Estro Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 I know it's been mentioned before, but it's starting to become an apparent problem, IMO. Whether it's because he just isn't that good, or doesn't feel like bustin' his butt for a bad team the guy has been a huge disappointment. I remember Stroud's first game with the Bills vs. the Seahawks last year, stuffing the run, slashing in and pressuring the QB. He looked like an all pro, but as time has rolled on I'm starting to think Jax got the better of us in this trade. Can anyone remember a big play that Stroud has made for us this season? He generates no pass rush, many times he is getting blown off the ball and pushed 2-3-4 yards back off the line of scrimmage. To make matters worse he's not stuffing the run, and he's not getting double teamed. When I key in on him teams rarely (almost never) double Stroud and yet he's still rendered ineffective. This offseason he needs to look at himself in the mirror and put in some more effort. It almost looks like he doesn't really care out there and is trying to simply stay healthy. When you're being paid millions and millions you have to bring it every week regardless of how bad your team is. I'm hoping its his non chalant, I don't want to get hurt attitude because if he's actually giving it 110% out there he's pretty bad. Does anyone see this any differently?
Beebe's Kid Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 I know it's been mentioned before, but it's starting to become an apparent problem, IMO. Whether it's because he just isn't that good, or doesn't feel like bustin' his butt for a bad team the guy has been a huge disappointment. I remember Stroud's first game with the Bills vs. the Seahawks last year, stuffing the run, slashing in and pressuring the QB. He looked like an all pro, but as time has rolled on I'm starting to think Jax got the better of us in this trade. Can anyone remember a big play that Stroud has made for us this season. He generates 0 pass rush, many times he is getting blown off the ball and pushed 2-3-4 yards back off the line of scrimmage. To make matters worse he's not stuffing the run, and he's not getting double teamed. When I key in on him teams rarely (almost never) double Stroud and yet he's still rendered ineffective. This offseason he needs to look at himself in the mirror and put in some more effort. It almost looks like he doesn't really care out there and is trying to simply stay healthy. When you're being paid millions and millions you have to bring it every week regardless of how bad your team is. I'm hoping its his non chalant, I don't want to get hurt attitude because if he's actually giving it 110% out there he's pretty bad. Does anyone see this any differently? No, no, no!! You can't blame Stroud. He wasn't a draft pick. You can only blame everything on draft picks! You have to look up the draft, find somebody at another position that was taken later, and blame that! I have been asking about Stroud all year. He had a sack in the Tampa game, and has been invisible since. For all the talk about shipping out every player that does have an ounce of talent on this team, the front 4 never get name called... Williams is being praised because he is, at least, effective once or twice a game. Kelsay, Schobel, and Stroud need to be history...oh, and if there's any room in the car, they can take Denney with them too. I think that if our injured players come back next year, and we land an NFL Tackle, and replace the front 4 we could make a serious run at the East. Of course we would need a QB, as well, but I think that a front four that could provide some effing pressure would help out the LBs and secondary immensely.
Estro Posted December 21, 2009 Author Posted December 21, 2009 No, no, no!! You can't blame Stroud. He wasn't a draft pick. You can only blame everything on draft picks! You have to look up the draft, find somebody at another position that was taken later, and blame that! I have been asking about Stroud all year. He had a sack in the Tampa game, and has been invisible since. For all the talk about shipping out every player that does have an ounce of talent on this team, the front 4 never get name called... Williams is being praised because he is, at least, effective once or twice a game. Kelsay, Schobel, and Stroud need to be history...oh, and if there's any room in the car, they can take Denney with them too. I think that if our injured players come back next year, and we land an NFL Tackle, and replace the front 4 we could make a serious run at the East. Of course we would need a QB, as well, but I think that a front four that could provide some effing pressure would help out the LBs and secondary immensely. Can't say I disagree. Schobel's another guy who's production level is no where near what he's being paid likewise with Kelsay. I wasn't even going to bring them up because I was focusing on Stroud only, but I agree, outside of Kyle Williams the defensive line is truly abysmal. Our LB's aren't very good either, but I think they look even worse playing behind one of the worst D-lines in the league. The 2002-2007 Schobel is long gone and I would have no problem parting ways with the guy this offseason. If this team is serious about a rebuild they should leave no stone unturned, and the defensive line would be a great place to start. As a fan I can accept going 4-12 or 5-11 if you're truly going in another direction and starting with a clean state to rebuild a respectable team. But to watch a team like the Bills who simply scratch and claw toward mediocrity ever year has become extremely frustrating. Enough to turn a die hard fan who would never dream of missing a Bills game into one who just doesn't seem to give a shi*t.
