Free rubbers for Tots in Provincetown, Mass

[KD in CA]

this is what happens after 15 years of parents expecting schools to raise their children for them. i dont have anything against what the school is doing. maybe it will inspire parents to take a more active role in their kids' lives. probably not though.

So, your solution to the problem of idiots expecting schools to raise their kids is.......to have the schools enact even more far reaching policies that assume responsibility for raising the kids.

 

 

sounds like it's all the overpaid teacher's fault, imo...

It's so unjust to have people paid 10 months salary for 10 months of work.

[Ramius]

So, your solution to the problem of idiots expecting schools to raise their kids is.......to have the schools enact even more far reaching policies that assume responsibility for raising the kids.

 

 

 

It's so unjust to have people paid 10 months salary for 10 months of work.

 

Basically every teacher i know only gets paid 10 months a year.

[KD in CA]

Basically every teacher i know only gets paid 10 months a year.

 

That was my point -- they are getting paid for the time they work. The "teachers are underpaid" crowd always seem to forget it's not a year round job.

[DrDawkinstein]

That was my point -- they are getting paid for the time they work. The "teachers are underpaid" crowd always seem to forget it's not a year round job.

 

no, but it's often more than a 40 hour/week job. AND they are directly effecting and training our future generations of Americans. I can hardly think of a job that is more important to the very fabric of our country.

 

as an example, my best friend is a high school teacher here in the Atlanta Public School district. besides the teaching in the classroom, he also deals with kids bringing weapons into school, 15 year old pregnant girls getting into brawls, kids wanting to drop out and get involved with crime, etc. and he takes an active role in providing some positive guidance in their lives. its usually the ONLY positive guidance these kids ever get.

 

furthermore, and on the flip side, he also coaches the Mock Trial Team. and they take it quite serious, as his team just finished 3rd in the NATION last month. for the entire year, he is at Mock Trial practice after school from 6pm to 11pm. helping these amazing kids do great things and getting that springboard into good colleges.

 

are there a lot of teachers that just do the bare minimum? no doubt. but there is a LOT more to their job than just handing out homework assignments. the stress levels can be ridiculous.

 

but if Georgia took their Educational Funding as serious as it's farm subsidies, maybe it would bring in some more quality teachers and help a few more kids. It's not so much that teachers are underpaid, but that there is a lot of funding going to other places that should go to Education instead.

[Chef Jim]

The only problem with this is that the ultra-conservatives in this country blow it completely out of proportion. Trust me, there are a lot of middle and high schoolers (5th grade and up) that are way less innocent than most will make them out to be. the problem is that there isnt enough proper sex ed in this country at a young enough age, and even when it is taught, most places tell the kids that "abstinence is the only option." That does not work IMO. It sickens me to see girls as young as 7th grade pregnant due to the ignorant people who try to run this country thinking that kids will do exactly what they tell them to do, or dont give them any option.

 

Get your heads out of your ***** people! Teenage pregnancies are way too high in this country.

 

I'm quoting this from my college sociology teacher last year: There is a higher percentage of 12 year olds in the US pregnant than the percentage of pregnant teens (pre-20) in Sweden. The reason? In Sweden, sex ed starts in kindergarten and they teach children more than just abstinence.

 

Hmmm, used to be that way. What happened?

[Ramius]

That was my point -- they are getting paid for the time they work. The "teachers are underpaid" crowd always seem to forget it's not a year round job.

 

Teachers are underpaid. So are firemen and policemen, etc. The only teachers that could be considered overpaid are the ones that have been in the system for 30 years and are making ridiculous bank.

 

The problems aren't overpaid teachers. The problems are that there are way too many parents that expect school to do all the work and parenting for them and that there is no effective method to weed out ****ty teachers.

[DrDawkinstein]

Teachers are underpaid. So are firemen and policemen, etc. The only teachers that could be considered overpaid are the ones that have been in the system for 30 years and are making ridiculous bank.

 

The problems aren't overpaid teachers. The problems are that there are way too many parents that expect school to do all the work and parenting for them and that there is no effective method to weed out ****ty teachers.

 

indeed

[DrDawkinstein]

So, your solution to the problem of idiots expecting schools to raise their kids is.......to have the schools enact even more far reaching policies that assume responsibility for raising the kids.

 

to address this specifically, no. id PREFER to have the schools butt out. the problem is, that isnt realistic and doing so only hurts the kids since their parents still arent ready/willing to be parents. however, it's easily observed that the parents DO get involved once the school does something they dont like. so maybe enact a few more policies that get in the face of parents and wake them up. i dont know any other way for the schools to "fight back" and put the parenting responsibility back on the parents without putting the kids in a bad situation. im open to any other suggestions on how to accomplish that.

