The Bills draft bar has been set pretty low

[Rico]

Looking at the list of previous Bill's staff top draft picks (below) is all you need to know about why there hasn't been one whiff of the playoffs in WNY for a very long time. Number one picks should be able to make an impact or contribute right away, especially since a lot of guaranteed money has been tied up in these picks (Wood was unfortunately injured last year).

 

2000 Erik Flowers *

2001 Nate Clements

2002 Mike Williams *

2003 Willis McGahee *

2004 Lee Evans

2004 J.P. Losman *

2005 No 1st Round Pick, Roscoe Parrish (2nd Round)?

2006 Donte Whitner *

2006 John McCargo *

2007 Marshawn Lynch *

2008 Leodis McKelvin T ?

2009 Aaron Maybin *

2009 Eric Wood?

 

(* = bust?)

 

These players did not pick themselves and in hindsight, some of the Bill's top draft selections have been really bad, but at some point, maybe teams should start looking at all the guaranteed bonus money that is tied up for top draft picks and implement a fair rookie cap - where performance is rewarded instead of which round someone decided to select you. Beside drafting a dud that does not make an impact, another problem with the guaranteed money is that bad top picks (like McCargo) tend to stay on the roster longer. Sometimes you just need to just cut your loses and move on - and a rookie cap would make the minefield of bad investments a little easier to navigate.

Nate is the only one on that list that (to date) ever exceeded my expectations. On the current roster, only Fred Jackson, Terrence McGee, George Wilson, Kyle Williams, and Brian Moorman have exceeded my expectations to date... no coincidence that they are also my favorite players on the team by far.

 

ETA: Forgot Byrd.

[Bob in STL]

I will address the bold:

 

1) Parrish was an idiotic selection. The team was small and weak. TD used our top pick to make it smaller and weaker.

 

2) You don't draft a "good" safety at #8, unless the team either SO great that he is the missing link (highly unlikely for any team let alone the Bills) or you actually want to lose football games. Whitner was one of the dumbest selections I have ever seen, and this is not hindsight, trust me.

 

3) McCargo is a bust. He is a lousy player.

 

4) McKelvin was another stupid selection, but par for the course of the Levy/Jauron "play not to lose" mentality. Once again they used their best resources to draft a defensive back to play on a team that is poor in the trenches.

 

The best selection was Clements, because they traded down 7 spots to get him, and made good use of the extra 2nd round pick. In essence, they got Clements and Travis Henry (not one of my favorites mind you) for their original 14th selection, and took Schobel with their own selection in round 2. Not too shabby.

 

I don't think most fans can, or are willing to see just how much damage Levy/Jauron did to this team. It is going to take time and a lot of luck to undo their losing methods.

 

1. Agree

2. Don't you think they must of thought the "good" safety was going to be "great". And you are using hindsight.

3. Agree .. and it will be official in July when he gets cut.

4. I did not like the McKelvin pick either but fail to see what it has to do with "play not to lose" .

[oak tree 12]

Looking at the list of previous Bill's staff top draft picks (below) is all you need to know about why there hasn't been one whiff of the playoffs in WNY for a very long time. Number one picks should be able to make an impact or contribute right away, especially since a lot of guaranteed money has been tied up in these picks (Wood was unfortunately injured last year).

 

2000 Erik Flowers *

2001 Nate Clements

2002 Mike Williams *

2003 Willis McGahee *

2004 Lee Evans

2004 J.P. Losman *

2005 No 1st Round Pick, Roscoe Parrish (2nd Round)?

2006 Donte Whitner *

2006 John McCargo *

2007 Marshawn Lynch *

2008 Leodis McKelvin T ?

2009 Aaron Maybin *

2009 Eric Wood?

 

(* = bust?)

 

These players did not pick themselves and in hindsight, some of the Bill's top draft selections have been really bad, but at some point, maybe teams should start looking at all the guaranteed bonus money that is tied up for top draft picks and implement a fair rookie cap - where performance is rewarded instead of which round someone decided to select you. Beside drafting a dud that does not make an impact, another problem with the guaranteed money is that bad top picks (like McCargo) tend to stay on the roster longer. Sometimes you just need to just cut your loses and move on - and a rookie cap would make the minefield of bad investments a little easier to navigate.

 

please tell me what in hell that has to do with the Nix regime.

 

you failed to mention that last year when Nix joined the team we had our best draft in 10 years.

 

secondly your comment on Maybin only shows you are clueless. the guy was drafted as a 20 year old and was totally used out of position.

 

he is a prototypical OLB in a 3/4 and i cant wait to hear what you have to say after this year when Maybin tears up this league and garnishes double digit sacks.

