what's wrong with claussen?

[John from Riverside]

So nobody got a pick of Brett Farve in his tight shorts driving the tractor out on his farm?

 

The only thing Clausen is guilty of is not caring what other people think.......

 

And this has NOTHING to do with the football field

[1B4IDie]

I think the legit reason is that the Bills have produced such a bad record over the last decade that what they require is to either rebuild the team from the trenches out OR to get a team leader at QB who basically forces the team to win by virtually through force of will refuses to lose.

 

Personally, I think that the latter view simply is not gonna happen (a QB can make the difference as the add-on to a quality team as RoboQB did with Pitts but even the best QB in the business Peyton Manning led Indy to the exact same record after his rookie year when asked to do it himself and only the addition of a number of factors proved to ultimately be enough).

 

As far as Claussen himself, yes he is a very good QB but he simply proved flat-out with the ND record last year that he is not capable of forcing a team he is leading to refuse to lose.

 

Its a high risk silly strategy the Bills would be pursuing to bank on Clausen with out first round help in the trenches being the choice to make this team a winner (and potentially for him to even survive as he suffered a serious injury as he finished college) or hinder his needed development if he is chosen as our next savior. Perhaps if Claussen had Tebow's proven ability to elevate his team seemingly through force of will or Tebow had Claussen's demonstrated quick release either MIGHT be a good choice at #9, but neither do and it seems as sure as the crapshoot the draft is that either choice at #9 would be fatal to the Bills for years.

Ÿ

+1000000

That's the whole point. Clausen is a good skll player. He needs support. He is not Marino Elway Manning that can throw a team on his shoulder and win (you can add McNabb to that list) There is no support for him in Buffalo. He is not that highly skille, 1 in a generation talent.

 

There are a half dozen QBs like him everyy year

[Mr. WEO]

Ÿ

+1000000

That's the whole point. Clausen is a good skll player. He needs support. He is not Marino Elway Manning that can throw a team on his shoulder and win (you can add McNabb to that list) There is no support for him in Buffalo. He is not that highly skille, 1 in a generation talent.

 

There are a half dozen QBs like him everyy year

Wait, which QB can simply "throw a team on his shoulder and win"??

 

Seems like Elway couldn't do it until Shanahan and Davis showed up. And Manning has done it once (against Rex Grossman!) despite spending a large chunk of his career throwing to the best receivers (WR, TE) in the league. I won't even mention McNabb's problems winning the big game "on his shoulders"...

 

 

Clausen's offense racked up 452 ypg--8th in the country and scored 30 ppg. When his team was playing defense (poorly), exactly how was he supposed to influence their play?

 

Thses comments are ridiculous.

 

Why don't you just come and say "I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play QB" and leave it at that? At least it would be an honest post.

[Celtic_soulja]

Wait, which QB can simply "throw a team on his shoulder and win"??

 

Seems like Elway couldn't do it until Shanahan and Davis showed up. And Manning has done it once (against Rex Grossman!) despite spending a large chunk of his career throwing to the best receivers (WR, TE) in the league. I won't even mention McNabb's problems winning the big game "on his shoulders"...

 

 

Clausen's offense racked up 452 ypg--8th in the country and scored 30 ppg. When his team was playing defense (poorly), exactly how was he supposed to influence their play?

 

Thses comments are ridiculous.

 

Why don't you just come and say "I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play QB" and leave it at that? At least it would be an honest post.

 

I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play football...BUT for the same reasons guys like Leaf don't make it in the pros...Leaf could play ball...he set all kinds of records in college...he had a great arm and was destined for greatness...but the pressure destroyed his career because he was a cry baby loser like Jimmy Clausen is...so...ummm...yeah...I dislike him for reasons that are NOT his ability to play football but that WILL get in the way of him using his football ability effectively...GET IT NOW????....

[John from Riverside]

Wait, which QB can simply "throw a team on his shoulder and win"??

 

Seems like Elway couldn't do it until Shanahan and Davis showed up. And Manning has done it once (against Rex Grossman!) despite spending a large chunk of his career throwing to the best receivers (WR, TE) in the league. I won't even mention McNabb's problems winning the big game "on his shoulders"...

