TheMadCap Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Mods: can you leave this in OT for a few days before moving to consumer forum? thanks! here is my issue: I have two Lennox outdoor heat pump units (condensor units). Both of which have recently stopped working due to bad capacitors (dual stage, run the fan motor and compressor). The first unit lost a capacitor while we were on vacation, so even though I had the thermostat turned up, the fan motor still tried to spin. The AC guy said that the fan motor might have been damaged and may stop working eventually. Well, it did, cause now I can barely turn the fan blades by hand. My question is this: I can buy a new motor online for about 1/1000000 the cost of having some dude come out and do it for me. How difficult a job do you suspect this will be? I am most worried about getting the fan blades off without bending them, since they are delicate. I am somewhat mechanically inclined and have a few friends who can help. Advice needed from those in the know...
Richmond_Bills Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Mods: can you leave this in OT for a few days before moving to consumer forum? thanks! here is my issue: I have two Lennox outdoor heat pump units (condensor units). Both of which have recently stopped working due to bad capacitors (dual stage, run the fan motor and compressor). The first unit lost a capacitor while we were on vacation, so even though I had the thermostat turned up, the fan motor still tried to spin. The AC guy said that the fan motor might have been damaged and may stop working eventually. Well, it did, cause now I can barely turn the fan blades by hand. My question is this: I can buy a new motor online for about 1/1000000 the cost of having some dude come out and do it for me. How difficult a job do you suspect this will be? I am most worried about getting the fan blades off without bending them, since they are delicate. I am somewhat mechanically inclined and have a few friends who can help. Advice needed from those in the know... Mad Cap - I am in Richmond and have a great AC guy. In a strange coincidence, I just learned yesterday the my capacitor went bad. I turned the unit off immediately, called my guy and he was at my house at 9:30 today. He said by shutting off the unit, I saved the fan (sorry for your bad luck). He fixed it for me in about 1 hour (had to go get the part) and is now at my Dad's house drinking coffee. PM me if you want his info. Sorry that I couldn't give you any real advice about the mechanical aspect, but I do know who to call if something breaks
DC Tom Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Not advice, just a "here's what I'd do": Buy the new fan myself. Carefully take the old unit apart. Note each step and where everything connects. If I get the whole thing apart, put it back together with the new motor. The moment I find myself thinking "Hmmm...maybe I shouldn't do this" or "Wait...what?" or even "Well, that's interesting", call a pro to finish the job for me. I'm suspecting it's not all that difficult a job. And by the way, if you do try it yourself, don't forget to flip off the breaker to the unit.
TheMadCap Posted June 8, 2010 Author Posted June 8, 2010 Not advice, just a "here's what I'd do": Buy the new fan myself. Carefully take the old unit apart. Note each step and where everything connects. If I get the whole thing apart, put it back together with the new motor. The moment I find myself thinking "Hmmm...maybe I shouldn't do this" or "Wait...what?" or even "Well, that's interesting", call a pro to finish the job for me. I'm suspecting it's not all that difficult a job. And by the way, if you do try it yourself, don't forget to flip off the breaker to the unit. oh, so THAT's what that big grey box does!!! that was my plan of attack. My biggest worry was getting the fan blades off the motor shaft without bending them...
DC Tom Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 oh, so THAT's what that big grey box does!!! Yeah...when it comes to electricity, I don't assume. Not since I discovered a circuit in my house with the light switch wired into the ground. ("The switch is off, I don't need to open the breaker....*ZZZZZZT* YEEEEEOOOWWW!!!!" ) that was my plan of attack. My biggest worry was getting the fan blades off the motor shaft without bending them... Simple answer to that: Be REALLY !@#$ING CAREFUL. Seriously...in principle, not much different than playing with a ceiling fan, which blades will snap in half if you look at them funny. If you want to get really fancy...get some poplar at Home Depot, shape it into braces curved like the blade, attach to blade. Then protect the edges with styrofoam blocks. Then take them off. Easier, I think, to just take the damn things off and not drop them...but you could do that.