[Chef Jim]

to address this specifically, no. id PREFER to have the schools butt out. the problem is, that isnt realistic and doing so only hurts the kids since their parents still arent ready/willing to be parents. however, it's easily observed that the parents DO get involved once the school does something they dont like. so maybe enact a few more policies that get in the face of parents and wake them up. i dont know any other way for the schools to "fight back" and put the parenting responsibility back on the parents without putting the kids in a bad situation. im open to any other suggestions on how to accomplish that.

 

Make parents pay for their kids education and not me. They need some skin in the game. Maybe if they had to write a monthly check they'd pay more attention to what's going on.

[AxelRipper]

Hmmm, used to be that way. What happened?

 

 

People got soft. Parents stopped parenting. If a kid does something wrong, spank them! Simple as that. Sooner or later they're gonna realize what they should and shouldn't do.

 

But nooo... In this happy go lucky world we live in, no one looses because their feelings cant be hurt. Everyone wins! Isnt it wonderful!

 

And then when something does happen and parents do suddenly get involved, it is never their kid's fault. Its always someone else's fault. The school for not teaching them or controlling the situation. The other kid's parents for not raising their kid properly. ADD.

 

Just like the people running our government, a lot of people having kids these days need to be slapped.

[AxelRipper]

Make parents pay for their kids education and not me. They need some skin in the game. Maybe if they had to write a monthly check they'd pay more attention to what's going on.

 

 

Unfortunately, then you get the people who can't pay for it, or won't pay for it, leading to even more idiots in this country. Idiots who, to get back on topic, have a tendency to have even more offspring than higher educated/higher income people.

[DrDawkinstein]

Make parents pay for their kids education and not me. They need some skin in the game. Maybe if they had to write a monthly check they'd pay more attention to what's going on.

 

while completely unrealistic and impossible, i like it because it might make people think twice before starting to pop out a team of poorly behaved idiots. but most likely what would happen is that people would simply not send their kids to school then, and we'd be in an even worse situation.

[BuffaloBill]

The only problem with this is that the ultra-conservatives in this country blow it completely out of proportion. Trust me, there are a lot of middle and high schoolers (5th grade and up) that are way less innocent than most will make them out to be. the problem is that there isnt enough proper sex ed in this country at a young enough age, and even when it is taught, most places tell the kids that "abstinence is the only option." That does not work IMO. It sickens me to see girls as young as 7th grade pregnant due to the ignorant people who try to run this country thinking that kids will do exactly what they tell them to do, or dont give them any option.

 

Get your heads out of your ***** people! Teenage pregnancies are way too high in this country.

 

I'm quoting this from my college sociology teacher last year: There is a higher percentage of 12 year olds in the US pregnant than the percentage of pregnant teens (pre-20) in Sweden. The reason? In Sweden, sex ed starts in kindergarten and they teach children more than just abstinence.

 

 

Are you suggesting that the parents should not be teaching their kids about sex in an age appropriate way? The idea that schools are to handle this, especially alone, is a deeply flawed model.

[DrDawkinstein]

Are you suggesting that the parents should not be teaching their kids about sex in an age appropriate way? The idea that schools are to handle this, especially alone, is a deeply flawed model.

 

what do you consider the appropriate age?

 

also, it is not up to the school to teach morality. they should present the physical facts. "if you do this, than that can happen, and here is how you prevent it". it should not be up to the school to "enforce" abstinence, and it's been proven that doing so only leads to a school full of pregnant teens who didn't know to use condoms. contrary to popular conservative/religious belief, sex ed does not promote sex. sex does a good enough job promoting itself, plus you have "the babysitter" (read: television) promoting it enough. children need to be informed of the possible consequences of their actions.

 

at what age, in your opinion, should parents start addressing it?

[BuffaloBill]

what do you consider the appropriate age?

 

also, it is not up to the school to teach morality. they should present the physical facts. "if you do this, than that can happen, and here is how you prevent it". it should not be up to the school to "enforce" abstinence, and it's been proven that doing so only leads to a school full of pregnant teens who didn't know to use condoms. contrary to popular conservative/religious belief, sex ed does not promote sex. sex does a good enough job promoting itself, plus you have "the babysitter" (read: television) promoting it enough. children need to be informed of the possible consequences of their actions.

 

at what age, in your opinion, should parents start addressing it?

