Our own Tim Graham's take on Bills' search

[BillsfaninSixburgh]

The other thing to remember (compared to last year's hiring dates) is the Bills don't have a lot of competition with other teams seeking head coaches. If the Raider's end up firing Tom Cable, they would be the only other team looking right now. (So you'd have Ralph Wilson and Al Davis as the only two owners looking for coaches....talk about the inmates running the asylum!!)). Sure it's frustrating not knowing who the coach is going to be, but since we don't have much choice, let's hope that Buddy Nix is using time to his advantage and ends up landing the best available coach who actually would like the opportunity to coach the Bills.

[DE Bills Fan]

 

Dude, stop.

 

I never want Marv to have his hands on this franchise again, kind of like my feelings about Trent Edwards playing QB for us.

Totally agree with you. Marv set the franchise back several years with his poor moves as GM, and sorry to say, as coach, never won one Super Bowl and was badly outcoached in all of them. He was more a beneficiary of having great Hall of Fame players like Kelly, Thurman, Bruce, (hopefully Andre) playing for him. I actually don't think he was that great a coach, given the talent level that he had to work with.

[yungmack]

My guess, at this point, the Bills are either ready to hire Frazier as soon he's done in the playoffs. He was talked about being the top candidate for a while.

 

Maybe there's another playoff team's assistant, but other than Grimm, there have been no rumors.

 

What happened to Ron Rivera? My understanding was that he was the top guy on Nix's list.

[Dan]

What happened to Ron Rivera? My understanding was that he was the top guy on Nix's list.

I believe he turned down the request to interview. But there's uncertainty as to exactly what he meant - i.e. not till the playoffs are over or not ever. The pessimists say he hates Buffalo because we suck, so he'll never interveiw. The optimists say he's just waiting until the Chargers' season is officially over.

 

Pretty much the same story with Russ Grimm in Arizona.

[Simon]

It seems pretty obvious the guy they want is still in the playoffs.

Not sure what's with all the sky is falling stuff.

I'm guessing that as soon as Minn, AZ and/or SD get bounced we'll see the ball start rolling pretty quick.

[Malazan]

I'm not sure why Bills fans are in such denial over the state of their team. Literally, all news reports have indicated that this search is fairly dysfunctional. It might not be the Bills fault, but they have been turned down by numerous candidates and even candidates that have interviewed have claimed not to be interested.

 

Only in your mind, my very young apprentice.

[MRW]

It seems pretty obvious the guy they want is still in the playoffs.

Not sure what's with all the sky is falling stuff.

I'm guessing that as soon as Minn, AZ and/or SD get bounced we'll see the ball start rolling pretty quick.

I have to agree, with the marquee names going elsewhere or choosing to stay out of the game, top assistants are next on the wish list, and guess what, if you're a top assistant chances are your team is still playing. If you don't want the Bills to make a hire without doing due diligence, you should be applauding the wait.

[GR8PRKN]

So, last year there was an army of guys on the pier casting their lines and trying to reel in the big one. It was a freaking tournament, a competition between some of the best anglers around, all trying to outdo each other. Plenty of fish and plenty of fisherman.

 

Change the scene. Now we have one guy sitting on an old cardboard box with his rusted worm can. He's been there since yesterday at the end of the pier casting his line; he got a "jump" on everybody. He hasn't caught anything and he hasn't gotten more than a nibble. A couple of young teenagers rode their bikes up, cast a line, immediately hooked a big fish for dinner, and took off hours ago. The seagulls are circling the old fisherman and using his head as a poo target.

 

No cause for alarm. The fishing scenes are identical.

 

 

[Kingfish]

The Steelers LB coach just turned down an opportunity to be the Dolphins DC-I guess everyone in the NFL hates the Dolphins and the city of Miami as well.

[Malazan]

The Steelers LB coach just turned down an opportunity to be the Dolphins DC-I guess everyone in the NFL hates the Dolphins and the city of Miami as well.

 

There's no chance of Cowher becoming the DC in Miami. I've heard from my sources that he's turned down an interview before it was even offered or anyone even considered it.

[spartacus]

Marv Levy may have screwed up by thinking Russ Brandon could handle anything even remotely football related , but Levy had the team going in the right direction before Brandon and company took over and drove it into the ground.

 

yeah- the Whitner and McCargo picks were awesome

 

as well as those huge free agent contracts he gave out to players who were cut 2 years later

 

if down the toilet is the direction you are looking for, then Marv is the "man":

[folz]

OMG please no!!!!!

 

A sub par coach with a ton of talent on his team, and the best GM in football for the last 20+ years and he couldnt win one damn Super Bowl.

