new stadium?? be careful what you ask for...

[EndZoneCrew]

PTR I agree with you on a lot

 

That is your first mistake....outside of UB athletics...his posts are nauseating to read

[Thoner7]

I say totally refurbish the bathrooms and concession areas, add a Bills HOF themed restaurant and bar.....DONE DEAL PAL! put shelves in the bath rooms so I can have a place to put my beer when I take a piss!

[PromoTheRobot]

PTR I agree with you on a lot, btu not this.

 

do you honestly think a new stadium will increase bills revenues?!?! Brandon has tapped every resource for a sponsor - from Xerox and M&T to baush and lomb. About the only one I haven't seen with their name on the bills is HSBC and Kodak, and i know those two heavily sponsor other sports franchises. I can't see where this "new revenue" stream will come from if we get a new stadium. We had trouble in the early 00's until brandon came on selling our boxes as it was. Unless we somehow start drawing corporations from Hamilton area, I dont see us getting any more competition for our boxes or clubs suites.

 

if they did build a new stadium, I'd hope for it to be bigger actually. 80,000 with similar ticket prices and allowing the 10,000 extra seats to generate more income as opposed to raising fees beyond capacity to support.

I never said a new stadium would increase revenue. I agree it would make little difference in WNY. Brandon has the Bills close to maxed out on revenue. Maybe a few million on naming rights but that's about it.

 

My point is the NFL decides if the Bills stadium is up to league standards, not the fans. If the NFL feels the Bills are not keeping up with the rest of the league in the quality of their facility, by whatever yardstick they use, then we are in danger of losing the franchise. Goodell made the first warning shot over the bow. It doesn't mean we need a new stadium in 2, 3 or 5 years. But we need to start thinking and planning for one in the not too distant future if we expect the NFL to consider WNY as a valid market.

 

Goodell would never say it out loud but I wonder if he isn't thinking about the Bills after Ralph passes away? He may be saying "have a new stadium plan in place and you'll improve the chances a new owner will want to stay."

 

PTR

[rpcolosi]

I never said a new stadium would increase revenue. I agree it would make little difference in WNY. Brandon has the Bills close to maxed out on revenue. Maybe a few million on naming rights but that's about it.

 

My point is the NFL decides if the Bills stadium is up to league standards, not the fans. If the NFL feels the Bills are not keeping up with the rest of the league in the quality of their facility, by whatever yardstick they use, then we are in danger of losing the franchise. Goodell made the first warning shot over the bow. It doesn't mean we need a new stadium in 2, 3 or 5 years. But we need to start thinking and planning for one in the not too distant future if we expect the NFL to consider WNY as a valid market.

 

Goodell would never say it out loud but I wonder if he isn't thinking about the Bills after Ralph passes away? He may be saying "have a new stadium plan in place and you'll improve the chances a new owner will want to stay."

 

PTR

 

 

valid point on staying up with the rest of the league. but instead of building a new one, i'd much rather see another multi million dollar rehab of the ralph. it would be cheaper and easier to modify the stadium in its current state then to build one costing upwards of 400million. i simply don't see ralph, golisano, the league or teh state ponying up that kind of money. and especially not erie county. however, if it required say 25-50mil in renovations, that is far more plausible. there is already a precedent for this (both lambeau and soldier field had huge renovations) and the bills/erie county did so back in the late 90s. in addition, golisano immediately invested into HSBC once he purchased the team. if he were to own the bills it is quite possible he would recognize the same need.

 

my bottom line is - the ralph is at that point where we can update it while maintaing its traditional feel, which is being lost in many stadiums today. i'd personally like to see some more esthetic things done to the outsdie of hte stadium (especially the main signage in front). certainly the bathrooms need to be upgraded, as would the club seats and boxes. but all in all, the design of the stadium is optimal for teh everyday fan and really gives us a place that is significantly louder then most others...