Estro Posted December 21, 2009 Author Posted December 21, 2009 Dude's getting old. So is Pat Williams! A solid DT can last many many years. Unfortunately, Marcus Stroud is not Pat Williams, which could lead us into another conversation of the Bills total ineptitide, but I don't feel like going there. Can anyone think of one reason why John Guy deserves to keep his job. I'll give him Bryan Scott, and maybe Florence too, but the guy has swung and missed on wayyyyyy too many players: Derrick Dockery, Tutan Reyes, Langston Walker, Kawika Mitchell, Larry Triplett, Robert Royal. Yikes. We need someone who can not only evaluate college talent. but also professional talent.
billsfan89 Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 Stroud has had a few good games some OK games and a lot of abysmal games. Early on he was playing well at times and OK at times. Then right around the first Miami game he really started to go down hill. Then when DJ got fired he played better when Fewel took over but since that initial surge when Fewel took over we haven't seen much from Stroud. Now do I think Stroud has a year or two left in the tank as far as being a productive NFL player yes BUT I doubt if he can ever be a near Pro-Bowl player ever again. Should we keep Stroud around for next season? I think we should, in all honesty keep Stroud another season just because I think a change of scenery with a new head coach could possibly return Stroud to form or at least to being a productive player on a consistent level. But point is very well made that Stroud is far from that elite run stuffer and being 32nd against the run is in part due to his poor and mediocre play this season.
billsfan89 Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 Can't say I disagree. Schobel's another guy who's production level is no where near what he's being paid likewise with Kelsay. I wasn't even going to bring them up because I was focusing on Stroud only, but I agree, outside of Kyle Williams the defensive line is truly abysmal. Our LB's aren't very good either, but I think they look even worse playing behind one of the worst D-lines in the league. The 2002-2007 Schobel is long gone and I would have no problem parting ways with the guy this offseason. If this team is serious about a rebuild they should leave no stone unturned, and the defensive line would be a great place to start. As a fan I can accept going 4-12 or 5-11 if you're truly going in another direction and starting with a clean state to rebuild a respectable team. But to watch a team like the Bills who simply scratch and claw toward mediocrity ever year has become extremely frustrating. Enough to turn a die hard fan who would never dream of missing a Bills game into one who just doesn't seem to give a shi*t. Schobel is by far our best pass rusher AND when he is off the field we see that we have no other legit pass rusher. Schobel after a 2 year lull in his career has had a big time bounce back season. He has 7 sacks this season on a defense that gets run on most of the time and on a defense that has him facing tons of double teams. Schobel has a place on this team next season.
Bflojohn Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 The players (not only Marcus Stroud) will have to "buy in" when the new sheriff comes to town! Give Stroud someone to mentor along side him at DT like Suh or McCoy, and I'm thinking that you could have a bounce back year in the making. I am also weighing in with the clean house theory, because losing is ingrained in this organization, top to bottom, and the only way to remove the stench of losing is a really great spring cleaning! There are plenty of candidates available in regard to the ax, but I tend to agree that Aaron Schobel isn't one of them!!
Geno Smith's Arm Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 No matter how much money you pay someone, it's really hard to put your body on the line in a pointless endeavor. UNless you're some guy just trying to stay in the league, there really isn't much to play for. If anything , you are really just hoping you don't get seriously injured. This Bills season was over before it began.
zazie Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 No matter how much money you pay someone, it's really hard to put your body on the line in a pointless endeavor. UNless you're some guy just trying to stay in the league, there really isn't much to play for. If anything , you are really just hoping you don't get seriously injured. This Bills season was over before it began. exactly right Stroud playing out the string, saving his body for next season. who can blame him.
