DC Tom Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Jim, polio was declared extinct on every continent save the wilds of Africa decades ago. I think there is more information to learn than just taking the stance that all vaccines are always good in every way, like most posters on this thread have suggested. No, it wasn't. And vaccination is a public health practice, not an individual health practice. You need something like a 95% vaccination rate in a population to prevent the establishment of a disease in that population. Less than that, and vaccination isn't effective, even on an individual basis. There's a reason upper-class areas of California see epidemics of preventable childhood diseases: vaccination rates run in the 70% range in those areas. There are third-world countries that have better vaccination rates than San Diego. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Since other posters assume that although the main source of mercury ingestion in this country is through shots, shots do not cause autism, what does? Why have rates of autism risen so dramatically? Because the definition of autism has changed to become much broader. 40 years ago, "autism" was "social impairment with intellectual impairment". Nowadays, it refers to a broad spectrum of disorders including Asperger's, Rett's, and "pervasive developmental disorder not otherwise specified" (which translates to: any child with retarded development of social skills.) When I was 5, I was safely NOT autistic; nowadays, the five year old I was would very certainly be diagnosed as autistic, as I exhibited: - impaired ability to make friends with peers - impaired ability to initiate or sustain a conversation with others - absence or impairment of imaginative and social play - restricted patterns of interest that are abnormal in intensity or focus It's not even remotely a result of vaccinations; it's purely the result of a changing diagnostic definition. Doubt that? Then explain why 80% of all children diagnosed with autism are male - are boys vaccinated at four times the rate as girls? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeviF Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 That was one of the fears with the piggy flu. God I hate the media. I couldn't care less about getting the !@#$ing flu. I take care of myself, I'm healthy, I could battle through it. It's the crippling and extremely-high-rate-of-death diseases that I would worry about, Polio being one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 I couldn't care less about getting the !@#$ing flu. I take care of myself, I'm healthy, I could battle through it. It's the crippling and extremely-high-rate-of-death diseases that I would worry about, Polio being one of them. You'd be surprised at how devastating even a 2% mortality rate is, though. In 1918-1919, Philly saw a 1% case mortality rate from the flu (about 0.5% overall), and nearly fell apart. And modern cities are MUCH more fragile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 I couldn't care less about getting the !@#$ing flu. I take care of myself, I'm healthy, I could battle through it. It's the crippling and extremely-high-rate-of-death diseases that I would worry about, Polio being one of them. Ooooookay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Because the definition of autism has changed to become much broader. 40 years ago, "autism" was "social impairment with intellectual impairment". Nowadays, it refers to a broad spectrum of disorders including Asperger's, Rett's, and "pervasive developmental disorder not otherwise specified" (which translates to: any child with retarded development of social skills.) When I was 5, I was safely NOT autistic; nowadays, the five year old I was would very certainly be diagnosed as autistic, as I exhibited: - impaired ability to make friends with peers - impaired ability to initiate or sustain a conversation with others - absence or impairment of imaginative and social play - restricted patterns of interest that are abnormal in intensity or focus It's not even remotely a result of vaccinations; it's purely the result of a changing diagnostic definition. Doubt that? Then explain why 80% of all children diagnosed with autism are male - are boys vaccinated at four times the rate as girls? Some things never change man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 When I was 5, I was safely NOT autistic; nowadays, the five year old I was would very certainly be diagnosed as autistic, as I exhibited:- impaired ability to make friends with peers - impaired ability to initiate or sustain a conversation with others - absence or impairment of imaginative and social play - restricted patterns of interest that are abnormal in intensity or focus So not much has changed since 5... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted June 24, 2010 Author Share Posted June 24, 2010 Jim, polio was declared extinct on every continent save the wilds of Africa decades ago. I think there is more information to learn than just taking the stance that all vaccines are always good in every way, like most posters on this thread have suggested. I realize you're trying to be provocative, but... About 5000 cases reported each year (nevermind those that go unreported) in Africa and South Asia. How long do you think it would take for that to increase exponentially if nobody vaccinated? It's a small world afterall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeviF Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 You'd be surprised at how devastating even a 2% mortality rate is, though. In 1918-1919, Philly saw a 1% case mortality rate from the flu (about 0.5% overall), and nearly fell apart. And modern cities are MUCH more fragile. I was more talking about immediate effects on my person Point taken, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 I was more talking about immediate effects on my person Point taken, though. Hey, I found Murra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hossage Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 I realize you're trying to be provocative, but... About 5000 cases reported each year (nevermind those that go unreported) in Africa and South Asia. How long do you think it would take for that to increase exponentially if nobody vaccinated? It's a small world afterall. I am not trying to be provocative, I am not wrong about the prevalence of polio as a poster has suggested, and I am not suggesting people eschew polio vaccinations. I did not say that. Nor did I say autism was linked to shots, ad DC Tom suggested I did. DC Tom, it is a logical fallacy to assume that distribution of a disease between the sexes would mean vaccinations are or are not at fault,because not all diseases are distributed equally to start with. Let us remember that the swine flu was completely extinct, but was reintroduced to people through Baxter Labs company in Mexico. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Are you related to Connor??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Hey, I found Murra. Well done! Tom is not autistic. His post shows how much he cares he loves us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeviF Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Hey, I found Murra. Nice comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 I am not trying to be provocative, I am not wrong about the prevalence of polio as a poster has suggested, and I am not suggesting people eschew polio vaccinations. I did not say that. Nor did I say autism was linked to shots, ad DC Tom suggested I did. DC Tom, it is a logical fallacy to assume that distribution of a disease between the sexes would mean vaccinations are or are not at fault,because not all diseases are distributed equally to start with. Let us remember that the swine flu was completely extinct, but was reintroduced to people through Baxter Labs company in Mexico. You're too stupid to discuss this. Seriously. The above contains, in order, two factual errors, a completely irrational statement that contradicts your own previous statements, and two more ridiculously false statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hossage Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Sure, tom. I will give you that you did not suggest I said autism was linked to shots. Your post merely juxtaposed my accusation that people think that with an answer. I misinterpreted the intent of your gender statement because I found it to be logically fallacious and meaningless. I should have tried to understand your intent more carefully. It also occurs to me that I should have said polio is extinct in the civilized world rather than everywhere except the wilds of Africa. Other than that, we appear to disagree enormously on fact. You have lamely expressed this as my stupidity. Please try to raise the level of discourse. I dont want to bother trying to win an argument with you by restating with research what I think because I think you being a snatch. Whatever, this is the internet. Happy posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 An ultra gay avatar and no idea of what you are talking about. You have to be related to Connor! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hossage Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 An ultra gay avatar and no idea of what you are talking about. You have to be related to Connor! I think everyone should hope to be as manly as this hot mess of Manicorn. I bet you wish you had chaps like this and your bare buttocks airbrushed purple. Beyond that, enlighten me, because anonymous, unsupported claims wear thin pretty quickly, even on the internet. Manicorn, baby. Drink it in. http://www.hockeydrunk.com/lol/manicorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 I understand your point, it is rare, but still exists. If all vaccines were stopped, it would take only one "typhoid Mary" to spread it to the general population. And on the record, I have and never will get a "flu" vaccine. I do not blanket endorse any and all vaccines. Yeah I understand wanting to only get the necessary vaccinations. If you don't want to take flu shots or secondary vaccinations (Chicken pox shots and other non-required shots) I understand not wanting to add any other shots just to avoid the risk for minimal gain. BUT not getting the shots for rubella, measles, polio, and other required by law is just stupid in my opinion there is no proven link for autism and the other risks are so minimal that there is nothing logically that should stop you from getting the core vaccinations. Also I never got flu shots either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster4324 Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 Nice comparison. Sorry, I was joking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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