[Nanker]

this is to all those young bucks out here who want a new stadium to be like every other city. i whole heartedly disagree for multiple reasons. the first, we have one of hte oldest AFC stadiums left and it be nice to maintain it and every 10 or 15 years give it a big rehab like Soldier or LAmbeau field. 2nd, it be nice once RW is passed on to rename it Rich STadium the way it was and is and should always be. Finally, the seating arrangement. no where else in the NFL (or very fewp laces) can people like everyone on here afford good seats and good tickets and be on top of the action. Have you guys been to these new stadiums? It costs an arm an a leg to get decently close (ie not below the third tier). When the bills and jets both sucked in 2008 i still had to spend 200 total for 50 yard line seats in the 2nd tier at the meadowlands. that place is a crap hole....

 

the browns stadium, eagles, ravens, bengals, etc - they are all the same. ive ben to them - they look and feel the exactly same. sure, the upper bowls are closer to the field then the ralph, but thats the ONLY place the average fan can afford to sit. luxury boxes take up all the great seats that we still have thankfully. so do club suites. and any time you build a new stadium prices go up, and our area can't continue to sell out games at an avg ticket price of 75/per.

 

WE need to be smart about this and take some pride in Rich stadium.

 

this is the article that says it best (and he hates buffalo as we all know):

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story.../partone/081121

 

You do know who the Rich in Rich Stadium was don't you? Maybe they'd name it Coffee Rich Stadium this time around.

[judman]

be nice to maintain it and every 10 or 15 years give it a big rehab like Soldier or LAmbeau field. page=simmons/partone/081121"]http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story.../partone/081121[/url]

 

Isn't Soldier Field brand new now? They just left the classic facade in front and built a new stadium behind it.

[DarthICE]

I never said a new stadium would increase revenue. I agree it would make little difference in WNY. Brandon has the Bills close to maxed out on revenue. Maybe a few million on naming rights but that's about it.

 

My point is the NFL decides if the Bills stadium is up to league standards, not the fans. If the NFL feels the Bills are not keeping up with the rest of the league in the quality of their facility, by whatever yardstick they use, then we are in danger of losing the franchise. Goodell made the first warning shot over the bow. It doesn't mean we need a new stadium in 2, 3 or 5 years. But we need to start thinking and planning for one in the not too distant future if we expect the NFL to consider WNY as a valid market.

 

Goodell would never say it out loud but I wonder if he isn't thinking about the Bills after Ralph passes away? He may be saying "have a new stadium plan in place and you'll improve the chances a new owner will want to stay."

 

PTR

 

 

then the Team will leave. Bottom line the Bills nor any other NFL team can survive on such low revenue. The NFL is what it is, either fans pay to keep the teams or they dont. It is up to the FANS to keep a team in their city.

[MarkyMannn]

And we can tell ourselves this as we watch the moving vans take the Bills away to another city with a new stadium.

 

PTR

 

F it then. Fact is the most any fan spends there is 27 hours a year. It's not like you live there

[BillnutinHouston]

Please enlighten us as to why you think it's a POS. I've been to many games over the past 25 years and I think it's a perfectly fine venue to watch a football game.

 

Still no reply to this. I am also curious why people call it a POS.

[mrags]

this is to all those young bucks out here who want a new stadium to be like every other city. i whole heartedly disagree for multiple reasons. the first, we have one of hte oldest AFC stadiums left and it be nice to maintain it and every 10 or 15 years give it a big rehab like Soldier or LAmbeau field. 2nd, it be nice once RW is passed on to rename it Rich STadium the way it was and is and should always be. Finally, the seating arrangement. no where else in the NFL (or very fewp laces) can people like everyone on here afford good seats and good tickets and be on top of the action. Have you guys been to these new stadiums? It costs an arm an a leg to get decently close (ie not below the third tier). When the bills and jets both sucked in 2008 i still had to spend 200 total for 50 yard line seats in the 2nd tier at the meadowlands. that place is a crap hole....

 

the browns stadium, eagles, ravens, bengals, etc - they are all the same. ive ben to them - they look and feel the exactly same. sure, the upper bowls are closer to the field then the ralph, but thats the ONLY place the average fan can afford to sit. luxury boxes take up all the great seats that we still have thankfully. so do club suites. and any time you build a new stadium prices go up, and our area can't continue to sell out games at an avg ticket price of 75/per.

 

WE need to be smart about this and take some pride in Rich stadium.

