The Plastic Cup Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 I don't believe in discrimination. I can be hurled at white or black players. Or even at a giant Chinaman if Houston is in town.
ExiledInIllinois Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 HTF ar you guys coming up with these handles... Don't you need multiple e-mails now to register?
Alaska Darin Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 HTF ar you guys coming up with these handles... Don't you need multiple e-mails now to register? 129367[/snapback] Aren't you from one of the "intellectual" blue states?
BuffaloBud Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 Jason Whitlock Book written by Jason Whitlock. Check the cover. My two cents. What he is saying is that because the majority of the "in-house" audience is white and corporate America paying them hugh sums for sponsorship is white, then the black player who protrays this type of sportsmanship is biting the hands that feed them.
Guest Guest Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 I watched the Sports Reporters on ESPN Sunday, he was one of the panelists, and he was saying alot what what this article says. The other guys on the panel were shocked at some of the things he was saying, I found it interesting. If I remember correctly he was a lineman for a large university in the Mid west. Anybody know? 129134[/snapback] I did not see Sports Reporters nor am I familiar with his athletic background but I can tell you this guy has a long long long long history of writing about this stuff in Dallas, and now Kansas City. It's kind of like Peter King writing about Jake Plummer - you just laugh and shake it off.
Surfmeister Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 Rap is a tool. It is a form of what is called Agitation-Propaganda. Or in short Agit-Prop. Take a lok at who owns the PARENT compenies of the rap record labels and you'll understand why it has grown so large. The lay definition is rap incites the listener to perform violent acts, have a disrespectful attitude regarding authority and never accept disrespect from anyone. This disrespect ranges from killing someone to looking at someone the wrong way. This attitude when accepted by young black males makes them sitting ducks for police. They either break the law or even better yet perform violence against eachother by splitting black males into warring factions. Then the prison population piles up and the young blacks on the street disappear.... like magic! Have a problem with a specific group of males? Just split them into groups that ARE TAUGHT to hate each other (Crips vs Bloods)and let them solve your problem by kiiling themselves and each other acting out their rap induced hate. This mode of living has found it's way into the NBA big time. Hence the problem. The sadest part for me is when young white males fall for this rap trap and act out like they are part of the target audience. Someone should have noticed something wasn't right when we saw young blacks dressed in flannel lumberjack shirts with down jackets standing on the corner in Compton, CA in the 90 degree heat. They bought a lemon somewhere along the way. If it were only fashion gone wrong it wouldn't be so sad. But it is much much bigger than boxers hanging out of the top of oversized jeans.
Guest Guest Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 Jason Whitlock Book written by Jason Whitlock. Check the cover. My two cents. What he is saying is that because the majority of the "in-house" audience is white and corporate America paying them hugh sums for sponsorship is white, then the black player who protrays this type of sportsmanship is biting the hands that feed them. 129375[/snapback] Yes - it's not about race, but the culture being put forward. It is inseperable from the product. Another example: Tennis. When Agassi and his contempories changed the presented culture of professional tennis (irreverence in dress, etc), the sport lost alot of fans like myself to whom the traditions mattered. Whether they gained more with youth than they lost is a seperate question. The bottom-line is that in the customers eyes the product is different. And the point of the article is that the hip-hop NBA is losing marketshare. So if you want a job with the NBA, get with the product the league wants to sell or be prepared to be replaced.
jad1 Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 Rap is a tool. It is a form of what is called Agitation-Propaganda. Or in short Agit-Prop. Take a lok at who owns the PARENT compenies of the rap record labels and you'll understand why it has grown so large. The lay definition is rap incites the listener to perform violent acts, have a disrespectful attitude regarding authority and never accept disrespect from anyone. This disrespect ranges from killing someone to looking at someone the wrong way. This attitude when accepted by young black males makes them sitting ducks for police. They either break the law or even better yet perform violence against eachother by splitting black males into warring factions. Then the prison population piles up and the young blacks on the street disappear.... like magic! Have a problem with a specific group of males? Just split them into groups that ARE TAUGHT to hate each other (Crips vs Bloods)and let them solve your problem by kiiling themselves and each other acting out their rap induced hate. This mode of living has found it's way into the NBA big time. Hence the problem. The sadest part for me is when young white males fall for this rap trap and act out like they are part of the target audience. Someone should have noticed something wasn't right when we saw young blacks dressed in flannel lumberjack shirts with down jackets standing on the corner in Compton, CA in the 90 degree heat. They bought a lemon somewhere along the way. If it were only fashion gone wrong it wouldn't be so sad. But it is much much bigger than boxers hanging out of the top of oversized jeans. 129475[/snapback] Yeah, and the Godfather and other mob movies did the same thing to young Italians! Wop against wop, that's how the man keeps us Italians down! Rap, like mob movies are entertainment. If someone is acting out these mediums, they have a larger problem of understanding the difference between fiction and reality. And by the way, we all know that listening to Ozzy makes kids commit suicide, right?
stevestojan Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/News/Fra...wsSF112103.html
IBTG81 Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 But it would've been sportsmanlike to throw the ball at the end of the Bills game yesterday? Sorry, OT. CW 129139[/snapback] Geez Fez, relax. You don't have to follow ICE in every thread. Take a deep breath dude.