 

Levy was a babysitter for millionaire kids and did a bad job at that

 

No Thank you

 

 

Totally agree with you. Marv set the franchise back several years with his poor moves as GM, and sorry to say, as coach, never won one Super Bowl and was badly outcoached in all of them. He was more a beneficiary of having great Hall of Fame players like Kelly, Thurman, Bruce, (hopefully Andre) playing for him. I actually don't think he was that great a coach, given the talent level that he had to work with.

 

 

I really don't mean to sound condescending but I assume you guys are young and weren't around or old enough

to watch the Marv teams of the 80s and 90s...

 

I'm with you as far as saying Marv wasn't a good GM...it wasn't the job he wanted or was best/experienced at and basically was just brought in to make the fans comfortable with the team again after Donahoe's bunker mentality, but to claim he was a sub par coach is just crazy.

 

A subpar coach doesn't have the following stat line even with great players:

11 seasons

110-65 (won 63% of his games)

7 division crowns

8 playoff appearences

5 AFC Championship games (one Ronnie Harmon drop from going to 6 AFC Championships)

4 Superbowls

 

And don't bring up the AFC was weak thing...Marv's Bills went 14-2 against the NFC during the 4

Superbowl runs and the two loses were to WAS the last game of 1990 and DET last game of 1991

when the Bills had locked up home-field advantage and were resting players.

 

In 1990 the Bills lost the SB on a kick that could have easily gone through and they win it, it was a

great game and no one got outcoached...just 3 weeks earlier in the regular season the Bills had

beat the Giants in another hard fought, nail-biter...two evenly matched teams and coaches.

 

Ok, we got pounded in the next 3 Superbowls...WAS had a miracle year in 1991 and the Dallas lines

were too big and good against us in 1992 and 1993...although we did beat them in the regular seson

in 1993 between them beating us in two superbowls...but outside of those 3 games rarely if ever did

I see a Marv team get outcoached in the 201 games that he coached for us.

 

And if Marv is only considered great because he had great talent, then what do you say about Jimmy Johnson,

are you telling me those Dallas teams weren't loaded (even more so than the Bills in 1992 and 1993)? What

about every other coach that went to and won or lost a Superbowl?

 

Plus, let's not forget what goes into a good head coach. I'm sure there are a million things, but what jumps

out to me are Xs and Os, Game management, team/personnel management, and Leadership. I can't speak

with enough authority on Marv's Xs and Os other than to say they won a hell of a lot of games, but I don't

remember any big-time game management gaffs, Marv always had the players and coaches managed well and

pulling in the same direction, and he was second to none as far as leadership and motivation.

 

Marv was a great coach and deserves to be in the Hall of Fame...don't let his two years as a pseudo GM

tarnish what he was, is, and always will be to Buffalo Bills fans.

[BillsWatch]

I just asked Darryl Tally on twitter if Levy could handle another run and he said "Marv is content being retired. We drained him."

 

dogonit, I say bring the old goat out of retirement to fix this mess he made, Levy could get a nice piece of the pie and go out with a big smile on his face.( saying to himself where would you rather be then right here, right now )

 

The only way Marv would come out of retirement is if he had a brilliant find in another league (CFL, college, etc) and the only way to bring this pupil in would be taking head coach job and giving this assistant head coach job most of the duties so Marv would not get burned out in the massive number of hours coaching staff put in. He would not want to kill himself as full time head coach.

[Guest dog14787]

The only way Marv would come out of retirement is if he had a brilliant find in another league (CFL, college, etc) and the only way to bring this pupil in would be taking head coach job and giving this assistant head coach job most of the duties so Marv would not get burned out in the massive number of hours coaching staff put in. He would not want to kill himself as full time head coach.

 

 

Marv Levy could bring Mike Leach on with him and allow Leach to take over after the team gets turned around , that's an awesome plan.

[Slack_in_MA]

The seagulls are circling the old fisherman and using his head as a poo target.

 

Beer almost came out my nose!

[Boom Jam]

Super Bowl coaches:

 

• Mike Tomlin: hired from Vikings. Vikings were 6-10 and not in the playoffs.
  
• Tom Coughlin: hired off the street. Had been HC of Jax. Jax has never appeared in a Super Bowl.
  
• Tony Dungy: hired off the street. Fired from Tampa. Tampa had never been to a Super Bowl.
  
• Bill Cowher: hired from Kansas City. Kansas City made playoffs and was eliminated by the Bills.
  
• Bill Belichick: hired from Jets. Jets were 8-8 and not in the playoffs.
  
• John Gruden: traded by the Raiders and was their head coach. Raiders were in the playoffs, but this is obviously a highly unusual case.
  
