessimists just choose to take the easy way out. They want to feel good no matter what the team does.

 

If the team does poorly, they will be the first to say, "See I told you." "If they would have done like I said they would be much better, but no one would listen to me." Takes the sting away from the team doing poorly.

 

Now, if the team does better than expected, they can go along and enjoy the ride. No one will likely remember that they bad mouthed the team before the season. And if someone does, who cares, because everyone else is too focused on enjoying the ride also.

 

 

 

Whereas it's totally different for you pie-eyed optimists. If the one-percent chance comes true and we make the playoffs this year, not a single one of you will say "I told you so." You are all too high-minded and principled for that.

 

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

[Thurman#1]

You seem very angry. I can help for $150 an hour.

 

 

 

You could not more perfectly have proved him right.

 

Psychobabble and a misdiagnosis.

[Thurman#1]

I think i was a bit too vague with my first post.

 

What I really was trying to get at was:

 

Are the pessimists on this board just pessimistic about the Bills are are you all pessimists in general with all things?

 

I think we all get pessimistic from time to time. It's only natural. I've read people calling themselves "realistic pessimists" on here. I consider myself a realistic optimist. Definitely not a blind optimist.

 

Realistic: I agree that our 0-line needs more talent and more experience. We are not set at QB yet. Our D needs time to learn the new system. We have a new HC and we all know what happened with the last 3.

 

Optimism: Our HC has a history of making more with less in the NFL. Our young players will gain more valuable experience this season.

 

I'm not trying to bash you pessimists. Just trying to understand my fellow fans. We're all in this together.

 

The more successful people in life seem to have a more optimistic view rather than a pessimistic. I hope that most of you pessimists don't let the pessimism control your whole viewpoint on life.

 

I think most HC's are realistic about the talent they have and are also optimistic/positive about their abilities to mold and make a team into a contender and win.

 

Ok it's the 4th of July and it's time to clean up and fire up the grill. I wish all you optimists, realists, pessimists, and every combination a Happy 4th of July!

 

Go Bills!!

 

Oh and Red, I was in HS during the glory years too. Started watching the Bills in 87-88

 

 

 

I'm a realist in all things.

 

When I give money to an alcoholic bum, I'm pessimistic that he's going to use it for anything but alcohol. Nonetheless, I usually give a bit. When I look out the door and there are grey clouds in the sky and the air feels heavy, I usually figure it's going to rain and I bring along an umbrella. Experience has shown me that when I give people some good advice, most times they will ignore it. Nonetheless, if asked, I give my honest opinion and offer any support I can give, while understanding that only a very few people will actually change their behavior, so I guess you would say I'm pessimistic, but life sure seems to match my expectations. And I know I've ignored good advice all too often myself, and cursed myself later.

 

I'm now married to the greatest woman in the world, but back in the old days, when women said "Let's just be friends," I didn't expect them to call me up all the time to maintain our friendship. One or two did, and I'm still friendly with them today. A large majority actually meant that they didn't want to spend time with me at all. And I especially didn't think "Gee, maybe if I give her flowers every day and hang out on the sidewalk in front of her apartment, maybe she'll see what she missed all along, that I'm the guy for her."

 

Noticing that things look bad isn't pessimism.

 

On the other hand, I've started two successful small businesses, and that took a lot of optimism, but I had good plans and knew there was a niche there. I've dated a lot of women because I had enough optimism to figure that if I asked a lot of women out, some would say yes. When it's sunny and there's not a cloud in the sky and the air is light and dry, I don't bring an umbrella.

 

I call that realism.

 

When things look good, I notice and act on it. When things look bad, I don't ignore it, I act on that too. In my opinion, people who see all the data which indicates a bad outcome and ignore it and push on into a preventable wreck aren't optimists, they're idiots.

 

When it's a whiteout on the Thruway with visibility of five feet, you know what, I get myself a hotel and lie in. If that is pessimism, call me a pessimist.

[Thurman#1]

I have no problem with people evaluating the team, seeing holes and question marks,

wondering why they did or didn't make certain moves and then based on their opinion saying

its going to be a rough season in the win column for the Bills.

 

I also understand being cautious about what to expect from Nix, Whaley, Gailey, etc.

because we have been through coaching and GM turnovers that didn't work out and

sometimes change doesn't mean improvement.

 

What I have a problem with is the people who guess 0-2 wins (we had six last year

amidst a perfect storm of problems), trash players on the team (not evaluating how good

they are or not or if we should stick with them, but just throwing out personal attacks),

failing to recognize the talented players we do have (like one post I read that said everyone

of our starters could be upgraded by third stringers from other teams), etc., etc.

 

I have no problem being realistic about the team (even though I'm one who is optimistic),

but how realistic is 1 win? How realistic is "we don't have one player that would start for

another team?"

 

There is a spectrum of optimism and pessimism and anyone on either extreme is not being

realistic. The rest of us can discuss the issues, players, moves, coaching, etc. We can be critical

of the team or players while still supporting them and not attack them personally.

 

We're all Bills fans...but I think what people get tired of are not the people who aren't optimistic

(trying to be realistic) about this upcoming season or coaching staff or whatever, but the ones

who can never see anything positive about the team and trash the team any chance they get.

 

 

 

This is the kind of optimism that I both get and respect.