Jon Gruden QB Special

[Ever Since '86]

And then he cried, literally, on the bench. This guy is no leader of men in the NFL, is not near ready to play, and probably never will be. I can't wait until the draft is over so we will not have to listen to all the Tebow man-love around here.

 

Your a moron, so because he cared so much about his last regular season game at Florida he isn't a leader of men? Believe it or not there are still compassionate people out there who are tuff SOBs

[LongLiveRalph]

QUESTION: How did Jon Gruden become a quarterback "guru" in the first place? I know this was somehow his M.O. when he was a head coach, that he was thought of as a great West Coast offensive mind and a QB expert.

 

If I remember correctly, he had success in Oakland with Rich Gannon, who I would hardly say was "groomed" by Gruden...Gannon played through the hard knocks and was a savvy veteran by the time Gruden took over.

 

In Tampa, Gruden won a Super Bowl with Brad Johnson, yet another savvy vet...

 

Then had some ups and downs, with the majority of his "ups" occurring with Jeff Garcia under center, who made plays outside of the offense with his legs and veteran experience.

 

I can't recall one QB that Gruden has himself developed into a quality starter. Am I wrong about this?

 

Is "GRUDEN AS QB GURU" just a myth that continues to perpetuate itself, even more so now with the force of ESPN behind it???

[Ever Since '86]

QUESTION: How did Jon Gruden become a quarterback "guru" in the first place? I know this was somehow his M.O. when he was a head coach, that he was thought of as a great West Coast offensive mind and a QB expert.

 

If I remember correctly, he had success in Oakland with Rich Gannon, who I would hardly say was "groomed" by Gruden...Gannon played through the hard knocks and was a savvy veteran by the time Gruden took over.

 

In Tampa, Gruden won a Super Bowl with Brad Johnson, yet another savvy vet...

 

Then had some ups and downs, with the majority of his "ups" occurring with Jeff Garcia under center, who made plays outside of the offense with his legs and veteran experience.

 

I can't recall one QB that Gruden has himself developed into a quality starter. Am I wrong about this?

 

Is "GRUDEN AS QB GURU" just a myth that continues to perpetuate itself, even more so now with the force of ESPN behind it???

 

 

Don't forget Favre

 

Gannon had a crazy good year with gruden, did he before or after I seriously can't remember.

[LongLiveRalph]

Don't forget Favre

 

Gannon had a crazy good year with gruden, did he before or after I seriously can't remember.

 

Gannon took the Raiders to the Super Bowl the year after Gruden left...

 

Gruden was the "Quality Control" coach for the 49ers under O.C. Mike Holmgren and then went with him to Green Bay to be the WR Coach. I'm sure he worked with Favre but he wasn't his "coach" per se.

[DDD]

I love Gruden. What an intense, interesting, colorful coach. My wife, you couldn't care less about football, was as thoroughly entertained as I was.

[DanInUticaTampa]

QUESTION: How did Jon Gruden become a quarterback "guru" in the first place? I know this was somehow his M.O. when he was a head coach, that he was thought of as a great West Coast offensive mind and a QB expert.

 

If I remember correctly, he had success in Oakland with Rich Gannon, who I would hardly say was "groomed" by Gruden...Gannon played through the hard knocks and was a savvy veteran by the time Gruden took over.

 

In Tampa, Gruden won a Super Bowl with Brad Johnson, yet another savvy vet...

 

Then had some ups and downs, with the majority of his "ups" occurring with Jeff Garcia under center, who made plays outside of the offense with his legs and veteran experience.

 

I can't recall one QB that Gruden has himself developed into a quality starter. Am I wrong about this?

 

Is "GRUDEN AS QB GURU" just a myth that continues to perpetuate itself, even more so now with the force of ESPN behind it???

 

Yeah, I live here in tampa and I watch most of the Tampa games. Gruden was a decent coach, but he went through QBs like they were nothing and just kept taking them out and putting them back in until one of them finally worked. And by "worked" i mean they didn't screw up that much.

[LongLiveRalph]

Yeah, I live here in tampa and I watch most of the Tampa games. Gruden was a decent coach, but he went through QBs like they were nothing and just kept taking them out and putting them back in until one of them finally worked. And by "worked" i mean they didn't screw up that much.

 

Yes that's how I remember it too. Ups and downs but never had one guy consistently succeed.

