Maybe Chan is the right coach

[Doc]

You are incorrect. Marv had some association with Jauron when DJ was coaching the Bears and Marv was doing some media work for the team during the preseasons. In addition, Marv lived in Chicago, so it shouldn't be surprising that he had contact with the Chicago HC. Dick Jauron was a Marv hire. He argued on DJ's behalf when the grizzly owner preferred Sherman.

 

You make an interesting point about Marv not being involved with the NFL in a meaningful way for a number of years before he was hired by Ralph. That makes his hiring by the goofey owner even more peculiar.

Marv stated he never med Jauron before he interviewed him. Even if that is false, the bigger point is that unlike Cowher with Gailey, Marv had never worked with Jauron before.

 

As for the hiring of Levy as GM, after the widely-praised hiring of TD, only to see it fail and Ralph lose trust in an "outsider," he turned to the coach of his team during the glory years. Not so "goofey" (sic) as you make it out to be.

 

And as for giving him a contract extenion after the 5-0 start, that's understandable as well. And certainly not as dumb as defending (not you) giving players $1B over 5 years and willing to risk a lockout/strike.

[billsfan_34]

Don't go there. Did you watch Georgia Tech during the Gailey era? It wasn't a pretty sight. I'm cautiously optimistic that he's the right guy, but let's not annoint him just yet, as much as you love guzzling the Kool Aid, PTR.

You cant compare college to pro...it just doesnt equate. Gailey has proven himself in the NFL and not so much in college. And Lou Holtz has proven himself in college but not in the pro ranks. Point is, one style of coach is suited for pro and one style is suited for college.

[mpl6876]

Since when does Bill Cowher become an authority on hiring head coaches? Just because he think highly of hime doesn't mean he will be successful in Buffalo or anywhere else. Besides, maybe he is just recommending a friend?

[NewHampshireBillsFan]

From the day we hired Chan I thought it was the BEST choice. Cowher, as I keep saying, is another Mike Ditka, a tough guy kind of head coach who did well in a place where everything was set up for success and he had great coaches and a great front office around him, with great tradition in the program. Cowher will succeed about as well as Ditka did in New Orleans, and if I were Cowher I would stay retired.

 

Shanahan never seems to figure out what to do with his defenses and although he is a great offensive coach, would he have won the big one without Elway?

 

We learned the hard way that hiring the hottest coordinator (O or D) is a crap shoot and the guy is always learning on the job. Anyway, I would have taken Gailey over Cowher or Shanahan as the overall best HC for THIS organization at THIS time. And everything he is doing only proves that he is the best choice. I also like that Nix and co. have not panicked like the fans and national media about QB or LT and are drafting the right players such as Spiller.

[Bob in STL]

It's not hard to be an improvement over the sad-sack former HC Buffalo had and the bar was set pretty low to improve on DJ. It seems like anything new is instantly declared better around here. At the time, Marv was an improvement over DJ. DJ over Mularkey. Mularkey over Williams. Williams over Wade. Donahoe over Butler. Problem is, the same guy is still making the decisions.

 

 

It sure seems that way indeed. In fifty years of Bills football we have had 3 really good football coaches on this team. Saban, Knox and Levy. You can throw in Wade Phillips too but I for one am not a big fan of Wade as a HC. Buter Ramsey might not have bneen too bad considering the players he had from 60-62.

 

Now look at the bad ones .. John Rauch, Jope Collier, Harvey Johnson, Jim Ringo, Kay Stephenson, Hank Boullough, Greggggo Williams, Mike Mularkey, and Dick Jauron. At least Collier, Williams and Mularkey are accomplished coordinators in the NFL. Ringo was a good OL position coach anf that is it. Jauron a good secondary coach and that is it. Rauch was crap at Oakland and here. Stephaneson and hammer'in Hank should never have been given an NFL coaching job. Johnson was a thrown in after other coaches were fired in mid season.

 

Oveall a pretty sad crew.

[sllib olaffub]

Of course we're just speculating on how the Bills will do; and it does matter if they win, as far as how successful a coach Chan Gailey ends up being here. However, we can see some things taking shape now - the mentality he's instilling, the toughness, the confidence. Jauron was frustratingly weak. When he spoke it made you wonder how he could lead anyone. That matters. The Jet's Ryan, although irritating in his arrogance, still, motivates his players to play because he's telling them they had better be the best, they had better out play anyone - quite contrary to "it's hard to win a single game in this league". So, yeah, Gailey has already done some things.

