For All The People Who Favor Mayock

[Lurker]

there's no way we could pass on a stud franchise QB like that

Whoa there 'pard. Being rated the second or third best QB in your draft class has nothing to do with being 'a stud franchise QB.'

 

Given the debate on Clausen by NFL personnel men and knowledgeable observers like Mayock, I'd pass on this guy. The list of underwhelming first round QB prospects that get hyped in the months leading up to the draft is long--and will likely grow with the 2010 crop.

 

Beef, beef and more beef in rounds 1-2...

[CarolinaBill]

Whoa there 'pard. Being rated the second or third best QB in your draft class has nothing to do with being 'a stud franchise QB.'

 

Given the debate on Clausen by NFL personnel men and knowledgeable observers like Mayock, I'd pass on this guy. The list of underwhelming first round QB prospects that get hyped in the months leading up to the draft is long--and will likely grow with the 2010 crop.

 

Beef, beef and more beef in rounds 1-2...

exactly what debate are you talking about?

 

the one where ppl think he's cocky cause he showed up in a limo to natl signing day when he was 17, or the comments he made when he was 17 that ND would win 4 titles, or are you referring to his record in college not being on par with the other top qb in the class (he cant play defense too ya know) Are you referring to the pictures that have been circulated of him in a speedo when he was 17 how about getting attacked by a drunk idiot fanboy, is that his fault, does that reflect on his character--to have some moron attack you.

 

there is ZERO debate about his talents, none, he couldnt win at ND due to a lackluster defense, but make no mistake about it, clausen is a franchise QB, he's tough, smart, strong, accurate, a charismatic leader, and he works for it. if you have a choice b/t a franchise O Lineman or a franchise QB YOU ALWAYS TAKE THE QB.

 

clausen improved every yr in a prostyle offense, he learned to check and read coverages, he is without a doubt the most polished QB in this draft class.

[Lurker]

YOU ALWAYS TAKE THE QB.

The debate is on his intangibles, which at the QB position are make or break propositions (Losman, Jamarcus Russell, Brady Quinn, Matt Leinart, Jay Cutler, Alex Smith, Jason Campbell, Byron Leftwich, Kyle Boller, David Carr, Joey Harrington, Mike Vick, and on and on).

 

Since 2000, there have been 26 QBs taken in the first round. Discounting the 2008 and 2009 drafts, since it usually takes 1-2 years for guys to get productive (unless they have a playoff calibre supporting cast), that total is 21. Of this group, only Aaron Rogers (2005), Manning, Rivers and Big Ben (2004), Carson Palmer (2003), Chad Pennington (2000) are franchise QBs, IMO (a 0.288 batting average).

 

Even if you put Sanchez and Stafford in that group, the average rises to just 0.308.

 

Clausen looks like another Brady Quinn to me, so NO, I don't buy the 'YOU ALWAYS TAKE THE QB' argument.

 

The one thing I'd like to see draft evaluators do is rate players vs. the quality of recent draft classes rather than in a vaccum (i.e., versus only their own class). If every QB in 2010 is a 'meh vs. what it takes to succeed in the position, what good is being ranked 1, 2 or 3...

[CarolinaBill]

The debate is on his intangibles, which at the QB position are make or break propositions (Losman, Jamarcus Russell, Brady Quinn, Matt Leinart, Jay Cutler, Alex Smith, Jason Campbell, Byron Leftwich, Kyle Boller, David Carr, Joey Harrington, Mike Vick, and on and on).

 

Since 2000, there have been 26 QBs taken in the first round. Discounting the 2008 and 2009 drafts, since it usually takes 1-2 years for guys to get productive (unless they have a playoff calibre supporting cast), that total is 21. Of this group, only Aaron Rogers (2005), Manning, Rivers and Big Ben (2004), Carson Palmer (2003), Chad Pennington (2000) are franchise QBs, IMO (a 0.288 batting average).

 

Even if you put Sanchez and Stafford in that group, the average rises to just 0.308.

 

Clausen looks like another Brady Quinn to me, so NO, I don't buy the 'YOU ALWAYS TAKE THE QB' argument.

 

The one thing I'd like to see draft evaluators do is rate players vs. the quality of recent draft classes rather than in a vaccum (i.e., versus only their own class). If every QB in 2010 is a 'meh vs. what it takes to succeed in the position, what good is being ranked 1, 2 or 3...

that must be because they played for the same team, right?

 

well you are wrong, not only did ND put up more PPG with clausen than with quinn, but he has a stronger arm, is more accurate, and is basically a completely different player, the only thing they have in common is playing at ND.

 

Quinn cannot drive the deep ball, he's a dink and dunker,

Clausen threw the deep ball great with torn ligaments and a broken foot, he can play in the buffalo weather.

 

based on your logic, Bradford=hueppel/white: tebow=leak, or weurffel : mccoy=applewhite

[Lurker]

that must be because they played for the same team, right?

Nope. Both guys came out with 'leadership concerns' and all the physical talent in the world won't cover for that flaw.

 

This QB class is underwhelming, IMO, plain and simple...

[BobDVA]

Did anyone hear the story out of Philadelphia that relates that the Eagles traded McNabb to Washington because they did not want to face Clausen twice a year for the next decade?

 

 

That was Bradford Troll.

[CarolinaBill]

Nope. Both guys came out with 'leadership concerns' and all the physical talent in the world won't cover for that flaw.