 

talk about a post that has absolutely nothing to do with this edition of the bills from the coaching staff to the football personnel people,really man you wasting all our time with this crap. your comparing apples to oranges!

[/dev/null]

2000 Erik Flowers Bust

2001 Nate Clements Very good CB

2002 Mike Williams Epic Bust

2003 Willis McGahee Wasted pick but not exactly a bust

2004 Lee Evans Worth a 1st rounder but nothing spectacular

2004 J.P. Losman Bust

2005 No 1st Round Pick, Roscoe Parrish (2nd Round)? Neither impact nor a 2nd round bust

2006 Donte Whitner Solid starter but not worth 9th overall pick

2006 John McCargo Bust

2007 Marshawn Lynch Bust

2008 Leodis McKelvin Too soon to tell but leaning towards bust

2009 Aaron Maybin Too soon to tell

2009 Eric Wood Catastrophic injuries trump any claims of being a bust. Even if he never plays another down, there is no way to call him a bust

 

So I'd say Clements is the best 1st rounder of the decade followed by Evans

[Pondslider]

I didn't see anything that specified they were talking about their rookie year only, otherwise, Jairus Byrd would be it since he led the league in INTs. I was refering to over the course of their career.

 

Well the OP's focus is on 1st round and/or 1st picks in the draft and their ability to..well... I'll just quote it:

 

Number one picks should be able to make an impact or contribute right away

 

*snip list of 1st Round picks/1st picks for Bills*

 

So Byrd being a 2nd rounder and 3rd selection by the Bills in the draft wouldn't fit either.

[Bill from NYC]

2. Don't you think they must of thought the "good" safety was going to be "great". And you are using hindsight.

 

I make the case that wrt the Bills, it didn't matter. This was a very bad football team. The Levy/Jauron choice of rebuilding was to sign expensive free agents who sucked, and to waste their best draft choices on defensive backs such as Whitner, Youboty and Ko Simpson. This was their method of building a football team. They also gave away a pick in the process.

The Bills entered the first 06 draft with the #8, a 2nd and 2 early 3rds, 4 nice picks. They left with Whitner, McCargo and Youboty, and followed up this mess with Ko Simpson in the early 4th. Oh, and Levy himself stated that they spurned multiple trade down offers.

My point is that Whitner, even if he was great and didn't have off field issues, was not what a weak team that plays in the cold needed, and I was screaming this right here on the day he was drafted.

 

4. I did not like the McKelvin pick either but fail to see what it has to do with "play not to lose" .

 

Defensive backs are the last defense againt scoring. The Bills were drafting blue chip secondary players with most of their best picks and playing them 50 yards away from scrimage. Strong teams attack up front. They stack up the run and pressure the QB. The Bills otoh had little safeties playing LB last year and it was disgraceful.

Look at it like this if you will.....Berry might be great. Do you want the Bills to draft him or fix their other, more important problems?

 

Btw, thanks for the great dialogue, and Happy Easter to you and yours.

[LGB]

2000 Erik Flowers Bust

2001 Nate Clements Very good CB

2002 Mike Williams Epic Bust

2003 Willis McGahee Wasted pick but not exactly a bust

2004 Lee Evans Worth a 1st rounder but nothing spectacular

2004 J.P. Losman Bust

2005 No 1st Round Pick, Roscoe Parrish (2nd Round)? Neither impact nor a 2nd round bust

2006 Donte Whitner Solid starter but not worth 9th overall pick

2006 John McCargo Bust

2007 Marshawn Lynch Bust

2008 Leodis McKelvin Too soon to tell but leaning towards bust

2009 Aaron Maybin Too soon to tell

2009 Eric Wood Catastrophic injuries trump any claims of being a bust. Even if he never plays another down, there is no way to call him a bust

 

So I'd say Clements is the best 1st rounder of the decade followed by Evans

 

Agreed. Back in 2001, Clements really performed just as you would would like to see a 1st rounder perform: played in all 16 games, had 3 forced fumbles and 3 interceptions...and made a positive impact.

 

Sure there have been other 1st round busts on other teams, but clearly for 10 years the Bills problems have had problems with bust picks. These bad choices have been made worse by all the guaranteed money has been tied up in these picks.

 

Seriously, in the last five years, would you say that any of the top picks have deserved the millions of guaranteed dollars they were paid (wood and his injury excluded)?

 

If all the top 2010 talent that you seek is gone by pick nine, you might want to look at trading down. Staying near the top of the first round has not been working.

[Celtic_soulja]

TBD is Too Damn Harsh....