 

I like the players he's brought in. If you were looking at he 2009 Bills and had to fix them, I'd say improving the run defense would be high on the list. It looks like we'll be a much harder team to run on, and if we can get to the QB, we should be a terror for opposing QB's with our secondary. Also, playing to a strength - the running game. We ran o.k. last year and everyone knew we couldn't pass. I think we've got better recievers in our young guys than people think. I see a young Green Bay receiver corps when I look at our guys, or a young New Orleans team - they're fast, and now their pretty good sized, and they can catch. Run and stop the run. I think we'll do that well this year. To top that, though, we're going to see what the young guys can do on the O-line, at WR, at QB, and going into next year we'll know what we need to run the kind of game plan Nix and Gailey want. That's good for year one, IMO.

 

Football isn't rocket science - but, these athletes are so close, talent wise, that winning and losing are decided by very little. I'm thinking that with what we have right now we could make a wild card run. I'm thinking that Nix and Gailey are bringing back to Buffalo what we haven't had since the days of Pollian - legitimate organization and know-how. Just look at what Miami did in one year. Look at what Harbough brought to Baltimore - now they're one of the top organizations in the league. I really think Buddy and Gailey were two smart, tough guys who were waiting for the right chance to run a show the way they knew they could, to build a team as they saw fit - and I don't think they'll let themselves down here. This will be their legacy, and that is why I like their hirings so much - because they are both are dignified, smart guys who haven't been given credit for what they've done, and now have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

[Malazan]

I think people are expecting miracles from Gailey. These are people who *want* failure so they can have another reason to explain why they are miserable...like 'WOMEN DRIVERS' or 'DAMN LIBERALS/CONSERVATIVES'. If they don't have such a reason than they have to evaluate other areas of life. These are not 'Bills Fans', these are people who need an external stimulation in life and if the team is losing, they have a harder time coping with their daily lives. 'Fans' by their nature, want their team to win, but are 'fans' regardless.

 

 

 

Anyways, I don't expect Gailey/Nix to turn this team into a powerhouse. I expect them to restore credibility to the organization. The reason I wanted Cowher is not because I thought he'd win a Superbowl, but that he'd instill a football culture and bring contacts to the team so they have the resources to hire better personnel.

 

The problem with Levy as a GM is he didn't know anybody. He didn't have a reserve of talent to call on to coach the team or help with personnel decisions.

 

If Nix/Gailey can manage to make the Bills a legitimate team again then mission accomplished. Otherwise, it's Raider town.

[mpl6876]

Of course we're just speculating on how the Bills will do; and it does matter if they win, as far as how successful a coach Chan Gailey ends up being here. However, we can see some things taking shape now - the mentality he's instilling, the toughness, the confidence. Jauron was frustratingly weak. When he spoke it made you wonder how he could lead anyone. That matters. The Jet's Ryan, although irritating in his arrogance, still, motivates his players to play because he's telling them they had better be the best, they had better out play anyone - quite contrary to "it's hard to win a single game in this league". So, yeah, Gailey has already done some things.

 

I like the players he's brought in. If you were looking at he 2009 Bills and had to fix them, I'd say improving the run defense would be high on the list. It looks like we'll be a much harder team to run on, and if we can get to the QB, we should be a terror for opposing QB's with our secondary. Also, playing to a strength - the running game. We ran o.k. last year and everyone knew we couldn't pass. I think we've got better recievers in our young guys than people think. I see a young Green Bay receiver corps when I look at our guys, or a young New Orleans team - they're fast, and now their pretty good sized, and they can catch. Run and stop the run. I think we'll do that well this year. To top that, though, we're going to see what the young guys can do on the O-line, at WR, at QB, and going into next year we'll know what we need to run the kind of game plan Nix and Gailey want. That's good for year one, IMO.

 

Football isn't rocket science - but, these athletes are so close, talent wise, that winning and losing are decided by very little. I'm thinking that with what we have right now we could make a wild card run. I'm thinking that Nix and Gailey are bringing back to Buffalo what we haven't had since the days of Pollian - legitimate organization and know-how. Just look at what Miami did in one year. Look at what Harbough brought to Baltimore - now they're one of the top organizations in the league. I really think Buddy and Gailey were two smart, tough guys who were waiting for the right chance to run a show the way they knew they could, to build a team as they saw fit - and I don't think they'll let themselves down here. This will be their legacy, and that is why I like their hirings so much - because they are both are dignified, smart guys who haven't been given credit for what they've done, and now have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

 

 

Well, I must say that was well said. Perhaps, you should consider getting a PR position with the Bills front office.