 

this is the article that says it best (and he hates buffalo as we all know):

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story.../partone/081121

 

You realize that Rich Products had naming rights to the stadium right?!? If they Bills do stay in Buffalo after Ralph dies, I would put money on it that the stadium will Ralph Wilson Stadium for a very long time.

 

I do agree with your point about spending money on big money stadiums and then jacking up the prices. The truth is, even without a new stadium our ticket prices will close to double within 5 years of Ralph dying. If they stay here that is. What we need is upgrades like you stated, an additional end zone level where the scoreboard is now, one that has restaurants, shops, and other NFL game day experiences.

[mrags]

Still no reply to this. I am also curious why people call it a POS.

 

I wouldnt expect one Billnut.

 

Chances are some people that complain dont know. Or are the people that complained after the Power Outage game against San Diego that the bathrooms were horrendous. We made some national news about how bad it was. Rich Yuppy Pricks that didnt realize that because the power was out nothing was working properly. The bathrooms are already bad at the Ralph, but its not like we stand around in 3 inches of piss and crap every game.

[weehawk]

I think the cost to renovate RWS to bring it up so-called NFL standards would hover around 300 million. A new stadium (non-dome) would probably be closer to 750 million if not more.

 

There will be no new stadium for the Bills. I cant see govt money being spent on it and no one would build it privately. If anything, we should be comparing RWS with Lambeau. If GB gets to keep their team with an ancient, renovated stadium, then why are getting pressure?

 

2003 renovation

 

By the end of the 1990s, the Packers believed that they needed to update the facility to remain financially competitive in the NFL. Rather than build a new stadium, Chairman/CEO Bob Harlan and President/COO John Jones unveiled a $295 million plan to renovate Lambeau Field in January 2000. It was to be paid for partly by the team via the 1997-98 stock sale, which netted more than $20 million. Most of the proceeds were to be paid through a 0.5% sales tax in Brown County and personal seat license fees on season ticket holders. After their plan won approval by the Wisconsin State Legislature, it was ratified by Brown County voters on September 12, 2000 by a 53%-47% margin. Construction began early in 2001.

 

The massive redevelopment plan was designed to update the facilities, add more premium and suite seating, yet preserve the seating bowl, keeping the storied natural grass playing field of the "frozen tundra." The project was completed in time for the 2003 season, bringing the current capacity to 72,928. Construction management was conducted by Turner Construction Sports, and proved to be of remarkably little disruption to the 2001 and 2002 seasons. By contrast, the Chicago Bears needed to relocate to Memorial Stadium of the University of Illinois in Champaign in 2002 while Soldier Field was reconfigured.

 

The Packers have now been tenants at Lambeau Field longer than any other NFL team has occupied its own current stadium. In 2007, the Packers completed their 51st season at Lambeau, surpassing the all-time NFL occupancy record set by the Chicago Bears at Wrigley Field (1921–70). (While Soldier Field in Chicago has been the site of a football stadium longer, it was not the home of the Bears until 1971.) Only the Boston Red Sox at Fenway Park and the Chicago Cubs at Wrigley can boast of longer active home-field tenures in American professional sports.

 

So, the Packers are in the NFLs oldest stadium and it's capacity almost matches RWS. Their new ticket avg for next year is $72. Ours is $59. The Packers situation is very much similar to ours. The only way to squeeze more money out of the stadium is to renovate and raise ticket prices. If it's not about money and only about the NFLs vanity, then why doesn't GB get pressured to build a new stadium?

 

Personally, I question the need for a full-blown renovation. If they put $50 million into RWS to update bathrooms, concessions, and other cosmetic stuff, you'd have a stadium as good as Lambeau.

 

 

 

valid point on staying up with the rest of the league. but instead of building a new one, i'd much rather see another multi million dollar rehab of the ralph. it would be cheaper and easier to modify the stadium in its current state then to build one costing upwards of 400million. i simply don't see ralph, golisano, the league or teh state ponying up that kind of money. and especially not erie county. however, if it required say 25-50mil in renovations, that is far more plausible. there is already a precedent for this (both lambeau and soldier field had huge renovations) and the bills/erie county did so back in the late 90s. in addition, golisano immediately invested into HSBC once he purchased the team. if he were to own the bills it is quite possible he would recognize the same need.

