Nervous Guy Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Find a reference stating that sales are declining. The only thing I've heard is that it's not increasing as quickly as before (ie: We used to see 10% sales growth a year, now it's only 6%). I'd be interested in seeing if I misheard/understood the sales data. CW 144243[/snapback] also could be that music nowadays sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nervous Guy Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Probably NG made that judgement to him in person, but doesn't want to type it... 144222[/snapback] hmmm....is that a judgement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gross Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Been so long since I took my drivers test, but it used to be, if you did one illegal thing they failed you immediately. Exceed the speed limit, failed. Run a stop sign, past the line, failed. The judging was only based on the "quality" of your driving. 144219[/snapback] A buddy of mine was taking his test. They were on a narrow (but two-way) street that ran behind a row of shops, and a delivery truck was parked behind one of the shops, eating up most of the lane. My buddy went over the solid line to get past the parked truck, and was failed for it. In my test, I might have hit the curb on the parallel park, if there didn't happen to be a driveway where I backed up... As far as Jack's driver's ed experience, sounds like it would be enough to make a mierable prick out of someone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyLee Posted December 3, 2004 Author Share Posted December 3, 2004 That wasn't the question. The question was, if you found out that his downloading of songs/movies/etc WAS illegal, would you tell him not to do it? We understand that you don't think it's illegal (even though you've been given tons of examples to the contrary). But if you believed that it were, would you care? CW 143957[/snapback] I already said no, Fez. Even if I believed it were illegal, like Mickey says, it's not enforceable. Deal with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 also could be that music nowadays sucks. 144253[/snapback] I could agree with that. Course thats just my judgment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nervous Guy Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 I could agree with that. Course thats just my judgment. 144264[/snapback] but that doesn't make you a horrible human being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 I could agree with that. Course thats just my judgment. 144264[/snapback] Actually in this case I believe it is factual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyLee Posted December 3, 2004 Author Share Posted December 3, 2004 Maybe the little thing that's called "paying for an item you bought" When was the last time you got a shared" item off eBay?Keep rationalaiing it. 144087[/snapback] I got a burned copy (not for me silly) on ebay of Eminem's very first record that he sold out of the trunk of his car before he hit it big. This was about 6 months ago I bought it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 I already said no, Fez. Even if I believed it were illegal, like Mickey says, it's not enforceable. Deal with it. 144258[/snapback] Fair enough. It actually is enforcable however, it's just not enforcable on a large scale. For example: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,96797,00.html http://news.com.com/RIAA+settles+with+12-y..._3-5073717.html So while your chances of being sued are 0.0005% (estimated), the risk is there. This should also prove to you that it is, indeed, illegal. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Even if I believed it were illegal, 144258[/snapback] What? Tracy - it's not whether you believe something is illegal or not. This isn't church - your beliefs mean squat. It IS illegal. Your son owns movies that he didn't pay for. As much as you don't want to think so, downloading music is EXACTLY the same as going into a music store and taking the CD. IT IS EXACTLY THE SAME. The only difference is its much easier from the computer, and you won't get caught. Again, you "believing" it isn't illegal doesn't make it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmac17 Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Find a reference stating that sales are declining. The only thing I've heard is that it's not increasing as quickly as before (ie: We used to see 10% sales growth a year, now it's only 6%). I'd be interested in seeing if I misheard/understood the sales data. CW they are definitely down, though there are different arguments as to why. (walmart and target sell 50% of the cd's in america and keep the prices low...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartshan-83 Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 I don't think it's moral to kill someone for stealing a DVD. I do think the use of force against someone who breaks into my home is moral, however. 143854[/snapback] I agree Tom. I guess it wasn't really directed at you. More at the ones who have supposedly never committed a crime of any sort in their life, but still condone killing someone over a DVD and getting away with it. These threads suck, but hey, that's life. People want to fight, prove their right, nothing wrong with that. Sometimes I just think people are too quick to be hurtful, especially against fellow Bills fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyLee Posted December 3, 2004 Author Share Posted December 3, 2004 Okay, so if you're not sharing back, how is it file sharing? Isn't what you're doing just downloading then? I know when I tell my kids to share, that means they both have to give and take. Where would Kazaa and others be if everyone decided not to share? Don't people in the P2P community look upon people who behave that way as leeches? And why don't you allow him/yourself to share back? 143975[/snapback] Sharing files and downloading shared files is two different things. Someone else may be sharing the files with anyone who wants them but that doesn't mean you have share your own files. There are settings, you can choose to share or not to share weather the other person does or not. You can elect not to share with a person who doesn't share. That's what settings are for. We don't share for the simple reasons of internet security. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 steve...speeding is illegal, downloading is illegal...I just think that some people may view these "crimes" as less damaging to society, than say...rape, armed robbery or murder. 143988[/snapback] Let's run with this. You agree that speeding is illegal, but the level of crime is rather harmless. Still, you are not arguing that going over the speed limit is legal. The whole problem with this thread is that Tracy refuses to acknowledge that "sharing" is illegal and has no problem helping out her son's illegal activity. No worries on this end, because in her son's quest to share some free content, they'll probably end up spending $500 in man hours to clean out the crap that will be left on the PC by KaZaa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockpile Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 This is all very interesting...now if I buy a book or a magazine and read it, then share it with a friend, then they share it with a friend and so on is that illegal? 142524[/snapback] What if I tape a Bills game and share it with friends at no cost? What if a friend has HBO and copies the Sopranos for me? What if the radio has a concert on and I record it? That is how I use downloaded music. I am not challenging anyone to a fight, just curious about opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Sharing files and downloading shared files is two different things. Someone else may be sharing the files with anyone who wants them but that doesn't mean you have share your own files. There are settings, you can choose to share or not to share weather the other person does or not. You can elect not to share with a person who doesn't share. That's what settings are for. We don't share for the simple reasons of internet security. 144297[/snapback] There's no way that Tracy is really BF in Indiana is there? Tracy, I tried, I really, really, tried to be nice here and explain things without this damn temper of mine getting the best of me. And it's friday, and I should be relaxed. And I get to go down to start my tailgating in about 5 hours. But seriously: WAKE THE F-CK UP WOMAN!!! Are you serious? Sharing files and downloading shared files is two different things Yes it is. Why? Because it is much easier to get caught when you share, and distributing is a BIGGER felony, but downloading is STILL A FELONY. We don't share for the simple reasons of internet security. BULL sh--! You don't share because, LIKE YOU'VE SAID YOURSELF 100 TIMES, you can get caught that way!! Listen, at this point, I don't care if your son downloads the Bill of Rights and changes the First Admendment from the freedom of speech to The Freedom to Take a dump in my living room - What I really want is for you to please tell me you are kidding when you say you don't think what he's doing is ILLEGAL. It's not an OPINION. IT IS ILLEGAL... And why is Kazaa allowed if Downloading copywrited music/movies isnt? Because you can use Kazaa to share public domain files. The same reason they make ferraris. Sure, the car CAN go 200MPH, but the logic of "it's not illegal or else they wouln't have made it that way" would actually hold up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 have we covered everything yet ?????????? #477 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 What if I tape a Bills game and share it with friends at no cost? What if a friend has HBO and copies the Sopranos for me? What if the radio has a concert on and I record it? That is how I use downloaded music. I am not challenging anyone to a fight, just curious about opinions. 144305[/snapback] Technically, taping the Bills and Sopranos and giving it to someone else is illegal. Recording the concert for your own use is legal. As GG said, the issue in this thread is that TracyLee somehow believes that downloading movies (such as Slap Shot) is legal, which is obviously not the case. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nervous Guy Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Let's run with this. You agree that speeding is illegal, but the level of crime is rather harmless. Still, you are not arguing that going over the speed limit is legal. The whole problem with this thread is that Tracy refuses to acknowledge that "sharing" is illegal and has no problem helping out her son's illegal activity. No worries on this end, because in her son's quest to share some free content, they'll probably end up spending $500 in man hours to clean out the crap that will be left on the PC by KaZaa. 144304[/snapback] if he was a habitual speeder and she paid for his gas, would she be as bad a person? I just see this whole thing as not a huge deal...does that make me a bad person? oh and you're right about Kazaa... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gross Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Find a reference stating that sales are declining. The only thing I've heard is that it's not increasing as quickly as before (ie: We used to see 10% sales growth a year, now it's only 6%). I'd be interested in seeing if I misheard/understood the sales data. CW 144243[/snapback] All sorts of info on RIAA.com, including unit sales http://www.riaa.com/news/marketingdata/facts.asp#unit and purchasing trends http://www.riaa.com/news/marketingdata/purchasing.asp An interesting thing to look at is this consumer chart: http://www.riaa.com/news/marketingdata/pdf...umerprofile.pdf If you go down to the age demographics, notice how the numbers tank for the 15-19 group starting in 1999. I'll give you three guesses as to when Napster first went online. If you look at the raw sales numbers: http://www.riaa.com/news/newsletter/pdf/2003yearEnd.pdf you will see that sales growth slowed significantly between 1999 and 2000, and then started to decline. The 2004 mid-year numbers look like they are improving, and the unit sales outpacing the $$ would indicate to me that the "end" to price fixing is evident, combined with the pricing of CD's relative to the established "market" price of downloaded songs. I would say too that the number of sales increasing could potentially be related to the lessened availability of illegal download markets (and yes, fear tactics with lawsuits to back them up...). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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