 

This QB class is underwhelming, IMO, plain and simple...

agree to disagree then.

 

clausen couldnt lead the defense, thus they couldnt win many games

[Ever Since '86]

exactly what debate are you talking about?

 

the one where ppl think he's cocky cause he showed up in a limo to natl signing day when he was 17, or the comments he made when he was 17 that ND would win 4 titles, or are you referring to his record in college not being on par with the other top qb in the class (he cant play defense too ya know) Are you referring to the pictures that have been circulated of him in a speedo when he was 17 how about getting attacked by a drunk idiot fanboy, is that his fault, does that reflect on his character--to have some moron attack you.

 

there is ZERO debate about his talents, none, he couldnt win at ND due to a lackluster defense, but make no mistake about it, clausen is a franchise QB, he's tough, smart, strong, accurate, a charismatic leader, and he works for it. if you have a choice b/t a franchise O Lineman or a franchise QB YOU ALWAYS TAKE THE QB.

 

clausen improved every yr in a prostyle offense, he learned to check and read coverages, he is without a doubt the most polished QB in this draft class.

 

Excellent post, i was a skeptic too but then i realized you can be a POS and still be a successful QB so get him.

[C.Biscuit97]

I like Mayock but a point of caution: he said Robert Ayers of Tennessee was the best defensive player in the draft last year. Ayers who started one season in college, had a whooping 11 tackles as a rookie, and couldn't beat out Mario Haggans for a starting job. Mayock also think Earl Thomas is a better safety than Eric Berry.

 

I like Mayock but don't get carried away. He never worked for a team and his job is to get people to watch him. That's why you sometimes say outlandish things.

[H2o]

I like Mayock but a point of caution: he said Robert Ayers of Tennessee was the best defensive player in the draft last year. Ayers who started one season in college, had a whooping 11 tackles as a rookie, and couldn't beat out Mario Haggans for a starting job. Mayock also think Earl Thomas is a better safety than Eric Berry.

 

I like Mayock but don't get carried away. He never worked for a team and his job is to get people to watch him. That's why you sometimes say outlandish things.

I did not want us to draft Ayers at #11 as some others did, but I did think he could be a good DE in the NFL because of his ability to play the run so well. That's the problem in Denver, they use a 3-4. Ayers is a clear-cut 4-3 LE, IMO, and is being played out of position as an OLB.

[C.Biscuit97]

I did not want us to draft Ayers at #11 as some others did, but I did think he could be a good DE in the NFL because of his ability to play the run so well. That's the problem in Denver, they use a 3-4. Ayers is a clear-cut 4-3 LE, IMO, and is being played out of position as an OLB.

 

But whatever the reason is, he still only started one year at Tennessee. And for Mayock to claim he was the best defensive player in the draft seemed like he was jsut trying to create some rankings. Don't get me wrong because I think Mayock is one of the best of the draft "experts." But he is on tv and not working for a NFL front office for a reason. And his job is to get ratings.

[starrymessenger]

He won't get past Cleveland. Holmgren is blowin' smoke up everybody's a**.

 

GO BILLS!!!

I fear you may be right.

[papazoid]

i find it peculiar, that with these damaging allegations about his lack of leadership or being a good team mate......that his former coach, Charlie Weiss has not come out in support of his former player.

[peteski]

Who cares what Mayock thinks. I only care what Nix thinks.

[bills_believer]

Dan Williams is the opposite of Whitner - he's this year's Ngata. This year's Whitner is the safety from Texas. If WIlliams is drafted, you should go to bed very happy. Having a dominant presence at NT would be a great thing.

Great Blue North is having a fan mock draft. You can vote for only one team and only one time. The top three OT's were gone (Russell Okung, Trent Williams and Brian Bulaga). 161 fans voted. Clausen edged out Dan Williams by one percentage point. http://www.gbnreport.com/fanmockdraftstats.html

[Steely Dan]

If Williams is that good, why is he the third best DT? and Why is he never talked about on any of the shows covering the draft or by any of the experts on TV/Radio ?

 

I've heard them talk about him. He's the third best DT listed because most teams run the 4-3 and you're talking about two different animals. The other two aren't NT and Williams is the best NT in the draft. The Bills need a NT desperately and he probably wont make it past Miami if he's still there when they pick.

[Celtic_soulja]

Clausen = Leaf

[thewildrabbit]

If you watched the NFL network and path to the draft, Mayock spoke about Clausen on several things.

 

One of which is that he is still favoring his injured foot which is about 85% healed, he also stated he was weak on some on his throws because of the foot.

 

Who knows what Buddy Nix is thinking at this point... only nevergiveup can tell us

[Keukasmallies]

Jimmy Clausen will be the next wannabe, but never was. He won't make the transition to the NFL. He doesn't have the big time cojones needed to step in and step up.... Wait and see....

[OldTimer1960]

Dan Williams is the opposite of Whitner - he's this year's Ngata. This year's Whitner is the safety from Texas. If WIlliams is drafted, you should go to bed very happy. Having a dominant presence at NT would be a great thing.

 

While I agree on the premise that a dominant NT would be a very big help, I haven't read ANY reviews that suggest

that Dan Williams is one. Based on what I've read, he is maybe a mid-to-late 1st rounder, and then only because

of the low supply of NTs in this year's draft not because he is that good.