Buftex Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 I guess I watch the games every Sunday, and see something different than the rest of you. I think Stroud has played well this year, particularly in the last month or so. He had, what could have been, a big pass deflection in todays' game, and has been instrumental, IMO, at creating a bit of havoc in opposing backfields, particularly since DJ has been gone. The trutn is, our linebackers are sub-par, at best, and can't take advantage of the work of the D-line. I think the D-line has been decent this season, just not any support from the guys behind them. I know there are lots of problems with this team, but I hardly think Strouds' play has been that bad. There were at least two or three short yardage plays in todays game, including the td run, where the D-line got a nice push, but the linebackers (Poz in particular) was playing so far off the line, there was no way they were going to make a stop.
8-8 Forever? Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 I said this at the end of last year. Most of the veterans are mailing it in from this point out. Don't get hurt. Play out the season well, but win/lose doesnt matter too much. Time to move on to the new GM and coach search. this season was over when all the injuries hit. I'm just hoping its not a ground start rebuild . that would be hard to stomach. but it probably is.
Mr. WEO Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 So is Pat Williams!A solid DT can last many many years. Unfortunately, Marcus Stroud is not Pat Williams, which could lead us into another conversation of the Bills total ineptitide, but I don't feel like going there. Can anyone think of one reason why John Guy deserves to keep his job. I'll give him Bryan Scott, and maybe Florence too, but the guy has swung and missed on wayyyyyy too many players: Derrick Dockery, Tutan Reyes, Langston Walker, Kawika Mitchell, Larry Triplett, Robert Royal. Yikes. We need someone who can not only evaluate college talent. but also professional talent. Pat Williams is a steroid abuser---it's got to help somewhat.
Mike in Syracuse Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 Schobel is by far our best pass rusher AND when he is off the field we see that we have no other legit pass rusher. Schobel after a 2 year lull in his career has had a big time bounce back season. He has 7 sacks this season on a defense that gets run on most of the time and on a defense that has him facing tons of double teams. Schobel has a place on this team next season. Schobel is a one trick pony. He takes a massive upfield loop on virtually every every play and he only cares about the sack. His run defense is atrocious an he's admitted that he doesn't care. I believe his exact words were "Let someone else worry about contain". Someone needs to show this fool a DE job description. When was the last time you saw Schonothing get a sack at a crucial time or make a game changing play? The sooner he and Kelsay are cut the better we'll be as a team.
VADC Bills Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 I'm in full agreement to blow the whole thing up but you have to keep some veterans for leadership and knowledge. I think you keep Stroud with replacing in mind. Kyle Williams is like the little engine that could. We have to get better there as well. Outside of our secondary I fell everyone is expendable...on defense. Denny, Kelsey, Williams, Stroud, Schobel, Mitchell, Ellison, Poz, Whitner. They all can be upgraded. Now coaching has a little something to do with it I'm sure. I like the way Parcells blew up the Dolphins defense he removed fan favorites and built a much better defense. Thats where we are now. FA should give us a tackle, guard, and qb on offense and provide a dt or de and lb on defense. The rest can be attained in the draft. The question is who can be off loaded for draft picks we will need to get 2 - 3 additional mid round picks.
Coach Tuesday Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 It amazes me that no one discusses the fact that the Bills' defensive line is COMPLETELY HEALTHY. All four starters are intact. Yet they still can't stop the run. Injuries are not an excuse for this. Mentality and scheme are the causes.
Dr. Trooth Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 I think that if our injured players come back next year, and we land an NFL Tackle, and replace the front 4 we could make a serious run at the East. Of course we would need a QB, as well, but I think that a front four that could provide some effing pressure would help out the LBs and secondary immensely. Simply brilliant. OT, front 4? I hadn't heard that before. You must be the life of the party. BTW...LB pressure? What LBs?
Buffalo_Stampede Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 I worry about a player when they get paid and then their play drops off.
KD in CA Posted December 21, 2009 Posted December 21, 2009 Dude's getting old. Yup. Hardly a mystery. Playing 9 years of DT in the NFL is going to wear down anybody.
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