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 Good article. Years overdue to be written, but good nonetheless.
Tux of Borg Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 The sadest part for me is when young white males fall for this rap trap and act out like they are part of the target audience. Someone should have noticed something wasn't right when we saw young blacks dressed in flannel lumberjack shirts with down jackets standing on the corner in Compton, CA in the 90 degree heat. They bought a lemon somewhere along the way. If it were only fashion gone wrong it wouldn't be so sad. But it is much much bigger than boxers hanging out of the top of oversized jeans. 129475[/snapback] When I was on active duty I had two roommates that were from south central Los Angeles. Ironically, both hated gangsta rap. One of my roommates Rob had knife scars all over his body. One day we got on the subject of gansta rap and his views on it. He said rap groups like NWA were, "studio gangstas" with no real street credibility. Rap is entertainment and should be viewed as such.
Surfmeister Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 Yeah, and the Godfather and other mob movies did the same thing to young Italians! Wop against wop, that's how the man keeps us Italians down! Rap, like mob movies are entertainment. If someone is acting out these mediums, they have a larger problem of understanding the difference between fiction and reality. And by the way, we all know that listening to Ozzy makes kids commit suicide, right? 129490[/snapback] The mob has two very strong parts. One part is Italian. They take the heat. I'm talking about role models here. Young blacks take their role models from entertainment. However the role models are not The Temptations, the Ohio Players or Earth, Wind and Fire any longer. The role models are hard core thugs. As far as Ozzy goes, I do not agree his music makes kids commit suicide. But being married to his wife would make me want to. Thank you for the bait, but I just had lunch ~
jad1 Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 The mob has two very strong parts. One part is Italian. They take the heat. I'm talking about role models here. Young blacks take their role models from entertainment. However the role models are not The Temptations, the Ohio Players or Earth, Wind and Fire any longer. The role models are hard core thugs. As far as Ozzy goes, I do not agree his music makes kids commit suicide. But being married to his wife would make me want to. Thank you for the bait, but I just had lunch ~ 129574[/snapback] Young blacks take their role models from entertainment? Where do young whites take their role models from, the Bible?
Surfmeister Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 Young blacks take their role models from entertainment? Where do young whites take their role models from, the Bible? 129583[/snapback] If you are trying to make a point I'd like to know what it is.
jad1 Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 If you are trying to make a point I'd like to know what it is. 129608[/snapback] White kids and black kids have the same role models, and the majority of them come from entertainment and sports. Do you really believe white kids don't listen to rap? Black kids and white kids are swimming in the same entertainment pool. So black kids aren't the only ones who have hard core thugs as role models. So what was your point?
PromoTheRobot Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 He makes it sound like all black people condone thug behavior, as if it's their "culture." For a black writer, he does not seem to know "his own people." PTR
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted November 22, 2004 Posted November 22, 2004 . I think it's more a problem of promoting the self rather than the team. 129078[/snapback] The aspect of promoting the self rather than the team is certainly one of the problems in my mind that underlies what Whitlock points to in his column as the basis for his call to black athletes to give the customer what they want which is more sportmanship (or given the stories I have read about what Babe Ruth was really like the illusion of sportsmanship). I would hoever say that so-called blacj behavior is actually a symptom rather than the cause of this problem. The promotion of the self over the team is unfortunately a big part of the success that America has been the beneficiary of. It is through our commitment to competition that we have prospered from individuals looking to better themselves. I think it is central to why we have done better economically than the European style welfare states which have heavily taxed those who have done well economically to support universal health care, unemployment benefits, jobs for life despite inefficiencies and other parts of the social democracies of these states. However, there is a threshold question which now seems to be coming to the fore as we have become the sole superpower on this planet and we have raised consumption to a level unseen in human existence, Has our success in valuting the self resulted in such a demise of the team (or the tribe, or the country, or whatever grouping you want to label) that we have actually undercut things like sportmanship, caring for your neighbor (regardless of whether he is a red state type or a blue state type) or other stuff we view as central to our being is good. It's ironic that many of the consevatives types which pooh-pooh a phrase like it takes a village actually support development of the power of the churches and other pillars of society which are based on the village concept. There is true irony in that one of the great opponents of the religious rants of Osana Bin Laden actually has as one of the key drivers in his life his own religion views and apparently is dependent upon how their churches have come together effectively to influence the state for his victory in the Presidential race. The whole red state/blue state division reminds me actually of the color division sported by the Crips and the Bloods mentioned elsewhere in this thread. Self vs. Team? This is as old as America and America comes down firmly on the side of valuing the self for the most part. This gets reflected in our sports.
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