drnykterstein Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 And yet you accuse others of spreading fear? ???? This actually happens to people. If someone is stabbing you and you are yelling out "this guy is stabbing me", should I accuse you of spreading fear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 ???? This actually happens to people. If someone is stabbing you and you are yelling out "this guy is stabbing me", should I accuse you of spreading fear? Ok so you have the choice between risking an insurance company !@#$s you over (for which you could probably protect yourself by going over the contract) or waiting hours, days, weeks or months in a hospital just to get treatment because people with a simple !@#$ing cough will go to the emergency room since it's free and they have nothing better to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnykterstein Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Ok so you have the choice between risking an insurance company !@#$s you over (for which you could probably protect yourself by going over the contract) or waiting hours, days, weeks or months in a hospital just to get treatment because people with a simple !@#$ing cough will go to the emergency room since it's free and they have nothing better to do. Yes well. This post is so absurd that I'm going to assume you are just arguing for the sake of argument and not because you believe what you are saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Yes well. This post is so absurd that I'm going to assume you are just arguing for the sake of argument and not because you believe what you are saying. It's so absurd? I live in Canada you moron. This is what people go through. Hospitals are overcrowded, go read about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnykterstein Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 It's so absurd? I live in Canada you moron. This is what people go through. Hospitals are overcrowded, go read about it. Ok well it's absurd on two points... First off, reading your contract does not help at all. There are full time employees with incentive programs to find loopholes in your coverage and deny you because of the loopholes. Everybody is not a lawyer, and even if they did see the loophole, there is not a lot of choice sometimes. You go with the insurer that your employer picks. Secondly, the end result... how long you live, the average life expectancy... Canadians live two years longer than US Citizens. Third, nothing on the docket for current US reform even resembles the Canadian system (even though I wish it did). Fourth, You have the option to pay for private care if you want. No one is stopping you. You can even get private insurance to pay for the private care. It's out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Ok well it's absurd on two points... First off, reading your contract does not help at all. There are full time employees with incentive programs to find loopholes in your coverage and deny you because of the loopholes. Everybody is not a lawyer, and even if they did see the loophole, there is not a lot of choice sometimes. You go with the insurer that your employer picks. So Insurance companies will spend excess dollars to ensure that you don't have eough coverage rather than using those excess dollars to providge coverage? Secondly, the end result... how long you live, the average life expectancy... Canadians live two years longer than US Citizens. Really? Wouldn't you say that it's the result of the obesity rate in the US being higher than in Canada? Third, nothing on the docket for current US reform even resembles the Canadian system (even though I wish it did). So why are you pushing an agenda that you clearly don't think is as efficient as it should be? Fourth, You have the option to pay for private care if you want. No one is stopping you. You can even get private insurance to pay for the private care. It's out there. So not only do you have to pay with your tax dollars to support other peoples health care, you also have to purchase other insurance if you don't agree with it??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 It's so absurd? I live in Canada you moron. This is what people go through. Hospitals are overcrowded, go read about it. So Insurance companies will spend excess dollars to ensure that you don't have eough coverage rather than using those excess dollars to providge coverage? Really? Wouldn't you say that it's the result of the obesity rate in the US being higher than in Canada? So why are you pushing an agenda that you clearly don't think is as efficient as it should be? So not only do you have to pay with your tax dollars to support other peoples health care, you also have to purchase other insurance if you don't agree with it??? Reading thru meazza's posts, I can almost hear the Mortal Kombat voice...Finish Him!!! All that's left now is for meazza to rip out conner's spine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 ???? This actually happens to people. If someone is stabbing you and you are yelling out "this guy is stabbing me", should I accuse you of spreading fear? How often? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Well personally my biggest problem is the fear that if I get cancer or something my company will refuse to pay for treatment. They'll find some small quirk in small print or something and deny me coverage. They do this frequently. And then I'll be dead. Lack of payment is only an issue between me and my insurance company. What is the point of insurance if they don't insure anything? Read your policy, it will tell you what coverage you have. So if you have government health care and the government denies you coverage, you'll accept that? If the government decides that certain treatments are too expensive or you are too old to bother with (like they do in the UK) you're OK with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnykterstein Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 So Insurance companies will spend excess dollars to ensure that you don't have eough coverage rather than using those excess dollars to providge coverage? They do. It's a matter of cost analysis. Apparently they did the analysis and this was the scenario that made them the most money. Are you telling me they have other goals besides profits? Really? Wouldn't you say that it's the result of the obesity rate in the US being higher than in Canada? I'm sure that factors in, among other causes. So why are you pushing an agenda that you clearly don't think is as efficient as it should be? Gotta take what you can