[FLFan]

Your a moron, so because he cared so much about his last regular season game at Florida he isn't a leader of men? Believe it or not there are still compassionate people out there who are tuff SOBs

 

I am not sure what breaking down in tears on the bench when the game is still going on has to do with compassion, but it does not indicate a leader. I cannot seem to recall Jim Kelly crying on the sideline after playing poorly in a super bowl, or Peyton Manning or Brett Farve tearing up after failing to lead their teams to victory in big games last year. Maybe they just don't care, huh? Rallying your team mates, consoling them, and many other actions would have inidcated leaderhship.

 

The fact is Tebow is a fraud, and his so called leadership at Florida will not translate to the NFL nor will his skills, in my opinion. The NFL is not college, and there is more to toughness and leadership than taking a hit. Tebow is more likley to be a laughingstock in the locker room than he is to be a leader.

 

And by the way, before calling me a moron for expressing my opinion (how compassionate of you) you may want to learn the difference between "your" and "you're".

[McBeane]

I am not sure what breaking down in tears on the bench when the game is still going on has to do with compassion, but it does not indicate a leader. I cannot seem to recall Jim Kelly crying on the sideline after playing poorly in a super bowl, or Peyton Manning or Brett Farve tearing up after failing to lead their teams to victory in big games last year. Maybe they just don't care, huh? Rallying your team mates, consoling them, and many other actions would have inidcated leaderhship.

 

The fact is Tebow is a fraud, and his so called leadership at Florida will not translate to the NFL nor will his skills, in my opinion. The NFL is not college, and there is more to toughness and leadership than taking a hit. Tebow is more likley to be a laughingstock in the locker room than he is to be a leader.

 

And by the way, before calling me a moron for expressing my opinion (how compassionate of you) you may want to learn the difference between "your" and "you're".

 

Dude, do you not understand it was his last ever really meaningful game in his college career? Lots of guys get emotional over something like that. Just because you are a true man and apparently don't ever cry, doesn't mean that Tebow isn't a leader because he cried at his last game SEC Championship at Florida.

[Rockinon]

Your a moron, so because he cared so much about his last regular season game at Florida he isn't a leader of men? Believe it or not there are still compassionate people out there who are tuff SOBs

I seem to recall a certain Green Bay QB who shed a few tears.

 

[Leonidas]

THey said that about Joe Montana'a arm strenght also. I guess he sucked too.

 

Excellent comparison. Joe Montana at ND and Tebow at Florida were the exact same QB.

 

I don't get the hate on Clausen. Again, it stems from everything off the football field and is purely just a personal dislike for the guy. When he said his receiver didn't run the right route, IT ISN'T HIS FAULT! He made the hand signal, the WR got it and ignored it. And when the plays are coming in slowly, it makes it much harder to change stuff before you snap it after you have a chance to read the defense a little. Clausen made no mistake on the pick that Gruden showed (1 of his 4 on the year) and I don't understand on how that can make him "uncoachable" because he placed the blame on others.

 

I think it's a lack of leadership that gets most people. He doesn't have Tebow's intangibles. I don't hate Clausen, I'm just not sold on him as our franchise QB.

 

From Walter Football:

Strengths:

Good height and great musculature

Solid arm strength

Very good deep ball accuracy

Great pass rush sense and pocket instincts

Athletic and can move chains with legs

Extremely powerful runner

Good trucking ability; picks up yards after contact

Good character and strong work ethic

Prototype leader

 

the scary part to me:

Player Comparison: Byron Leftwich (Passer)/Mike Alstott (Runner). Tebow has a very similar release to Leftwich and he will also struggle to read defenses in NFL. He also has Mike Alstott's elite power running attributes with the ability to get yards after contact.

 

BTW what do any of these "scouts" know anyway. Tebow has all of the intangibles which is a big plus. Remember Brady went on the 5th round, these guys can all play at the end of the day it's about heart and desire.

 

No offense, but WalterFootball is just some guy with a blog. I actually like his mock drafts, they're much better than some of the other ones out there, but he hasn't been vetted or interviewed for the job, he isn't paid to do this. I'll trust CBS Sports and ESPN over WalterFootball.com. Especially when on his "very good deep ball accuracy" point, that's just blatantly false.