 

my bottom line is - the ralph is at that point where we can update it while maintaing its traditional feel, which is being lost in many stadiums today. i'd personally like to see some more esthetic things done to the outsdie of hte stadium (especially the main signage in front). certainly the bathrooms need to be upgraded, as would the club seats and boxes. but all in all, the design of the stadium is optimal for teh everyday fan and really gives us a place that is significantly louder then most others...

[buffalonian]

The Ralph is a fun place to see a game. I enjoy it far more than "state of the art" stadiums where I have attended games. Building a new stadium would be far too expensive to WNY and fans who buy tickets to the game. That being said, the Ralph could use updates in the following areas:

 

1) Bathrooms

2) Concessions

3) Grass field

 

I've often wondered if there is a correlation between the high number of Bills injuries and the playing surface at the Ralph. If there is a connection, we should definitely change to grass.

[PromoTheRobot]

The Ralph is a fun place to see a game. I enjoy it far more than "state of the art" stadiums where I have attended games. Building a new stadium would be far too expensive to WNY and fans who buy tickets to the game. That being said, the Ralph could use updates in the following areas:

 

1) Bathrooms

2) Concessions

3) Grass field

 

I've often wondered if there is a correlation between the high number of Bills injuries and the playing surface at the Ralph. If there is a connection, we should definitely change to grass.

There's an even bigger problem with RWS that would be impossible to fix...the tunnels. What idiot thought making a concourse about 20 feet wide was enough room for 20,000 people? Try to get a beer or go to the bathroom at halftime in the 100 level. Let's hope they never have evacuate the stadium. It would be ugly.

 

PTR

[JOHNNYFAIRPLAY]

this is to all those young bucks out here who want a new stadium to be like every other city. i whole heartedly disagree for multiple reasons. the first, we have one of hte oldest AFC stadiums left and it be nice to maintain it and every 10 or 15 years give it a big rehab like Soldier or LAmbeau field. 2nd, it be nice once RW is passed on to rename it Rich STadium the way it was and is and should always be. Finally, the seating arrangement. no where else in the NFL (or very fewp laces) can people like everyone on here afford good seats and good tickets and be on top of the action. Have you guys been to these new stadiums? It costs an arm an a leg to get decently close (ie not below the third tier). When the bills and jets both sucked in 2008 i still had to spend 200 total for 50 yard line seats in the 2nd tier at the meadowlands. that place is a crap hole....

 

the browns stadium, eagles, ravens, bengals, etc - they are all the same. ive ben to them - they look and feel the exactly same. sure, the upper bowls are closer to the field then the ralph, but thats the ONLY place the average fan can afford to sit. luxury boxes take up all the great seats that we still have thankfully. so do club suites. and any time you build a new stadium prices go up, and our area can't continue to sell out games at an avg ticket price of 75/per.

 

WE need to be smart about this and take some pride in Rich stadium.

 

this is the article that says it best (and he hates buffalo as we all know):

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story.../partone/081121

 

I made it all the way until roughly the end of February to say this............but this is the craziest S**T I've heard in 2010. Where do I start?

 

1. $200 for 50 yardline seats..is cheap.

 

2. RWS is not a treasure, nor is the Peace Bridge, or the other piece of garbage relics that have remained to stay constructed in the city of Buffalo....and frankly its people like yourself, and your mentality that are forcing, with all your might, out of Buffalo. Young fans with their money (who are basically responsible for the viability of the team, with some other variables) want to pay to go to an awesome stadium and root for their team. Not a place that is built like a maximum security correctional facility....which is essentially what that eyesore is.

 

3. The stadium is in Orchard Park.....its almost like when they built this stadium, they said "forget downtown, which has 25 different ways in and out of the city, and with all their restaurants, bars, and ability to offer other activities...lets put this thing far enough out there that its a complete nightmare to get to"

 

The stadium is ugly, uncomfortable, plain, completely boring, but functional. Go to a game in a place like Miami, or Tennessee, when you get closer to the stadium, there are vendors with tons of games and parties and different things all set up for the fans.....get closer to RWS, and its a total crap hole, all you see is dumpsters and security. Its more of a penitentiary than a stadium.