 

By age appropriate I simply mean that kids are curious and it should be ok to answer their questions or respond to their curiosity with answers that take into account their maturity. As for details parents should use judgement given the age of the child and their physical maturity. I would say for most kids that starting a very open discussion around the age of 10 or 11 might be appropriate.

[DrDawkinstein]

By age appropriate I simply mean that kids are curious and it should be ok to answer their questions or respond to their curiosity with answers that take into account their maturity. As for details parents should use judgement given the age of the child and their physical maturity. I would say for most kids that starting a very open discussion around the age of 10 or 11 might be appropriate.

 

ah, i gotcha, thanks for clarifying

 

was afraid you were going down the "X year olds dont need to learn about it" path. had me scared there

[justnzane]

sounds like it's all the overpaid teacher's fault, imo...

 

 

 

$35k/year hahaha... really not great pay for dealing with remedial level classes were a sizeable percentage of the students were wearing ankle bracelets. Meanwhile enough kids were seniors trying to pass a freshman algebra class that is on par with what New York has 7th graders do in their math classes.

 

Basically anyone who has entered teaching in the past 5 years is pretty much getting shaft in comparison his or her predecessors in terms of benefits pay and job security. Not to mention with many states forcing teachers to have a master's degree for the job many teachers are 1.5-3 years salary in debt before they even enter the classroom. I am back down to part time and am finishing my masters in the next year and I will be ~$75k in the hole just for student loans from public universities (no parent support, so i did all on my own financially).

[KD in CA]

$35k/year hahaha... really not great pay for dealing with remedial level classes were a sizeable percentage of the students were wearing ankle bracelets. Meanwhile enough kids were seniors trying to pass a freshman algebra class that is on par with what New York has 7th graders do in their math classes.

 

Basically anyone who has entered teaching in the past 5 years is pretty much getting shaft in comparison his or her predecessors in terms of benefits pay and job security. Not to mention with many states forcing teachers to have a master's degree for the job many teachers are 1.5-3 years salary in debt before they even enter the classroom. I am back down to part time and am finishing my masters in the next year and I will be ~$75k in the hole just for student loans from public universities (no parent support, so i did all on my own financially).

 

Than teachers should vote to dump their union and tenure system and start leveling pay. It's easy to harp on the $35k/ year recent grad while not doing anything to address the $95k per year old bag who's just going through the motions and shouldn't be anywhere near a classroom.

 

The average teacher makes $54,000 for 10 months work -- that's $65,000 annualized plus benefits/retirement that is still far richer than the vast majority of Americans receive. Sorry guys, that's not underpaid.

 

Bottom line is there is more than enough money going toward education in this country. It's just going to the wrong places and that's what needs to be fixed. The same crooks that are stealing our money will continue to run the 'underpaid teachers' flag up the pole in an attempt to get even more rather than allocating a proper amount to that portion of teachers that are underpaid.

[Booster4324]

Than teachers should vote to dump their union and tenure system and start leveling pay. It's easy to harp on the $35k/ year recent grad while not doing anything to address the $95k per year old bag who's just going through the motions and shouldn't be anywhere near a classroom.

 

The average teacher makes $54,000 for 10 months work -- that's $65,000 annualized plus benefits/retirement that is still far richer than the vast majority of Americans receive. Sorry guys, that's not underpaid.

 

Bottom line is there is more than enough money going toward education in this country. It's just going to the wrong places and that's what needs to be fixed. The same crooks that are stealing our money will continue to run the 'underpaid teachers' flag up the pole in an attempt to get even more rather than allocating a proper amount to that portion of teachers that are underpaid.

 

Well you seem to be discounting what would be overtime pay in other non salary jobs. Just the 10 months bit I am quibbling about really. I agree with you in all other areas.

 

We have thrown tons of money in our local district thanks to the casinos. Yet I still get letters from my son's teachers saying something like, "You're son was disrupteve again today."

 

No **** B word, perhaps because he is bored with your class. I taught him that years ago. Oh and he knows the difference between you're and your and can spell disruptive.

 

/end rant

[KD in CA]

Well you seem to be discounting what would be overtime pay in other non salary jobs. Just the 10 months bit I am quibbling about really. I agree with you in all other areas.

Well, my point was more that a teacher can get a seasonal job for 2 months in the summer if they choose -- something other full time people can't do. But you get your point.

 

We have thrown tons of money in our local district thanks to the casinos. Yet I still get letters from my son's teachers saying something like, "You're son was disrupteve again today."

 

No **** B word, perhaps because he is bored with your class. I taught him that years ago. Oh and he knows the difference between you're and your and can spell disruptive.

 

/end rant