I joined the dark side...

[Chilly]

See Bluefire's post.

 

And my time isn't free. OSX requires next to zero setup and less maintenance. IF I jumped back to Linux, I'd have to learn and setup 7-8 programs that I've already got workign the way I like...and go through the entire Linux install, which is a PIA. Plus get code-intimate, which is completely unnecessary.

 

Setup's super easy now in Ubuntu, no command-line or code knowledge required.

[Fezmid]

Setup's super easy now in Ubuntu, no command-line or code knowledge required.

 

So says the guy getting a Mac.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

So says the guy getting a Mac.

 

 

burn

[John Adams]

Setup's super easy now in Ubuntu, no command-line or code knowledge required.

 

I setup a Linux machine (actually a Linux partition in an old HP) in 1998-9 so I have no doubt it's come a long ways in 11 years.

 

Still, I have momentum in Mac, which is conveniently compatible with several programs I'm married to. Plus, I can't think of a single complaint about my Mac besides its price, which doesn't phase me. (Maybe because I remember buying a Pentium 150 for 3 grand).

 

I use a PC at work and would ditch it in a heartbeat given a choice. Windows has come a long way but it's still not great.

[BuffaloBill]

I use a PC at work and would ditch it in a heartbeat given a choice. Windows has come a long way but it's still not great.

 

 

Amen

[Chilly]

So says the guy getting a Mac.

 

Because OOo sux

[Fezmid]

Because OOo sux

Weren't you the one telling everyone to install it a couple of years ago?

 

And I don't blame OOo - I blame MS for changing their format. Worked fine before. (luckily, still works fine for me! )

[GG]

If you went with the Rackspace solution, you could just pm me and I'd go bop Travis on the head.

 

Is he the guy who runs on the treadmill to ensure 100% uptime?

 

Or you could go with a SoftLayer solution

[The Dean]

Weren't you the one telling everyone to install it a couple of years ago?

 

And I don't blame OOo - I blame MS for changing their format. Worked fine before. (luckily, still works fine for me! )

 

 

I have virtually no issues with OpenOffice (although I'm a bit worried what will happen now that Oracle is branding it and even selling a version of it). But for those who use spreadsheets with complicated macros, or certain PP presentations, there can be some problems.

 

As for the changes to MS Office, most people hate it at first, but come around if they are intensive users. I even hear it is a bit easier to learn, if you've never used the old version. For me it's just a nuisance, though. That friggin' ribbon is obnoxious.

[Dan]

I have virtually no issues with OpenOffice (although I'm a bit worried what will happen now that Oracle is branding it and even selling a version of it). But for those who use spreadsheets with complicated macros, or certain PP presentations, there can be some problems.

 

As for the changes to MS Office, most people hate it at first, but come around if they are intensive users. I even hear it is a bit easier to learn, if you've never used the old version. For me it's just a nuisance, though. That friggin' ribbon is obnoxious.

I hope to never upgrade to Office 2007. I absolutely hate it. I've installed it on quite a few work computers for other people, thinking we should begin to get used to it. But, I'm hoping at some point in the future they'll realize that ribbon idea with all the stupid icons is just plain dumb and counterintuitive.

 

My biggest beef... they keep making changes just for the sake of making changes. Is the program actually any more stable, faster, smaller hard drive foot print? Something? All I see are new colors, everything moved around, and entirely too much pre-formatting of text. Just because I type 1. doesn't mean I want a bulleted list. Why turn my websites and emails into blue, underlined links? I hate that and all the other preformatted we know what your writing should like cap.

 

Maybe it's just the control freak in me, but I like to control my computer not the other way around.

 

Which, incidentlly, is why I've always preferred Macs. The software on them is much, more intuitive and the programs don't take over your computer, installing crap all over the place and automatically restarting your computer running in the background. In recent years, they've lost some of that but its still light years better than a Windows PC. (never used Linux, so no idea about it) Of course, Apple's very strict software standards, while making for a much more stable platform, has the downside of causing software developers to hire a separate group of developers which runs the price up.

[Fezmid]

My biggest beef... they keep making changes just for the sake of making changes. Is the program actually any more stable, faster, smaller hard drive foot print? Something?

One feature I actually do like in Office 2007 is that if you highlight a block of text, and then hover over the various changes (font, font size, color, etc), it shows a great preview of what it will look like. Don't like what you see, then don't click on the new color, font, etc. Pretty handy.

 

The context menu (right mouse click) has a lot more helpful tools as well.

 

The ribbon is still lame.

 

Maybe it's just the control freak in me, but I like to control my computer not the other way around.