[Red Squirrel]

I didn't see all of this (really, just a chunk of the Clausen segment), but I thought Gruden was awful. He seemed much more interested in looking like a big shot than he did in creating useful analysis. I wasn't too terribly impressed with Clausen, but I got the feeling he just wanted to bolt because Gruden was browbeating him. Gruden went into the show with a Mike Wallace "Gotcha" attitude, and the second Clausen tried to explain that someone else made a mistake, Gruden pounced on him. It was like he had an agenda to prove that Clausen is the weaselly little turd that so many unofficial scouts say he is. Clausen may very well be a weaselly turd; Gruden is worse.

[slyng1]

Here's the Gruden Piece(s):

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/colu...tory?id=5033690

 

There's a section underneath the video that says "playlist" and it has Tebow, Bradford, McCoy, and Clausen. I think it defaults to Tebow when you load the page...

[CarolinaBill]

Excellent comparison. Joe Montana at ND and Tebow at Florida were the exact same QB.

 

I hope this is sarcasm

 

I think it's a lack of leadership that gets most people. He doesn't have Tebow's intangibles. I don't hate Clausen, I'm just not sold on him as our franchise QB.

What are tebow's "intangibles" that will translate to the pro game

 

No offense, but WalterFootball is just some guy with a blog. I actually like his mock drafts, they're much better than some of the other ones out there, but he hasn't been vetted or interviewed for the job, he isn't paid to do this. I'll trust CBS Sports and ESPN over WalterFootball.com. Especially when on his "very good deep ball accuracy" point, that's just blatantly false.

could you show some stats to back that up, cause all I saw out of clausen was a great deep ball, that found its mark the majority of the time.

[Leonidas]

could you show some stats to back that up, cause all I saw out of clausen was a great deep ball, that found its mark the majority of the time.

 

It was about Tebow, not Clausen.

 

You're not asking me to quantify Tebow's intangibles in your first line...right?

[bisonbrigade]

Your a moron, so because he cared so much about his last regular season game at Florida he isn't a leader of men? Believe it or not there are still compassionate people out there who are tuff SOBs

Amen.

[Sig1Hunter]

Your a moron, so because he cared so much about his last regular season game at Florida he isn't a leader of men? Believe it or not there are still compassionate people out there who are tuff SOBs

 

Though I agree with your point, the irony in the bolded quote makes me chuckle.

[CarolinaBill]

It was about Tebow, not Clausen.

 

You're not asking me to quantify Tebow's intangibles in your first line...right?

yes, im asking you to tell me what are the "intangibles" that tebow possesses that clausen does not.

 

if they cant be defined in some way then how do you know he possesses them, and furthermore how would you know someone else doesn't?

 

So please, eloborate for me, define this mysterious skill set that will miraculously make Tebow a successful NFL player

[Leonidas]

yes, im asking you to tell me what are the "intangibles" that tebow possesses that clausen does not.

 

if they cant be defined in some way then how do you know he possesses them, and furthermore how would you know someone else doesn't?

 

So please, eloborate for me, define this mysterious skill set that will miraculously make Tebow a successful NFL player

 

I don't think Tebow will be a successful NFL player, not at QB at least. But he was by far the best interview. I didn't get the impression that Clausen had the same leadership or presence in the huddle. This can't be quantified (which was my actual question if you look back - there's a difference between quantifying something and defining it), so I don't have any "stats" to back up either's intangibles, or lack thereof. It's believed widespread that Tebow's intangibles are the best of the draft class. I'm not sure what you don't understand here.

[CarolinaBill]

I don't think Tebow will be a successful NFL player, not at QB at least. But he was by far the best interview. I didn't get the impression that Clausen had the same leadership or presence in the huddle. This can't be quantified (which was my actual question if you look back - there's a difference between quantifying something and defining it), so I don't have any "stats" to back up either's intangibles, or lack thereof. It's believed widespread that Tebow's intangibles are the best of the draft class. I'm not sure what you don't understand here.

What I am getting at is that ppl say this stuff and it means ZERO, what are Tebow's intangibles, and how will they make him a good player? That what I want to know, b/c personally, I think its a bunch of feel good BS. Will his will to win help him read a friggin defense? NO Will his "intangibles" change the fact that his mobility doesnt translate? NO, thats what I am getting at,

Clausen has all the tools, tebow does not. Tebow had a ****-ton of talent all around him at florida, thats why he was a winner, his "intangibles" wont mean jack on a pro team