 

I don't share your optimistic view but I respect it. I sure hope your right?

[NoSaint]

The correct logical reasoning, unfortunately, would be that if even great college coaches have trouble in the NFL, than average college coaches will fail Miserably. We shall see...

 

 

actually, the original poster (if i remember correctly) was probably the closest to being right -- college and pro are not like going from AAA baseball to pro. Theres a lot of differences, and things that work in college, wont in pro, and vice versa. The gap in talent on teams, recruitment, and dealing with men instead of boys all make coaching very different at the two levels. its more then just x's and o's -- although those change too.

 

i believe its possible to not be great in college, and great in the pros. clearly there is a relationship, but i would guess the correlation is not near what people would think

[JohnC]

Marv stated he never med Jauron before he interviewed him. Even if that is false, the bigger point is that unlike Cowher with Gailey, Marv had never worked with Jauron before.

 

As for the hiring of Levy as GM, after the widely-praised hiring of TD, only to see it fail and Ralph lose trust in an "outsider," he turned to the coach of his team during the glory years. Not so "goofey" (sic) as you make it out to be.

 

And as for giving him a contract extenion after the 5-0 start, that's understandable as well. And certainly not as dumb as defending (not you) giving players $1B over 5 years and willing to risk a lockout/strike.

 

Whether Levy knew of or met DJ before he hired him is not important. The substance of the matter is that Levy hired him. To be very and kind and gentle DJ was not successful.

 

You are correct that after the Donahoe debacle the goofy owner lost trust in hiring another "outsider". So his remedy was to hire a former "insider" who was in a meaningful way out of the NFL for almost a decade. Any way you assess the brief Levy era it was even more of a disaster than the Donahoe stint.

 

What was even more odd than giving DJ an extension was that the organization refused to acknowlege the fact that they gave him an extension. Shortly after the very quiet extension was given the Bills went into a deep tailspin. The longer it went on the more reluctant the organization was in admitting that they gave the HC an extension. Eventually, they had to admit that the owner gave him an extension and were stuck with him longer than they really wanted to have him.

 

It is difficult for any franchise to win when the front office is in a state of tumult. When the owner makes off the wall decisions ( ex. marketing guru presiding over the football operations) you shouldn't expect a very competent and stable operation.

[JohnC]

It sure seems that way indeed. In fifty years of Bills football we have had 3 really good football coaches on this team. Saban, Knox and Levy. You can throw in Wade Phillips too but I for one am not a big fan of Wade as a HC. Buter Ramsey might not have bneen too bad considering the players he had from 60-62.

 

Now look at the bad ones .. John Rauch, Jope Collier, Harvey Johnson, Jim Ringo, Kay Stephenson, Hank Boullough, Greggggo Williams, Mike Mularkey, and Dick Jauron. At least Collier, Williams and Mularkey are accomplished coordinators in the NFL. Ringo was a good OL position coach anf that is it. Jauron a good secondary coach and that is it. Rauch was crap at Oakland and here. Stephaneson and hammer'in Hank should never have been given an NFL coaching job. Johnson was a thrown in after other coaches were fired in mid season.

 

Oveall a pretty sad crew.

 

John Rauch's coaching approach was outright ludicrous. The Bills drafted O.J. Simpson with the first pick in the draft. How did he use O.J.? He used him as a DECOY! After his firing Ralph hired Lou Saban. Saban told O.J. that he was going to run him until he dropped. Saban was smart enough to focus his drafts on bulking up the OL and then utilizing OJ to the maximum.

 

Knox did an excellent job of restoring credibility to a very struggling franchise. When the owner was very tight fisted with his contract offer Knox decided to leave. Ralph is Ralph.

[Doc]

Whether Levy knew of or met DJ before he hired him is not important. The substance of the matter is that Levy hired him. To be very and kind and gentle DJ was not successful.

We know Levy hired Jauron. The actual substance of the matter is he had never coached with him, unlike Cowher and Gailey.

You are correct that after the Donahoe debacle the goofy owner lost trust in hiring another "outsider". So his remedy was to hire a former "insider" who was in a meaningful way out of the NFL for almost a decade. Any way you assess the brief Levy era it was even more of a disaster than the Donahoe stint.