 

 

Clausen's offense racked up 452 ypg--8th in the country and scored 30 ppg. When his team was playing defense (poorly), exactly how was he supposed to influence their play?

 

Thses comments are ridiculous.

 

Why don't you just come and say "I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play QB" and leave it at that? At least it would be an honest post.

 

I disagree that there are half a dozen every year....

 

Let me throw out THIS thought.....some here are thinking that we can just draft a lower round QB and make due while we complete our lines.

 

- The rebiulding of our lines started LAST year when we drafted our two starting OG's.

 

- What happens if Gailey works his magic on offense and we are good enought to get to a say.....8-8 record? This puts us OUT OF REACH of the top 10 pick next year to grab a starting caliber QB. We will either have to try to lure in a quality free agent (something we have not been having success at) or hope somebody like McCoy or Tebow works out.

 

Right here....right now you have a starting caliber QB that pretty much by luck could be there when we pick.......and we are going to talk ourselves out of it?

 

I ALSO want one of the OT's.......but what happens when they are not there? A lot of people ahead of us need a offensive linemen as well.

[robertpaul49]

I think it all depends on who is available. However, if the top three offensive tackles are not available then Clausen should be the choice, without question. The last great quarterback the Bills have had was Kelly. This would be the highest that they've drafted a quarterback as long as I can remember. I'm really sick of the third round, second round, and first round (who should have been second round) quaterbacks.

 

The talk about attitidute is making me sick because I remember it was the same reason that Done-a-ho drafted Mike Williams over McKinnie

 

If they reach for an offensive tackle just to fill a need, like they did with Lynch (Didn't Levy say that they were going to take character into account during that draft, which was why I was completely surprised by that draft choice?, sorry should be different thread). I'm going to go into morning.

 

The Bills have so many needs, and quarterback has been a bigger and longer need than Left Tackle. They need to do everything in their power to get a franchise quarterback. In fact, it would not bother me at all if they draft Clausen, Trent steps up and Clausen is a bust.

[CountDorkula]

I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play football...BUT for the same reasons guys like Leaf don't make it in the pros...Leaf could play ball...he set all kinds of records in college...he had a great arm and was destined for greatness...but the pressure destroyed his career because he was a cry baby loser like Jimmy Clausen is...so...ummm...yeah...I dislike him for reasons that are NOT his ability to play football but that WILL get in the way of him using his football ability effectively...GET IT NOW????....

 

Im glad you are so insightful. The kid played with basically a broken foot. (Torn ligaments in his foot and a broken toe) Not sure how he is a crybaby. If you dont like him fine but at least get the fact straight.

 

And this is a new one, because Ryan Leaf sucked means Jimmy Clausen will??? Please explain how that works out. i dont know if he will be good, if they draft him ok if they dont all well, but i know the kid has guts and an "im it" attitude, just like Tom Brady and yes Peyton manning.

[1B4IDie]

Wait, which QB can simply "throw a team on his shoulder and win"??

 

Seems like Elway couldn't do it until Shanahan and Davis showed up. And Manning has done it once (against Rex Grossman!) despite spending a large chunk of his career throwing to the best receivers (WR, TE) in the league. I won't even mention McNabb's problems winning the big game "on his shoulders"...

 

 

Clausen's offense racked up 452 ypg--8th in the country and scored 30 ppg. When his team was playing defense (poorly), exactly how was he supposed to influence their play?

 

Thses comments are ridiculous.

 

Why don't you just come and say "I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play QB" and leave it at that? At least it would be an honest post.

 

Winning doesn't mean a Super Bowl you silly boy.

Incase you haven't noticed the bills are a 7-9 team.

 

John Elway, Marino, Manning, and McNabb took 7-9 quality teams to the playoffs and beyond.

 

Jimmy Clausen couldn't win in ND. He can't take a 7-9 Bills team to the playoffs.

 

Dan LeFevour owns a ton of passing records, way better numbers than Jimmy Clausen, with your faulty logic, Dan LeFevour would be the better QB in the NFL.

 

Jimmy Clausen will become the next Brady Quinn on a team that has no line & no WRs, a young TE, an overachieving RB, an underachieving RB, and a defense that can't stop the run.

 

He is not the right fit for the Bills.