get, I suppose. It's better than doing nothing. So not only do you have to pay with your tax dollars to support other peoples health care, you also have to purchase other insurance if you don't agree with it??? Welcome to America. It's against the law to turn away anyone at an emergency room. So our tax dollars pay for everyone who is not insured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Ok well it's absurd on two points... First off, reading your contract does not help at all. There are full time employees with incentive programs to find loopholes in your coverage and deny you because of the loopholes. Everybody is not a lawyer, and even if they did see the loophole, there is not a lot of choice sometimes. You go with the insurer that your employer picks. Secondly, the end result... how long you live, the average life expectancy... Canadians live two years longer than US Citizens. Third, nothing on the docket for current US reform even resembles the Canadian system (even though I wish it did). Fourth, You have the option to pay for private care if you want. No one is stopping you. You can even get private insurance to pay for the private care. It's out there. You're right on getting what your employer offers without much choice. There's a very good argument for health insurance to be removed entirely from the grasp of employers and left up to each person to pick exactly the coverage they want from the carrier they choose. We could transition away from employer based coverage to individual coverage through tax credits which could be funded by employers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Welcome to America. It's against the law to turn away anyone at an emergency room. So our tax dollars pay for everyone who is not insured. Believe it or not, lots of people that don't have coverage pay the bill after services are rendered. Those treated without insurance coverage or Medicare/caid are not funded with taxpayer dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Name one country where socialized healthcare turned out badly. You have plenty of examples to pick from. Name one. USSR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 You go with the insurer that your employer picks. Or you buy your own. You're not required to use your employer's program. Secondly, the end result... how long you live, the average life expectancy... Canadians live two years longer than US Citizens. Has absolutely jack **** to do with individual health care. Has more to do with lifestyle and public health (which I'm sure you, in your infinite stupidity, would confuse with public health care, even though they're completely different). Fourth, You have the option to pay for private care if you want. No one is stopping you. You can even get private insurance to pay for the private care. It's out there. But in the American system, you're limited strictly to what your employer offers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnykterstein Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 USSR Hmmm... A google search of this comes up empty. Do you have any supporting data at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Has absolutely jack **** to do with individual health care. Has more to do with lifestyle and public health (which I'm sure you, in your infinite stupidity, would confuse with public health care, even though they're completely different). +1. This was exactly the point I was gonna make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Hmmm...A google search of this comes up empty. Do you have any supporting data at all? http://tinyurl.com/ya5e5r5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Hmmm...A google search of this comes up empty. Do you have any supporting data at all? What kind of data do you want? That Communist party insiders would travel abroad to have serious medical procedures? I'm sure you can come up with a proper google search term for that. It's mindboggling that the world is composed of too many simpletons like you. People are giving you countless examples of why this healthcare bill is a terrible idea, why you cling to the nonsensical thought that it's a bad thing to trust a competitive corporation but absolutely no qualms about trusting a bigger non-caring government behemoth. Why in any sense of a comparison, governments perform services much worse than private corporations. That is proven that progress is usually thwarted whenever governments get their mitts on R&D. Yet this is exactly the regime that you want to place on an industry that can only survive through innovation. For the last time, the problem with healthcare is hiding the true cost of services from the consumers and the expectation that medical practitioners are infallible and you should live forever. Has anyone called you a simpleton yet today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Hmmm...A google search of this comes up empty. Do you have any supporting data at all? You didn't say "caused the downfall", you said "turned out badly". That is awfully easy to research...I could recommend a some good books on the subject (Laurie Garret's Betrayal of Trust, as a start), but sadly for you they're not coloring books... (Someone please quote so conner can read. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnykterstein Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 GG, a million things wrong with your post. You should really just go back to 1985 and stay there. you cling to the nonsensical thought that it's a bad thing to trust a competitive corporation but absolutely no qualms about trusting a bigger non-caring government behemoth I could word this with equally unfair wording.. You cling the nonsensical thought that it's bad thing to trust a voter accountable government but absolutely no qualms about trusting a non-caring shareholder profit driven corporate behemoth. (neither is wording is true) For the last time, the problem with healthcare is hiding the true cost of services from the consumers and the expectation that medical practitioners are infallible and you should live forever. This is the first time anyone's said that. And it's so absurd that I can see why. The CBO did estimates on Tort Reform, turns out that with optimistic estimates that the savings are 0.5% on national health care costs. Not that I'm against that, but it's a drop in the bucket. Also if you've read this thread, my complaints are not only against costs, but against insurance companies not covering people who paid for coverage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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