Tapes of big ben

[NoSaint]

OK, assuming you are a man, let's say BR was going to do you in the cornhole. Would you say "This isn't OK - we shouldn't be doing this" or would you say "STOP! THIS IS RAPE. SOMEBODY HELP ME!" or some such thing?

 

Expressing discomfort with the time, place, or manner of the act is not saying "NO. This is rape."

 

Nothing in that transcript leads me to believe that this young woman is credible.

 

That being said, it is possible she like meant to say like, you know, it wasn't, really like cool. But who knows. Depending on the context, those words could conceivably mean "NO!" It isn't clear.

 

I've seen enough of this board to know that people don't change their minds very often, so this is the last I'll post on this topic. If you think that a person should be charged or prosecuted based on this woman's testimony, then you just don't get it.

 

I'm pretty explicit that I don't know if her story is true, my commentary is that no means no -- whether it's "stop, you are raping me" or "this isn't ok"

 

If you can show me any type of consent in that statement, I'm fine with changing my mind.

[Conch]

No means no. Taking into account he Colorado episode, Ben is a predatory rapist. Those who throw Lynch in the same sentence are just wrong... Lynch is knucklehead.

[milehiLou]

I can't believe how many guys argue that "This isn't ok - we shouldn't being doing this" is a mixed message.... Also is raping a slut somehow a less felonious type of rape? what does her behavior have to do with anything if she said that? I'm not saying I buy her story but come on guys

 

i am in no way condoning rape. a slut, a grandma, a sheep; its all wrong, however....

 

this girl MAY have been a drunk underage PREDATOR who had been following them from bar to bar with hopes of mabybe hooking up with a millionaire, if you dont see both sides of the equation then you are prejudging guilt, maybe this group of upstanding girls used their i phone to wiki big ben, found out that he had a prior, and bam, instant celebrity. its possible. i have dated some real crackpots and would not put this past what any young woman is capable of, especially after a few (or one in many cases) shot of hard alcohol.

[bbb]

She probably said "This isn't - like - OK"

[NoSaint]

i am in no way condoning rape. a slut, a grandma, a sheep; its all wrong, however....

 

this girl MAY have been a drunk underage PREDATOR who had been following them from bar to bar with hopes of mabybe hooking up with a millionaire, if you dont see both sides of the equation then you are prejudging guilt, maybe this group of upstanding girls used their i phone to wiki big ben, found out that he had a prior, and bam, instant celebrity. its possible. i have dated some real crackpots and would not put this past what any young woman is capable of, especially after a few (or one in many cases) shot of hard alcohol.

 

I'm not saying he did it.

 

I'm not saying I believe her.

 

I'm saying that if you take the statement she claimed to make as ambiguous or ok to continue after, you are at risk for rape charges in your personal life. If she said "it's not ok, we shouldn't be doing this" and he continued, then he is a rapist in every sense of the word. I am baffled how many men argue that point.

 

I have no idea what happened in that room so I won't debate it, but we can argue the merits of that phrase regardless of if she ever said it.

[milehiLou]

I'm not saying he did it.

 

I'm not saying I believe her.

 

I'm saying that if you take the statement she claimed to make as ambiguous or ok to continue after, you are at risk for rape charges in your personal life. If she said "it's not ok, we shouldn't be doing this" and he continued, then he is a rapist in every sense of the word. I am baffled how many men argue that point.

 

I have no idea what happened in that room so I won't debate it, but we can argue the merits of that phrase regardless of if she ever said it.

hers is an ambiguous statement, lots of women get off on having sex in public, its the lure of getting caught that may cause this and she might not be one of them, however this is" not ok"and "we shouldnt be doing this" is not "stop". stop, no, dont touch me, im not interested although i saw your penis and ran into a room with a picture on it that i have seen since i was able to decipher a man and woman stick figure, those are all acceptable statements. "we shouldnt be doing this" might mean, i have a boyfriend, im on the rag, my panties are soiled, i have to meet my grandma later, and" this is not ok" could mean many different things as well, like for example maybe big ben is not so big, not ok, maybe she meant she would rather be in his million dollar bed, thats ok. we dont know because she is an absolute twit who cannot remember the most important details of her supposed rape, but remembers to the word, everything else that happened that nite, especially bens 'crude" comment earlier in the nite, but cant remember is her face was plastered against cold tile or the unshaven face of a giant?

[milehiLou]

I'm pretty explicit that I don't know if her story is true, my commentary is that no means no -- whether it's "stop, you are raping me" or "this isn't ok"

 

If you can show me any type of consent in that statement, I'm fine with changing my mind.

"And it was, like, completely casual. Nothing, like, sexual at all until my friend, um, we had, like, name tags on because it was my friend's birthday and she had, like, this silly, like, sex party, or whatever, and they had, like name tags like, 'Hello, my name is..." and it said, like, status, um, something, and my friend made mine so I was, like, wearing it.