 

There will be another highly skilled QB next year or later in the draft, the Bills are much better served using a top 10 pick on getting better on both lines .

 

He is not a once in every ten year, throw the franchise on the back type of player.

Plus his forehead is goofy looking, thats the real reason I don't think he will be a fit on the Bills, not the logical, obvious argument above.

[Mr. WEO]

I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play football...BUT for the same reasons guys like Leaf don't make it in the pros...Leaf could play ball...he set all kinds of records in college...he had a great arm and was destined for greatness...but the pressure destroyed his career because he was a cry baby loser like Jimmy Clausen is...so...ummm...yeah...I dislike him for reasons that are NOT his ability to play football but that WILL get in the way of him using his football ability effectively...GET IT NOW????....

I get that you have trouble with some pretty basic concepts.

 

Why do you have to bring in Leaf? Clausen has already played very well in a pro-style offense in a high pressure/high visibility program and despite a crappy defense. Leaf played at Washington STATE!

 

Oh yeah, Clausen doesn't doesn't like losing.

 

I'm guessing you are posting as a sort of goof---with your ebonics-laden impulsive outbursts solely meant to provoke a response. If so, congrats---you got me! If not, yikes!

[Brand J]

Winning doesn't mean a Super Bowl you silly boy.

Incase you haven't noticed the bills are a 7-9 team.

 

John Elway, Marino, Manning, and McNabb took 7-9 quality teams to the playoffs and beyond.

 

Jimmy Clausen couldn't win in ND. He can't take a 7-9 Bills team to the playoffs.

 

Dan LeFevour owns a ton of passing records, way better numbers than Jimmy Clausen, with your faulty logic, Dan LeFevour would be the better QB in the NFL.

 

Jimmy Clausen will become the next Brady Quinn on a team that has no line & no WRs, a young TE, an overachieving RB, an underachieving RB, and a defense that can't stop the run.

 

He is not the right fit for the Bills.

 

There will be another highly skilled QB next year or later in the draft, the Bills are much better served using a top 10 pick on getting better on both lines .

 

He is not a once in every ten year, throw the franchise on the back type of player.

Plus his forehead is goofy looking, thats the real reason I don't think he will be a fit on the Bills, not the logical, obvious argument above.

 

Your argument is far from logical. First, was Dan LeFevour playing against the same level of competition as Jimmy Clausen? LeFevour didn't put up better numbers as a senior than did Clausen and was playing in a far less competitive conference.

Sure, there may be another highly skilled QB (or two) next year in the NFL draft, but will the Bills be in a position to draft him? QB is the MOST important position on an NFL team - something that seems to get lost with many of you. Would I rather have a Pro Bowl QB or a Pro Bowl LT? That question isn't even up for debate..

[dgrid]

- What happens if Gailey works his magic on offense and we are good enought to get to a say.....8-8 record? This puts us OUT OF REACH of the top 10 pick next year to grab a starting caliber QB. We will either have to try to lure in a quality free agent (something we have not been having success at) or hope somebody like McCoy or Tebow works out.

 

Right here....right now you have a starting caliber QB that pretty much by luck could be there when we pick.......and we are going to talk ourselves out of it?

I agree w/ that. If the Bills record does steadily improve, this may be our top pick for awile. That's a big IF, of course.

But easier to get our other positions of need filled lower down in draft in future yrs, OT, OLB, NT, RB (did i forget any?) all easier to fill later in draft than QB.

[1B4IDie]

Your argument is far from logical. First, was Dan LeFevour playing against the same level of competition as Jimmy Clausen? LeFevour didn't put up better numbers as a senior than did Clausen and was playing in a far less competitive conference.

Sure, there may be another highly skilled QB (or two) next year in the NFL draft, but will the Bills be in a position to draft him? QB is the MOST important position on an NFL team - something that seems to get lost with many of you. Would I rather have a Pro Bowl QB or a Pro Bowl LT? That question isn't even up for debate..

 

What gets lost on you people is that Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf, Tim Couch, Brady Quinn, Matt Leinartt and the list goes on, all looked just as good as Jimmy Clausen some better, some worse.

But they all get written off in the "QB First" argument as, "well they sucked, this guy doesn't suck."

All of those guys could have prospered if they were in the right system at the right time.