 

Donte is a good safety and will be much better if he is used in an attacking scheme...you guys are the same crew that thinks George Wilson is an EXCELLENT SS...not so...Donte is better suited for a TRUE strong safety and you'll alll be able to see that this season...he is far from a bust...

 

The only true busts on that list are Flowers and Big Mike....the last two years you can't make ANY assessments...

 

JP Losman was ok and didn't really have enough time to develop IMO...but I could see labelling him as a bust....and McCargo has just had too little playing time to show if he's good or not...you get flashes but with all the injuries he's had its not like you can say he sucks...at least I couldn't say that...

 

Alll the other players have done good things...you cannot control them running away from Buffalo after a few years...you can draft them and sign them, but it's up to them when they become free agents where they end up...

[spartacus]

Agreed. Back in 2001, Clements really performed just as you would would like to see a 1st rounder perform: played in all 16 games, had 3 forced fumbles and 3 interceptions...and made a positive impact.

 

Sure there have been other 1st round busts on other teams, but clearly for 10 years the Bills problems have had problems with bust picks. These bad choices have been made worse by all the guaranteed money has been tied up in these picks.

 

Seriously, in the last five years, would you say that any of the top picks have deserved the millions of guaranteed dollars they were paid (wood and his injury excluded)?

 

If all the top 2010 talent that you seek is gone by pick nine, you might want to look at trading down. Staying near the top of the first round has not been working.

 

what is not working is employing 6 scouts to evaluate all of the college talent and having a part-time

guy manage these guys from his home 1500 miles away from OBD.

 

and now Modrak reports to another work-at-home semi-retired guy living in Tennessee

 

after these guys colloborated on picking that super-stud Maybin last year, don't expect the performance to improve much in 2010.

 

maybe they can find a 220 lb guy to play LT - it sure worked for DE in 2009.

[LGB]

what is not working is employing 6 scouts to evaluate all of the college talent and having a part-time

guy manage these guys from his home 1500 miles away from OBD.

 

and now Modrak reports to another work-at-home semi-retired guy living in Tennessee

 

after these guys colloborated on picking that super-stud Maybin last year, don't expect the performance to improve much in 2010.

 

maybe they can find a 220 lb guy to play LT - it sure worked for DE in 2009.

 

Now since the Redskins probably won't draft a QB with McNabb on board, Okung, Williams and Campbell will likely be gone by pick nine.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Eric Moulds (drafted in 1996) took a while to bloom, but once he did (in 1998), he stood out as the best player or one of the best players on the team for about the next four years (1998-2002).

 

Since we are going way back in time, here is the list since 1980 and to look at this list compared to the 2000s, twenty years without an apparent major bust looks pretty good!

 

1980 Jim Ritcher

1981 Booker Moore

1982 Perry Tuttle

1983 Tony Hunter

1983 Jim Kelly

1984 Greg Bell

1985 Bruce Smith, 1st Overall

1985 Derrick Burroughs

1986 Ronnie Harmon

1986 Will Wolford

1987 Shane Conlan

1988 No 1st Rd Pick, Thurman Thomas (2nd Round)

1989 No 1st Rd Pick, Don Beebe (3rd Round)

1990 James Williams

1991 Henry Jones

1992 John Fina

1993 Thomas Smith

1994 Jeff Burris

1995 Ruben Brown

1996 Eric Moulds

1997 Antowain Smith

1998 No 1st Rd Pick, Sam Cowart (2nd Round)

1999 Antoine Winfield

 

So what does this list combined with a good staff equate to?

 

Playoff appearances in 1980, 1981, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999

AFC East Division championships: 1980, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993, 1995

AFC Conference championships: 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993

Buffalo Bills General Manager - Bill Polian: 1986–1993

________________________________________________________________

 

Unfortunately since 1999, the number of 1st round busts have been plenty and the number of playoff appearances is zero

________________________________________________________________

 

Perry Tuttle, for one, was a major bust. (See also Tony Hunter, Booker Moore, and JD Williams -- the infamous "blind CB".)

[billsfreak]

Well the OP's focus is on 1st round and/or 1st picks in the draft and their ability to..well... I'll just quote it:

 

 

 

So Byrd being a 2nd rounder and 3rd selection by the Bills in the draft wouldn't fit either.

So I guess Bruce Smith wouldn't qualify either, his first year or two he wasn't anything special, overweight and even got a suspension.

[Pondslider]

So I guess Bruce Smith wouldn't qualify either, his first year or two he wasn't anything special, overweight and even got a suspension.

 

I guess so.

[Celtic_soulja]

Bruce got like 7 sacks his rookie year and 15 his second year?...sounds pretty special to me...maybe I'm just not seeing something