• Brian Billick: hired from Vikings. Vikings made it to the championship game.
  
• Dick Vermeil: hired out of broadcasting.
  
• Mike Shanahan: hired off the street. Fired by Oakland.
  
• Barry Switzer: hired from Wal-Mart.
  
• Jimmy Johnson: hired out of college ranks.
  

 

So, none of these guys came directly from a team in a Super Bowl and only one from a team in a championship game.

 

Really? Why did you leave out Holmgren and Seifert?

 

EDIT: Shanahan was hired away from the 49ers, not a street hire like you say.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Really? Why did you leave out Holmgren and Seifert?

 

EDIT: Shanahan was hired away from the 49ers, not a street hire like you say.

You're right, I blew it with where Mike Shanahan came from before Denver. He did come from the 49ers and they had won the Super Bowl in 94.

• Seifert: He was with the 49ers, so he wasn't hired away by anyone.
  
• Holmgren: Was hired after the 91 season by Green Bay. The 49ers did not make the playoffs in 91.
  

Thanks for pointing out 2 more Super Bowl winning coaches that did not come from a different Super Bowl winning team to the team they won the Super Bowl with.

 

Want to keep playing?

• Joe Gibbs: Hired in 1980 from San Diego. San Diego has never won a Super Bowl.
  
• Bill Parcells: Promoted from within by the Giants. Was an assistant to Perkins, Giants were not a playoff team.
  
• Bill Walsh: Hired out of college ranks.
  
• Mike Ditka: Hired from Cowboys. Cowboys did not win the Super Bowl that year.
  
• Tom Flores: Internally promoted.
  
• John Madden: Internally promoted.
  
• Don Shula: Hired from the Colts. He went 8-5-1 in his final year in Baltimore and they didn't make the playoffs.
  
• Going back further is getting rather pointless at this point.
  

So, you have 1 Super Bowl winning coach hired from a Super Bowl winning team in 43 years.

 

Obviously, that is the only way to hire your next coach.

[Boom Jam]

All good - I was just trying to fill in a couple of gaps.

 

When Gregg Williams was hired - I wanted Marvin Lewis.

 

Mularkey - I wanted Lovie Smith.

 

DJ - I can't recall... But definitely not him. What a disaster.

 

This time around - Dom Capers.

 

Just saying...

 

 

 

You're right, I blew it with where Mike Shanahan came from before Denver. He did come from the 49ers and they had won the Super Bowl in 94.

• Seifert: He was with the 49ers, so he wasn't hired away by anyone.
  
• Holmgren: Was hired after the 91 season by Green Bay. The 49ers did not make the playoffs in 91.
  

Thanks for pointing out 2 more Super Bowl winning coaches that did not come from a different Super Bowl winning team to the team they won the Super Bowl with.

 

Want to keep playing?

• Joe Gibbs: Hired in 1980 from San Diego. San Diego has never won a Super Bowl.
  
• Bill Parcells: Promoted from within by the Giants. Was an assistant to Perkins, Giants were not a playoff team.
  
• Bill Walsh: Hired out of college ranks.
  
• Mike Ditka: Hired from Cowboys. Cowboys did not win the Super Bowl that year.
  
• Tom Flores: Internally promoted.
  
• John Madden: Internally promoted.
  
• Don Shula: Hired from the Colts. He went 8-5-1 in his final year in Baltimore and they didn't make the playoffs.
  
• Going back further is getting rather pointless at this point.
  

So, you have 1 Super Bowl winning coach hired from a Super Bowl winning team in 43 years.

 

Obviously, that is the only way to hire your next coach.

[reddogblitz]

DJ - I can't recall... But definitely not him. What a disaster.

 

This time around - Dom Capers.

When DJ was hired I wanted Mike Sherman. Dom Capers? You know I thought about that too. His record is not that good, but he did coach 2 expansion teams. I'd probably hire him over Frazier and Rivera and Grimm and the rest of their ilk.

[Sisyphean Bills]

All good - I was just trying to fill in a couple of gaps.

 

When Gregg Williams was hired - I wanted Marvin Lewis.

 

Mularkey - I wanted Lovie Smith.

 

DJ - I can't recall... But definitely not him. What a disaster.

 

This time around - Dom Capers.

 

Just saying...

No problem.

 

Really, my research post was to simply present some data on where "great coaches" come from. The data does not support that you look to the team that just won the Super Bowl or went really deep in the playoffs that year. Good coaches can be found in a wide variety of ways. The pattern is that there is no pattern and no singular mode to success.

 

As far as Capers, he might be desperate enough to come here. Gotta love him nodding off in the box too.