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Mad Cap - I am in Richmond and have a great AC guy. In a strange coincidence, I just learned yesterday the my capacitor went bad. I turned the unit off immediately, called my guy and he was at my house at 9:30 today. He said by shutting off the unit, I saved the fan (sorry for your bad luck). He fixed it for me in about 1 hour (had to go get the part) and is now at my Dad's house drinking coffee. PM me if you want his info. Sorry that I couldn't give you any real advice about the mechanical aspect, but I do know who to call if something breaks Bingo! I have a 15 year old Rheem and I think the thing may be going?... It hung up one time when I first fired it up this year and I caught it right away... Shut it down (at the panel too), waited a few minutes and it fired up... Seems to be working fine now. The only thing is that I try to train my wife in being that methodical... Good luck... It will probably be fried when I am not home some day! Note... I know with mine... I can take the cover off and put a little light weight oil to the fan motor every other year or so. I must be doing something right... Everybody around me has changed theirs already. I just know my wife is gonna blow it up and that I could coax another couple years out of it! It is usually set to about 73 degrees... "Gee, I didn't notice it till it is 85 degrees in here!"
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Not advice, just a "here's what I'd do": Buy the new fan myself. Carefully take the old unit apart. Note each step and where everything connects. If I get the whole thing apart, put it back together with the new motor. The moment I find myself thinking "Hmmm...maybe I shouldn't do this" or "Wait...what?" or even "Well, that's interesting", call a pro to finish the job for me. I'm suspecting it's not all that difficult a job. And by the way, if you do try it yourself, don't forget to flip off the breaker to the unit. It is not. Of course they want you to buy a whole new unit for 2-3 grand! And yessss! Flip the panel please... I think they are mostly 240v I shut the panel down for the winter months also... I used to cover the compressor too, but I have heard mixed reviews on that.
TheMadCap Posted June 8, 2010 Author Posted June 8, 2010 Yeah...when it comes to electricity, I don't assume. Not since I discovered a circuit in my house with the light switch wired into the ground. ("The switch is off, I don't need to open the breaker....*ZZZZZZT* YEEEEEOOOWWW!!!!" ) Simple answer to that: Be REALLY !@#$ING CAREFUL. Seriously...in principle, not much different than playing with a ceiling fan, which blades will snap in half if you look at them funny. If you want to get really fancy...get some poplar at Home Depot, shape it into braces curved like the blade, attach to blade. Then protect the edges with styrofoam blocks. Then take them off. Easier, I think, to just take the damn things off and not drop them...but you could do that. yes, they appear to be made from aluminum foil. I am going to try and remove the motor with the blades, then try and get the blades off. If I am sucessful, I won't have to buy the blades, otherwise its like 75 more bucks for the fan blades (or 1,250 if you have an AC repair company come and bend you over)...
DC Tom Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 I am going to try and remove the motor with the blades, then try and get the blades off. If I am sucessful, I won't have to buy the blades, otherwise its like 75 more bucks for the fan blades (or 1,250 if you have an AC repair company come and bend you over)... Something to be said for taking the blades off the motor first (easier to maneuver them individually, than work around them to get the motor off and then maneuver the whole assembly - less risk of damage). Then again, there's something to be said for leaving them on (less handling - less risk of damage). I'm not sure what the objective risk/reward analysis is on that question...as a matter of personal choice, I'd probably take them off first.
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Something to be said for taking the blades off the motor first (easier to maneuver them individually, than work around them to get the motor off and then maneuver the whole assembly - less risk of damage). Then again, there's something to be said for leaving them on (less handling - less risk of damage). I'm not sure what the objective risk/reward analysis is on that question...as a matter of personal choice, I'd probably take them off first. Isn't it all one unit? Probably depends on make and model? When I get in to oil mine (I can't remember now)... Been a couple years... I think mine looked like the blades were riveted in place?? This whole thread got me thinking that I should be proactive about the !@#$er! Good luck MadCap!!
\GoBillsInDallas/ Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Not to sound like a smart aleck, but why don't you have a service contract? I have two units at my house, and every AC contractor down here offers a service contract for $100/year total for the two units. For this price, they will do the spring and fall maintenance services, replace the filters and clean the units. They will also give you priority service (same-day or next-day) and will do repairs for deeply discounted rates.