[weehawk]

You're right, to an extent. However, more bathrooms and concessions will thin out the crowds to a more manageable level. Currently, everyone is bunched up due to the lack of properly spaced out bathrooms and stands. Increase those and you thin out the tunnel mayhem at halftime. You dont eliminate it, but you do improve upon it. As far an an evacuation goes, I wouldnt want to see that at ANY NFL stadium. 60k+ people rushing to an exit will mean death for some of them.

 

 

There's an even bigger problem with RWS that would be impossible to fix...the tunnels. What idiot thought making a concourse about 20 feet wide was enough room for 20,000 people? Try to get a beer or go to the bathroom at halftime in the 100 level. Let's hope they never have evacuate the stadium. It would be ugly.

 

PTR

[weehawk]

Are you talking about the young fans that leave WNY in droves every year so they can get a decent job and afford a house with less than $6000 a year in taxes attached to it? If you're banking the future of the area on people under 30, you're not keeping up with current events.

 

While RWS is far from the NFLs best, it is also far from the worst. Ever been to Candlestick Park for a 49ers game? Now that's a crap hole and it's in one of the so-called best cities in the world.

 

RWS is utilitarian. However, it also gets ranked as one of the best in the league for tailgating. Considering the team has been crap for a decade, tailgating is about all anyone has to look forward to at these games and it's why attendance has remained stable. A new stadium does nothing but make the game-day experience more comfortable, especially for the corporate fat cats and not so much for the "young fans." However, it does nothing to improve the team. I'd take RWS and the playoffs any day over a new stadium and more 6-10 seasons.

 

If you're looking for state-of-the-art anything in Buffalo, you need to get out of WNY. It just aint happenin now or in the future.

 

 

 

I made it all the way until roughly the end of February to say this............but this is the craziest S**T I've heard in 2010. Where do I start?

 

1. $200 for 50 yardline seats..is cheap.

 

2. RWS is not a treasure, nor is the Peace Bridge, or the other piece of garbage relics that have remained to stay constructed in the city of Buffalo....and frankly its people like yourself, and your mentality that are forcing, with all your might, out of Buffalo. Young fans with their money (who are basically responsible for the viability of the team, with some other variables) want to pay to go to an awesome stadium and root for their team. Not a place that is built like a maximum security correctional facility....which is essentially what that eyesore is.

 

3. The stadium is in Orchard Park.....its almost like when they built this stadium, they said "forget downtown, which has 25 different ways in and out of the city, and with all their restaurants, bars, and ability to offer other activities...lets put this thing far enough out there that its a complete nightmare to get to"

 

The stadium is ugly, uncomfortable, plain, completely boring, but functional. Go to a game in a place like Miami, or Tennessee, when you get closer to the stadium, there are vendors with tons of games and parties and different things all set up for the fans.....get closer to RWS, and its a total crap hole, all you see is dumpsters and security. Its more of a penitentiary than a stadium.

[jonramz]

ughhhhm the last thing I want is a new stadium. I like it being in Orchard Park, w/ plenty of room to tailgate and not deal w/ the congestion of a downtown location. I enjoy only having to pay $80 a seat/game for my season tix instead of the $100+ and probable PSL if they got a new stadium. I'm there to enjoy a sunday and watch some football. Not try out the latest manufactured culinary delight or hobnob and smooze.

 

Now if they told me they'd raise my tix by $10/game and we'd have a real QB, that's a different story

[Chalkie Gerzowski]

the browns stadium, eagles, ravens, bengals, etc - they are all the same. ive been to them - they look and feel the exactly same.

 

 

HOK went on a stadium-building orgy back in the late 90s... they built:

 

2001: Heinz Field (Pittsburgh Steelers)

1999: Cleveland Browns Stadium, LP Field (Tennessee Titans)

1998: Raymond James Stadium (Tampa Bay Bucs), M&T Bank Stadium... PSINet (Baltimore Ravens)

1997: FedEx Field (Washington Redskins)

1996: Bank of Amerika Stadium (Carolina Panthers)

1995: Edward Jones Dome (St. Louis Rams)

[May Day 10]

im fine with the current stadium and I will continue to go to games there.