How do you figure? The Bills had a higher winning percentage under Marv/Brandon/Jauron than TD/Williams/Mularkey. The widely-hailed GM hire turned out worse than the "goofy" GM hires.

What was even more odd than giving DJ an extension was that the organization refused to acknowlege the fact that they gave him an extension. Shortly after the very quiet extension was given the Bills went into a deep tailspin. The longer it went on the more reluctant the organization was in admitting that they gave the HC an extension. Eventually, they had to admit that the owner gave him an extension and were stuck with him longer than they really wanted to have him.

 

It is difficult for any franchise to win when the front office is in a state of tumult. When the owner makes off the wall decisions ( ex. marketing guru presiding over the football operations) you shouldn't expect a very competent and stable operation.

The Bills don't discuss contracts for players OR coaches. And I hope you're not saying that as a result of signing the extension, the Bills started losing.

[mob16151]

Bad logic. Because some great college coaches flame out in the NFL, you take that to mean that a mediocre (at best) college coach will be successful in the NFL. A classic logical fallacy, my friend.

 

Gailey's "rep at Dallas" was uneven, despite the Jerry Jones quote you love to cite. Yes his teams made it to the postseason - but they were also boring and, at times, unprepared in key situations.

 

If were only unprepared at times, well then were already like a 100 times better.

[JohnC]

We know Levy hired Jauron. The actual substance of the matter is he had never coached with him, unlike Cowher and Gailey.

 

I will repeat my original point. GM Levy hired an incapable HC. One of the most important duties of a GM, whether he is a real or fictitious GM, is to hire the HC. Levy's hire was disasterous, as were the drafts and free agent acquisitions during his very brief but damaging tenure.

 

How do you figure? The Bills had a higher winning percentage under Marv/Brandon/Jauron than TD/Williams/Mularkey. The widely-hailed GM hire turned out worse than the "goofy" GM hires.

 

The decision by the baron owner to bring in a very ill-equipped Levy to turn things around after the Donahoe stint was a dismal failure. Two years plus the one year of the Brandon stint were wasted in moving the franchise in the right direction. Do you doubt that if the mercurial owner would have hired a knowledgeable football person such as Nix after the Donahoe fiasco (a Wilson hire) the Bills would be much further along to restoring credibility to this very lackluster franchse?

 

The Bills don't discuss contracts for players OR coaches.

Not acknowledging an extension to a HC is weird. It is a symbol of the insular and chicken poop nature of the operation.

 

And I hope you're not saying that as a result of signing the extension, the Bills started losing.

 

I am absolutely not saying that. The Bills started losing at a very staggering rate because they lacked talent and the coaching was below average. The owner and organization grossly miscalculated how bad the team actually was. That shouldn't be too surprising because they miscalculate on draft picks, free agent acquisitions, coaches and negotiating value based contracts.

 

My point is very simple and obvious: The Bills have been mired in long term mediocrity because of the caliber of ownership and the wretched decisions he and the organization make.

[Doc]

I will repeat my original point. GM Levy hired an incapable HC. One of the most important duties of a GM, whether he is a real or fictitious GM, is to hire the HC. Levy's hire was disasterous, as were the drafts and free agent acquisitions during his very brief but damaging tenure.

The context to which I responded was the claim that Cowher recommending Gailey didn't mean much because Levy hired Jauron. In light of that, the fact that Cowher worked with Gailey while Levy had never met Jauron, much less worked with him, is an important distinction.

The decision by the baron owner to bring in a very ill-equipped Levy to turn things around after the Donahoe stint was a dismal failure. Two years plus the one year of the Brandon stint were wasted in moving the franchise in the right direction. Do you doubt that if the mercurial owner would have hired a knowledgeable football person such as Nix after the Donahoe fiasco (a Wilson hire) the Bills would be much further along to restoring credibility to this very lackluster franchse?

Once again John, the Bills had a higher winning percentage under Levy/Brandon/Jauron than TD/Williams/Mularkey, John. And again, TD was a widely-hailed hire by the Bills that didn't work out. There was no "goofiness" to that hire. Yet it produced worse results than the "goofy" hires. Your attempts to pin blame on the ownership are funny, but hey, everyone needs a scapegoat.

Not acknowledging an extension to a HC is weird. It is a symbol of the insular and chicken poop nature of the operation.