They all are very talented at throwing the football and all did well in College.

Next year there will be another batch of kids that is very talented at throwing the ball.

By focusing on filling the O-Line in top 10 of the 2010 draft the Bills will be in a much better spot to have success with another talented kid in next year's draft.

Its much better then throwing JC to the wolves and watching him struggle then become a headcase like TE. (not saying TE and JC are on the same talent level, saying that TE was showing potential then got his bell rung behind a horrible line and it never got un-rung)

 

Pro Bowl is a popularity contest and is completely irrelevant, especially for O-Line.

[dgrid]

another thing Clausen vs LeFevour- Clausen was exposed to much higher pressure than LeFevour as well, by playing at ND.

but yeah, Clausen does have a weird looking forehead.

[CountDorkula]

What gets lost on you people is that Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf, Tim Couch, Brady Quinn, Matt Leinartt and the list goes on, all looked just as good as Jimmy Clausen some better, some worse.

But they all get written off in the "QB First" argument as, "well they sucked, this guy doesn't suck."

All of those guys could have prospered if they were in the right system at the right time.

They all are very talented at throwing the football and all did well in College.

Next year there will be another batch of kids that is very talented at throwing the ball.By focusing on filling the O-Line in top 10 of the 2010 draft the Bills will be in a much better spot to have success with another talented kid in next year's draft.

Its much better then throwing JC to the wolves and watching him struggle then become a headcase like TE. (not saying TE and JC are on the same talent level, saying that TE was showing potential then got his bell rung behind a horrible line and it never got un-rung)

 

Pro Bowl is a popularity contest and is completely irrelevant, especially for O-Line.

 

So what you are saying is because those guys, who have nothign to do with Clausen "suck". This means Clausen will suck.

 

Yet you counter your own argument by saying there will be Qb's next year with numbers who will be compared to the others and be good...

[Brand J]

What gets lost on you people is that Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf, Tim Couch, Brady Quinn, Matt Leinartt and the list goes on, all looked just as good as _____________ some better, some worse.

But they all get written off in the "QB First" argument as, "well they sucked, this guy doesn't suck."

All of those guys could have prospered if they were in the right system at the right time.

They all are very talented at throwing the football and all did well in College.

Next year there will be another batch of kids that is very talented at throwing the ball.

By focusing on filling the O-Line in top 10 of the 2010 draft the Bills will be in a much better spot to have success with another talented kid in next year's draft.

Its much better then throwing JC to the wolves and watching him struggle then become a headcase like TE. (not saying TE and JC are on the same talent level, saying that TE was showing potential then got his bell rung behind a horrible line and it never got un-rung)

 

Pro Bowl is a popularity contest and is completely irrelevant, especially for O-Line.

 

You could just as easily insert EVERY QBs name into that sentence, but decided to focus on Clausen. Your argument remains the same if everyone's favorite QB this year - Sam Bradford - is inserted into your sentence. The performance of one human being, in no way correlates to that of another. We are all individuals and you have just as much knowledge as I do whether or not Clausen will succeed or fail - 0. At some point, our young QB is going to have to take the reigns of this team - would you rather it be now, or 2 - 3 years down the road?

It doesn't matter if the ProBowl is a popularity contest - I'd take any of those ProBowl QBs over our QBs, before I take any of those ProBowl LTs...

[Erik Flowers]

Clausen has a weird shaped head - helmets won't fit him right - he will be prone to concussions.

[Mr. WEO]

Winning doesn't mean a Super Bowl you silly boy.

Incase you haven't noticed the bills are a 7-9 team.

 

John Elway, Marino, Manning, and McNabb took 7-9 quality teams to the playoffs and beyond.

 

Jimmy Clausen couldn't win in ND. He can't take a 7-9 Bills team to the playoffs.

 

Dan LeFevour owns a ton of passing records, way better numbers than Jimmy Clausen, with your faulty logic, Dan LeFevour would be the better QB in the NFL.

 

Jimmy Clausen will become the next Brady Quinn on a team that has no line & no WRs, a young TE, an overachieving RB, an underachieving RB, and a defense that can't stop the run.

 

He is not the right fit for the Bills.

 

There will be another highly skilled QB next year or later in the draft, the Bills are much better served using a top 10 pick on getting better on both lines .