 

"And it said, 'DTF,' which is, like, 'Down to [expletive] or whatever, which is silly, obviously, and I guess that he saw that and he, like, asked me about it, and I was like, 'Oh, it was just this silly thing, like, I explained it was my friend's birthday, she was just having this, um, she had these there and we were all just wearing them. We were all wearing them, too. And he was like, 'Oh, well, I'm not down to [expletive.] I'm into [expletive] girls' or something very crude, and we were like, 'OK.

 

Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10161/10645...m#ixzz0qf7GiUsJ

 

it was actually in writing, lol

[NoSaint]

hers is an ambiguous statement, lots of women get off on having sex in public, its the lure of getting caught that may cause this and she might not be one of them, however this is" not ok"and "we shouldnt be doing this" is not "stop". stop, no, dont touch me, im not interested although i saw your penis and ran into a room with a picture on it that i have seen since i was able to decipher a man and woman stick figure, those are all acceptable statements. "we shouldnt be doing this" might mean, i have a boyfriend, im on the rag, my panties are soiled, i have to meet my grandma later, and" this is not ok" could mean many different things as well, like for example maybe big ben is not so big, not ok, maybe she meant she would rather be in his million dollar bed, thats ok. we dont know because she is an absolute twit who cannot remember the most important details of her supposed rape, but remembers to the word, everything else that happened that nite, especially bens 'crude" comment earlier in the nite, but cant remember is her face was plastered against cold tile or the unshaven face of a giant?

 

 

Where is any implication of consent?

 

I'm going out on a limb and guessing you either don't know any rape victims, or the ones that you do know wouldn't tell you it happened for fear you would tell them they did it wrong. A rape is a crisis situation, some people go completely silent. When in doubt as a man, it is your obligation to stop. At very best your argument is that if it's ambiguous, and you keep going -- you might be raping a woman.

[NoSaint]

"And it was, like, completely casual. Nothing, like, sexual at all until my friend, um, we had, like, name tags on because it was my friend's birthday and she had, like, this silly, like, sex party, or whatever, and they had, like name tags like, 'Hello, my name is..." and it said, like, status, um, something, and my friend made mine so I was, like, wearing it.

 

"And it said, 'DTF,' which is, like, 'Down to [expletive] or whatever, which is silly, obviously, and I guess that he saw that and he, like, asked me about it, and I was like, 'Oh, it was just this silly thing, like, I explained it was my friend's birthday, she was just having this, um, she had these there and we were all just wearing them. We were all wearing them, too. And he was like, 'Oh, well, I'm not down to [expletive.] I'm into [expletive] girls' or something very crude, and we were like, 'OK.

 

Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10161/10645...m#ixzz0qf7GiUsJ

 

it was actually in writing, lol

 

it's true, if she's willing to have sex, it goes for anyone, at any time of the night, anywhere.... She can't say no at that point.

 

Also a nametag with DTF is a joke among college kids implying she's single.

[RealityCheck]

This young girl is a prime example of what happens when parents chose to raise stupid, spoiled, and/or naive girls. Her father should have his but kicked. I heard that hitchhiking across America can be fun. I think I'll start in Harlem. Wish me luck, not that anything could possibly go wrong.

[milehiLou]

Where is any implication of consent?

 

I'm going out on a limb and guessing you either don't know any rape victims, or the ones that you do know wouldn't tell you it happened for fear you would tell them they did it wrong. A rape is a crisis situation, some people go completely silent. When in doubt as a man, it is your obligation to stop. At very best your argument is that if it's ambiguous, and you keep going -- you might be raping a woman.

as a matter of fact smarty pants, i am actually a rape victim. i was drugged by a lifelong friend while sharing a hotel room in vegas and woke up with hemorhoid the size of a grape and couldnt defecate for three weeks. did i expect this to happen to me in this circumstance, absolutely not, i did nothing to lead this man on, and being a lifelong friend i didnt ever expect it. if i was in a situation like hers, when a man exposes his penis to someone at a self admitted SEX PARTY then its on her to do more for herself other than just calling herself a victim. she admitted a series of "silly" and "stupid" things where she obviously knew what was happening up to the point of the rape. she "stupidly said OK OK OK" come on

 

when i am having sex with a woman its absolutely consentual and the only stopping she asks for is a break.

[bbb]

I think I now know why they couldn't prosecute........The girl is an imbecile........That is funny how it was pointed out that she sees his penis and then walks into a bathroom. No, the out door is the door you came in!

[NoSaint]

This young girl is a prime example of what happens when parents chose to raise stupid, spoiled, and/or naive girls. Her father should have his but kicked. I heard that hitchhiking across America can be fun. I think I'll start in Harlem. Wish me luck, not that anything could possibly go wrong.

 

 

Yes, it's a bad situation but she could be roaming that bar naked, it doesn't give anyone the right to do anything to her.

 

Again, not arguing what happened in the room.... Just addressing what I feel is a totally skewed sense of morality on the subject of rape.