What significance does not announcing the extension until December of that season have to anything? The fact is it has nothing to do with anything.

I am absolutely not saying that. The Bills started losing at a very staggering rate because they lacked talent and the coaching was below average. The owner and organization grossly miscalculated how bad the team actually was. That shouldn't be too surprising because they miscalculate on draft picks, free agent acquisitions, coaches and negotiating value based contracts.

 

My point is very simple and obvious: The Bills have been mired in long term mediocrity because of the caliber of ownership and the wretched decisions he and the organization make.

Maybe one day he'll get smart and order more video cameras and HGH, or have the Bills be the worst team and get the 1st overall pick in the draft again, or somehow make Buffalo an attractive place to be for GM's, coaches, and players. But I doubt it.

[Mr. WEO]

And as for giving him a contract extenion after the 5-0 start, that's understandable as well. And certainly not as dumb as defending (not you) giving players $1B over 5 years and willing to risk a lockout/strike.

No, it was an idiotic move to resign this career loser after a handful of consecutive wins. It was apparent to the many who said so back then. You still can't come to grips with the fact that you were wrong about it ("hot free agent"!).

 

Nice non sequitor re: the CBA---ouch! Jury's still out on that one, doc. Keep your fingers crossed!

[Doc]

No, it was an idiotic move to resign this career loser after a handful of consecutive wins. It was apparent to the many who said so back then. You still can't come to grips with the fact that you were wrong about it ("hot free agent"!).

The team looked like it was going to do well that season, hence jumping on the contract extension early. Again, it was understandable but proved to be a mistake, thanks in large part to Trent regressing badly (limiting his throws wouldn't have helped him, BTW). As for the "hot free agent" part, WTF?

 

Nice non sequitor re: the CBA---ouch! Jury's still out on that one, doc. Keep your fingers crossed!

Oh, the irony. You still haven't come to grips that you were wrong about the CBA. The jury left a long time ago and the courtroom is dusty. You are the only one left on the courthouse steps. But hey, what else is new?

[Talley56]

Brian Billick had plenty of lousy seasons, one year he had one of the best defenses in NFL history and won a superbowl. His offenses in Baltimore havent been great by any means. His success in Baltimore had alot to do with him being lucky to have great players on his team. I have never been impressed by him nor do I care to listen to him on NFL network.

Billick really only had like one or two lousy seasons there. Every other year the Ravens were in the playoffs or in the hunt. As for the great players he was "lucky" to have, how did they do before he got there?

[ChasBB]

One thing that I find interesting about Chan's current situation is that, unlike when he joined the Cowboys, this time he had the opportunity to bring in a COMPLETE new coaching staff. When he took over as HC at Dallas, Dave Campo was already there as the DC and was well-respected. Therefore, Chan didn't really have an opportunity to put his own stamp on both sides of the ball (and not suggesting that he necessarily should have in that particular case). However, in Buffalo, he had full control to bring in a complete staff. This entire staff has Chan Gailey's stamp of approval on it. I just find it interesting because this is really Chan's first opportunity in the NFL ranks to exert this much power and control. By all appearances, he has selected some excellent coaches -- especially Edwards as DC. If nothing else, this is going to be a very interesting season.

 

Edit: Gailey also had to deal with a QB (Aikman) who resented the new coach changing the whole playbook. He doesn't have to deal with that here (of course would be nice to have Aikman's talent on hand).

[Mr. WEO]

The team looked like it was going to do well that season, hence jumping on the contract extension early. Again, it was understandable but proved to be a mistake, thanks in large part to Trent regressing badly (limiting his throws wouldn't have helped him, BTW). As for the "hot free agent" part, WTF?

 

 

Oh, the irony. You still haven't come to grips that you were wrong about the CBA. The jury left a long time ago and the courtroom is dusty. You are the only one left on the courthouse steps. But hey, what else is new?

Oh, that's right--the league spent a billion more than they would have despite teams not spending to the cap and there being hundreds of millions of dollars of cap money laying around. And all players, wait---not all players got more money as a result of the CBA.

 

The "new CBA" included a span of time where the owners made more money than over any other such period in the league's history. The poor guys! And their labor costs didn't even cost them the 59.5% they agreed to "give" to the players.

 

Even if they had given that kind of money, 60% for labor costs in a nonmanufacturing business is par for the course. My employer, the 6th largest in NY State, has a 60% labor cost. It doesn't clear as much as the Bills each year (comes close).