 

He is not a once in every ten year, throw the franchise on the back type of player.

Plus his forehead is goofy looking, thats the real reason I don't think he will be a fit on the Bills, not the logical, obvious argument above.

 

There's no debating the greatness of these QB's (minus McNabb). Just saying it is clearly, factually incorrect that they "willed their teams to win" or "carried them on their shoulders to victory". Just nonsense.

 

If all the teams that need a franchise QB are waiting to pick a "one in ten year QB", logic should tell you that none will likely ever draft one.

[JohnC]

I don't like Clausen for reasons other than his ability to play football...BUT for the same reasons guys like Leaf don't make it in the pros...Leaf could play ball...he set all kinds of records in college...he had a great arm and was destined for greatness...but the pressure destroyed his career because he was a cry baby loser like Jimmy Clausen is...so...ummm...yeah...I dislike him for reasons that are NOT his ability to play football but that WILL get in the way of him using his football ability effectively...GET IT NOW????....

 

Ryan Leaf had physical tools but limited mental and pyschological tools to survive the rigors of the NFL. Leaf really didn't care much about football. He didn't have enough passion for the game to put much effort into preparing for the game. You can't say that about Clausen. There is no qb in this draft who studies more and prepares for the games than he does.

 

As another poster stated Clausen was playing with a broken toe and torn ligaments in his foot. He didn't have surgery until after the season. Clausen did have some maturity issues when he was a freshman. So what. He was maybe 18 yrs old at that point. In the three seasons he played he got better in each season. What most analysts say about him is that he is presently the most pro prepared qb in this draft.

 

There are scouts who like Clausen; and there are scouts who don't like Clausen. There is nothing unusual about a difference in opinion about a player. But criticizing and labeling him as a bad or flawed character makes absolutely no sense because it is predicated on nothing but falsehoods.

[GrudginglyPessimistic]

What gets lost on you people is that Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf, Tim Couch, Brady Quinn, Matt Leinartt and the list goes on, all looked just as good as Jimmy Clausen some better, some worse.

But they all get written off in the "QB First" argument as, "well they sucked, this guy doesn't suck."

All of those guys could have prospered if they were in the right system at the right time.

They all are very talented at throwing the football and all did well in College.

Next year there will be another batch of kids that is very talented at throwing the ball.

By focusing on filling the O-Line in top 10 of the 2010 draft the Bills will be in a much better spot to have success with another talented kid in next year's draft.

Its much better then throwing JC to the wolves and watching him struggle then become a headcase like TE. (not saying TE and JC are on the same talent level, saying that TE was showing potential then got his bell rung behind a horrible line and it never got un-rung)

 

Pro Bowl is a popularity contest and is completely irrelevant, especially for O-Line.

Yes the Pro Bowl in many ways is a popularity contest. However one method for being popular is to be a very good player. Outside of making arguing simpler (with the cost of it being the arguments end up lacking a lot of accuracy) there is no good reason to assume the Pro Bowl is either completely irrelevant as you claim or a totally accurate determinant of who is good.

 

Neither is true.

 

With Pro Bowl voting consisting of 1/3 player opinion, 1/3 coach opinion and 1/3 fan opinion the Pro Bowl results do have significant failures in terms of identifying great players, but in general I think the results easily identify players as being in the top half of the league at their positions and actually does identify the likely best players at their positions in many cases.

 

Is a Pro Bowl berth a 100% indicator of greatness ?

 

No no way.

 

However, is it completely irrelevant.

 

No way to that thought as well.

 

Its like the NFL QB rating. Is it a great or even very good rating of QB performance?

 

No.

 

However is it the best numeric summation of the position we have and thus can be dismissed but not without a reason.

 

Yep.

 

A Pro Bowl nod can be easily dismissed for a reasonable reason but it is simply not true to claim it is 100% irrelevant to a thinking fan.

[CarolinaBill]

Clausen has a weird shaped head - helmets won't fit him right - he will be prone to concussions.

how many has he had so far?

 

answer: 0

 

how many concussions has tebow had?

 

answer: 1 at least

 

so we shouldnt take clausen cause he may get concussions

 

and we shouldnt take tebow because he has a history of concussions

 

so who's next?