 

Which, incidentlly, is why I've always preferred Macs. The software on them is much, more intuitive and the programs don't take over your computer, installing crap all over the place and automatically restarting your computer running in the background.

 

Most of those complaints aren't OS related, but are application related. In your example, Word is auto formatting (you can turn that off); it's occasionally helpful but also frequently annoying. The OS doesn't install crap all over the place either - those are the applications you choose to install that do that. Yes, when you buy a PC from HP or Dell, there's crap installed all over the place, but why do you think it's so cheap? They subsidize the cost with advertising. Buy your own copy of Windows 7, install that, and you won't have the crud factor.

 

Most things people blame on the OS have absolutely nothing to do with the OS...

[Fingon]

I hope to never upgrade to Office 2007. I absolutely hate it. I've installed it on quite a few work computers for other people, thinking we should begin to get used to it. But, I'm hoping at some point in the future they'll realize that ribbon idea with all the stupid icons is just plain dumb and counterintuitive.

 

My biggest beef... they keep making changes just for the sake of making changes. Is the program actually any more stable, faster, smaller hard drive foot print? Something? All I see are new colors, everything moved around, and entirely too much pre-formatting of text. Just because I type 1. doesn't mean I want a bulleted list. Why turn my websites and emails into blue, underlined links? I hate that and all the other preformatted we know what your writing should like cap.

 

Maybe it's just the control freak in me, but I like to control my computer not the other way around.

 

Which, incidentlly, is why I've always preferred Macs. The software on them is much, more intuitive and the programs don't take over your computer, installing crap all over the place and automatically restarting your computer running in the background. In recent years, they've lost some of that but its still light years better than a Windows PC. (never used Linux, so no idea about it) Of course, Apple's very strict software standards, while making for a much more stable platform, has the downside of causing software developers to hire a separate group of developers which runs the price up.

Why the hell do you use a Mac then? They're the least functional of the 3, and are for the computer illiterate. You have far more control over Windows and Linux.

 

It sounds like you need to learn a little bit more about computers. Someone who is knowledgeable can build something in a few hours that is far faster, and cheaper than any Mac.

[Chilly]

Why the hell do you use a Mac then? They're the least functional of the 3, and are for the computer illiterate. You have far more control over Windows and Linux.

 

That's not exactly true, if you know unix/bsd. Mac OS X comes with all the standard command-line tools.

[Dan]

One feature I actually do like in Office 2007 is that if you highlight a block of text, and then hover over the various changes (font, font size, color, etc), it shows a great preview of what it will look like. Don't like what you see, then don't click on the new color, font, etc. Pretty handy.

 

The context menu (right mouse click) has a lot more helpful tools as well.

 

The ribbon is still lame.

 

Most of those complaints aren't OS related, but are application related. In your example, Word is auto formatting (you can turn that off); it's occasionally helpful but also frequently annoying. The OS doesn't install crap all over the place either - those are the applications you choose to install that do that. Yes, when you buy a PC from HP or Dell, there's crap installed all over the place, but why do you think it's so cheap? They subsidize the cost with advertising. Buy your own copy of Windows 7, install that, and you won't have the crud factor.

 

Most things people blame on the OS have absolutely nothing to do with the OS...

Excellent point. I didn't mean to blame the OS; it was the various software prgrams that cause the majority of the problems that I meant to refer to. However, it is the less stringent requirements of Windows that allows programmers to get "lazy". But, like I said that keeps the price down. So I guess its a trade off.

 

I also agree. The best way is to buy a blank computer and install all things, including Windows. I've done that a few times. It actually takes me less time to install everything, fresh, on a blank drive than it does to delete and deconfigure a pre-setup Dell or godforbid HP machine. HP's have to be thte worst!

 

 

 

Why the hell do you use a Mac then? They're the least functional of the 3, and are for the computer illiterate. You have far more control over Windows and Linux.

 

It sounds like you need to learn a little bit more about computers. Someone who is knowledgeable can build something in a few hours that is far faster, and cheaper than any Mac.

I'd disagee, very much. They can be for the computer illiterate. But, if you know what you're doing you can change almost every aspect of the OS and the way many programs work within in. The majority of Mac owners, I know are quite computer literate and go through all levels of customizing their machines.

 

There's a misconception that Macs are not serious computers, although that's completely not true. As well as, the misconception that Macs are for people that don't really want to do "work" on their computer (hence the commercials with the business guy vs the "cool" guy). Funny thing though, why are all the good games only for non-Macs? Intersting but a side point.

 

Certainly, Macs are more expensive. By far the most expensive, I'll say. But, if you have the cash to splash and buy a top of the line maxed out Mac; you'll be hard pressed to find a faster, more robust personal computer.