[NoSaint]

as a matter of fact smarty pants, i am actually a rape victim. i was drugged by a lifelong friend while sharing a hotel room in vegas and woke up with hemorhoid the size of a grape and couldnt defecate for three weeks. did i expect this to happen to me in this circumstance, absolutely not, i did nothing to lead this man on, and being a lifelong friend i didnt ever expect it. if i was in a situation like hers, when a man exposes his penis to someone at a self admitted SEX PARTY then its on her to do more for herself other than just calling herself a victim. she admitted a series of "silly" and "stupid" things where she obviously knew what was happening up to the point of the rape. she "stupidly said OK OK OK" come on

 

when i am having sex with a woman its absolutely consentual and the only stopping she asks for is a break.

 

if true, I am sorry for the comment. Regardless, it wasn't appropriate for me to make.... She was at a bar. She was not at a sex party at the bar. Ben was not at a sex party. Either way, unless they agreed on it being ok to go past er saying no, he's taking a big chance to keep going.

 

I also have not said you raped anyone, but if that is the standard someone uses they are rolling the dice big time.

[NoSaint]

Listen, there's a difference between can ben be convicted of rape, and if what she said is true, was she raped?

 

In other countries we wouldn't be debating this because a drunk girl can't give consent even if she says "come and get it, i want you." some of the things that are being argued are just plain sad. How would you feel if I tried to tell you it was your fault cause you didn't watch your drink and that's just drinking 101- it's not fair, and I would never imply that. You are a victim and if she was fall down drunk saying no, she is too- regardless of if she screamed rape.

[mary owen]

After reading the transcripts i think the real assault here was on the English language. The detective was just as guilty as the girl. Ben's unit seems guilty too.

 

Like, lock 'em all up. They was all in a position that they, um like, all don't remember. They is all guilty, ya'll. It's not OK.

[Doc]

You also missed the topic of this thread ("Tapes of Big Ben"). Imagine that.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-r...r-investigation

I was talking about the tape that was reported to have been taped-over.

[Thoner7]

I can't believe how many guys argue that "This isn't ok - we shouldn't being doing this" is a mixed message.... Also is raping a slut somehow a less felonious type of rape? what does her behavior have to do with anything if she said that? I'm not saying I buy her story but come on guys

 

 

I'm pretty explicit that I don't know if her story is true, my commentary is that no means no -- whether it's "stop, you are raping me" or "this isn't ok"

 

If you can show me any type of consent in that statement, I'm fine with changing my mind.

 

 

Dude, they did it in the bathroom of a packed night clud and aparently the door was open with bodyguards all around.

 

The LAST thing that comes to my mind is "this is not ok" - to have sex with me

 

How about:

"this is not ok" - to have sex in this gross bathroom, do me in your limo

"this is not ok" - to have your bodyguards around, can you make them leave

"this is not ok" - to have the door wide open, I want to bone in private

"this is not ok" - all my friends are around, and they will think Im a slut if we do it here, then I will claim you raped me afterwards to avoid the shame of doing it in thie gross bathroom, with all your bodyguards watching, and the door wide open!

 

 

No means no. Taking into account he Colorado episode, Ben is a predatory rapist. Those who throw Lynch in the same sentence are just wrong... Lynch is knucklehead.

 

So if someone FALSELY claims that they were raped by him, he is a predatory rapist? That NEVADA incident has been 100% debunked by the more than 10 eye witnesses who came forward stating the McNaulty bragged about knockin boots with Big Ben for weeks after it happened. Now all of a sudden she turns it to rape because he didnt call.....

[Pondslider]

Dude, they did it in the bathroom of a packed night clud and aparently the door was open with bodyguards all around.

 

The LAST thing that comes to my mind is "this is not ok" - to have sex with me

 

How about:

"this is not ok" - to have sex in this gross bathroom, do me in your limo

"this is not ok" - to have your bodyguards around, can you make them leave

"this is not ok" - to have the door wide open, I want to bone in private

"this is not ok" - all my friends are around, and they will think Im a slut if we do it here, then I will claim you raped me afterwards to avoid the shame of doing it in thie gross bathroom, with all your bodyguards watching, and the door wide open!

 

And yet he still didn't stop. And that's apparently ok with a lot of people. The reason doesn't matter. If she said stop for any reason he should have stopped. This whole idea that she didn't SPECIFICALLY say what she didn't want him to do so it's ok for him to finish is pretty messed up.

[NoSaint]

Dude, they did it in the bathroom of a packed night clud and aparently the door was open with bodyguards all around.

 

The LAST thing that comes to my mind is "this is not ok" - to have sex with me

 

How about:

"this is not ok" - to have sex with me in this gross bathroom, do me in your limo

"this is not ok" - to have sex with me while your bodyguards around, can you make them leave

"this is not ok" - to have sex with me with the door wide open, I want to bone in private

"this is not ok" - to have sex with me all my friends are around, and they will think Im a slut if we do it here, then I will claim you raped me afterwards to avoid the shame of doing it in thie gross bathroom, with all your bodyguards watching, and the door wide open!

 

is it really the last thing that comes to mind? I added 3-4 words to each statement and they don't read any different to me- do they mean something else to you now? This is not ok means no pretty explicitly. Whatever the reason it's not ok really doesn't matter.

 

Regardless, where in any of your original ones does she say "it is ok"