BuffaloBud Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Found a couple of links that might have some info for your use - #1 #2 #3 As a side note, I often thought that taking a basic HVAC maintenance class(es) would come in handy to help troubleshoot own units and friends / neighbors.
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Not to sound like a smart aleck, but why don't you have a service contract? I have two units at my house, and every AC contractor down here offers a service contract for $100/year total for the two units. For this price, they will do the spring and fall maintenance services, replace the filters and clean the units. They will also give you priority service (same-day or next-day) and will do repairs for deeply discounted rates. My neighbor had one (only 59 a year plus whatever coolant) and I swear that is why the damn thing blew up... Every year they would come and clean the thing (hose and water on the cooling fins of compressor... That should be done anyway a couple times a year... ) and then recharge it... I was thinking the thing doesn't need to be recharged THAT MUCH? It is a sealed unit. They gave them a deeply discounted price all right... On a new unit... Now I have done it... My will blow up this weekend when it gets hot outside!
TheMadCap Posted June 8, 2010 Author Posted June 8, 2010 Not to sound like a smart aleck, but why don't you have a service contract? I have two units at my house, and every AC contractor down here offers a service contract for $100/year total for the two units. For this price, they will do the spring and fall maintenance services, replace the filters and clean the units. They will also give you priority service (same-day or next-day) and will do repairs for deeply discounted rates. Actually, I had one for the first few years after we moved in, but it expired. The units are only 7 years old, the compressor is warranteed by Lennox for 10 years. Unless you have a compressor go out or a coil leak, it's really not that expensive to maintain yourself. For example, the AC company wanted 295 bucks to replace the start capacitor, which is a 13 dollar part at a wholesaler. Of course, I would NEVER attempt to recharge the coolant. This required special equipment and training. Really, there is not a who lot the average Joe couldn't do with a little knowledege...
TheMadCap Posted June 8, 2010 Author Posted June 8, 2010 Isn't it all one unit? Probably depends on make and model? When I get in to oil mine (I can't remember now)... Been a couple years... I think mine looked like the blades were riveted in place?? This whole thread got me thinking that I should be proactive about the !@#$er! Good luck MadCap!! Definitely take care of it if you can. And no, the fan blades are ususally a separate part, most placed you order a motor from will send you just the motor...
Mr Info Posted June 8, 2010 Posted June 8, 2010 Rick, This helped me troubleshoot mine and saved me some $: Lennox tech talk Depending on your model, you may require a blade puller. Other places send you the motor with the blade. Hope it's an inexpensive and quick fix.
TheMadCap Posted June 8, 2010 Author Posted June 8, 2010 UPDATE: Wow, was it easy to remove the motor and fan blades. Didn't need a puller, just removed the lock nut and the blades popped off with no problem. Now to order the parts and hope they don't take a week to get here by UPS ground. Thanks everyone for the links to the tech help. Also, since very few suppliers will sell to homeowners (this helps facilitate your ass-raping by AC repair contractors), here is where I was able to obtain parts for the Lennox, which parts are hard to come by: www.cozyparts.com
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 9, 2010 Posted June 9, 2010 UPDATE: Wow, was it easy to remove the motor and fan blades. Didn't need a puller, just removed the lock nut and the blades popped off with no problem. Now to order the parts and hope they don't take a week to get here by UPS ground. Thanks everyone for the links to the tech help. Also, since very few suppliers will sell to homeowners (this helps facilitate your ass-raping by AC repair contractors), here is where I was able to obtain parts for the Lennox, which parts are hard to come by: www.cozyparts.com Thanks for the link MadCap! I will check it out.
TheMadCap Posted June 9, 2010 Author Posted June 9, 2010 Thanks for the link MadCap! I will check it out. Obviously, I am by no means an expert, but the issue you were describing with your unit sounds very much like a bad capacitor. You can find out by removing it and taking it to a shop to be tested. Most multimeters don't have microfarads. Just be sure to decharge before you touch it...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 9, 2010 Posted June 9, 2010 Obviously, I am by no means an expert, but the issue you were describing with your unit sounds very much like a bad capacitor. You can find out by removing it and taking it to a shop to be tested. Most multimeters don't have microfarads. Just be sure to decharge before you touch it... Thanks! I had a hard time believing it was a fan... Motors should last forever... I will do that!
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