 

Granted you can build your own and usually beat all pricing and specs, but what percentage of computer users build their own? We're not talking about that crowd at all; I would think. Like i've always said: buy the computer that does what you need. Why buy a top of the line 64bit quad processors when for the next year 90% of your use will be with an old 32bit application? Some buy for price, some for certain software, some for looks, some for portability, to each his own.

[Fezmid]

That's not exactly true, if you know unix/bsd. Mac OS X comes with all the standard command-line tools.

 

I took a Photoshop course a few years ago and it was on a Mac (with a mouse with only one button, I might add). The first thing I did was bring up Firefox and figure out how to get a command line shell. When it came to backing our files up, I did an scp to copy them to my home server. The instructor walked by and asked what I was doing. She looked completely confused when I explained, shrugged her shoulders and left.

[The Dean]

I also agree. The best way is to buy a blank computer and install all things, including Windows. I've done that a few times. It actually takes me less time to install everything, fresh, on a blank drive than it does to delete and deconfigure a pre-setup Dell or godforbid HP machine. HP's have to be thte worst!

 

I think a good trade-off in the PC world is Dell's Vostro line. They are sold as small business machines, but are perfect for the home user. They come with very little junk (almost none if you decline antivirus). You can usually get the 200-level package, including a Core 2 Duo processor, 300GB hard drive, 3GB RAM, DVD burner and 20" flat panel monitor, for around $500, sometimes less. Of course, that's with integrated Intel graphics. I'd throw in a bit more RAM and call it a day. You can always upgrade to a real graphics card, but then your best bet may to look for a different model. I've installed quite a few and have had virtually no problems with them (discounting a replacement part or two when they were brand new...but Dell gets the part there in a day or two).

[Dan]

I think a good trade-off in the PC world is Dell's Vostro line. They are sold as small business machines, but are perfect for the home user. They come with very little junk (almost none if you decline antivirus). You can usually get the 200-level package, including a Core 2 Duo processor, 300GB hard drive, 3GB RAM, DVD burner and 20" flat panel monitor, for around $500, sometimes less. Of course, that's with integrated Intel graphics. I'd throw in a bit more RAM and call it a day. You can always upgrade to a real graphics card, but then your best bet may to look for a different model. I've installed quite a few and have had virtually no problems with them (discounting a replacement part or two when they were brand new...but Dell gets the part there in a day or two).

I got one of those for an office, I believe upon your advice, a wile back. Thanks!

 

You're completely right. There are some good, solid, affordable machines out there. I just think Macs can have their place as well. You'll pay more, but for some people price is less of an issue

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

I got one of those for an office, I believe upon your advice, a wile back. Thanks!

 

You're completely right. There are some good, solid, affordable machines out there. I just think Macs can have their place as well. You'll pay more, but for some people price is less of an issue

 

My sister has one. Embarrassment to the family.

 

I don't know where people get the idea that PCs are unstable or crash-prone. I've run PCs on Windows and Linux forever, and haven't had one that's lock- or crash-prone.

[The Dean]

I got one of those for an office, I believe upon your advice, a wile back. Thanks!

 

You're completely right. There are some good, solid, affordable machines out there. I just think Macs can have their place as well. You'll pay more, but for some people price is less of an issue

 

 

Sure they do. I really don't understand OS snobbery, anyway. When my clients or friends ask me if they should consider getting a Mac, I try to give them honest and objective advice. Some end up getting Mac and more get PCs.

 

My buddy's daughter wanted a Mac notebook and he really didn't want to spend the extra $$. (Background: A couple of years ago HE thought he should get a Mac based on some problems he had with his old PC. But after listening to my advice he bought a PC, which I set up and occasionally maintain and he is THRILLED with it.) But as it turns out, her school is partial to Mac and many of her friends use Macs as well. She is into graphic design, as well.

 

Well, there really isn't much (if anything) she needs to to that couldn't be accomplished on a PC, but in her case a Mac probably makes sense, as it will be easier for her to learn and collaborate with friends and teachers who are Mac-based. And since she wants one, will be happier and less likely to grouse about "her computer" when something goes wrong. Yes, he is paying more upfront, but in the long run I think it is worth it.

 

On the other hand, another friend's daughter wants a Mac "because it is cool". A relatively foolish reason to spend an extra $600-$1000, IMO. But then again, I don't have kids.

[Chilly]

I have to say, I'm really enjoying this mac so far.

 

When I want some power under the hood, I can use the terminal. It even has my favorite scripting language, PHP, built in. However, for day-to-day stuff, Mac OS X works great.