Todd McShay

[zonabb]

Says who?

 

Did he say that Maybin would be the best prospect in his first year? LINK?

 

We don't know what Maybin will be. He's still extremely young.

 

So your no. 11 pick picks gets a monster contract, millions in salary and signing bonus for his first year and gets a free pass? Do realize how illogical that is when a DE as a rookie can have substantial impact immediately, unlike a a QB? He's Erik Flowers, that's who he is. Too small to play DE and gets absolutely manhandled at the pont of attack. He tries to avoid engaging, hoping his speed can allow him to make plays, only to get further out of position.

 

10 games in college. Undersized. OWNED.

[Fingon]

So your no. 11 pick picks gets a monster contract, millions in salary and signing bonus for his first year and gets a free pass? Do realize how illogical that is when a DE as a rookie can have substantial impact immediately, unlike a a QB? He's Erik Flowers, that's who he is. Too small to play DE and gets absolutely manhandled at the pont of attack. He tries to avoid engaging, hoping his speed can allow him to make plays, only to get further out of position.

 

10 games in college. Undersized. OWNED.

There are many very good DE's that are Aaron Maybin's size, or smaller.

[Thoner7]

There are many very good DE's that are Aaron Maybin's size, or smaller.

 

Dude stop believing that Maybin is 250. He simply is not. Anyone who sits in the stands close enough to the field can see he is like 230 MAX. Watch them warm up, or stand on the side line - he is the same thickness and build as TO with a skinnier waste and scrawnier arms. So does that one extra inch add 25 pounds or is TO really 265? When he is next to Nic Harris - who is listed at 230 - he is clearly smaller. Hes still too small to play LB in the NFL.

 

Now I cant weigh people with my eyes, but I can look at two people from ten yards away and tell you which one is smaller - and its Maybin.

[Fingon]

Dude stop believing that Maybin is 250. He simply is not. Anyone who sits in the stands close enough to the field can see he is like 230 MAX. Watch them warm up, or stand on the side line - he is the same thickness and build as TO with a skinnier waste and scrawnier arms. So does that one extra inch add 25 pounds or is TO really 265? When he is next to Nic Harris - who is listed at 230 - he is clearly smaller. Hes still too small to play LB in the NFL.

 

Now I cant weigh people with my eyes, but I can look at two people from ten yards away and tell you which one is smaller - and its Maybin.

So, you want us to believe that he just let all the muscle that he gained during the off season simply disappear? The guy was 250 at the combine. I find it very hard to believe that a pro-athlete would just sit on his ass and not train at all. If you look at his 230 pictures and his 250 pictures, he doesn't look bigger... his muscles are just far more pronounced.

[apuszczalowski]

So your no. 11 pick picks gets a monster contract, millions in salary and signing bonus for his first year and gets a free pass? Do realize how illogical that is when a DE as a rookie can have substantial impact immediately, unlike a a QB? He's Erik Flowers, that's who he is. Too small to play DE and gets absolutely manhandled at the pont of attack. He tries to avoid engaging, hoping his speed can allow him to make plays, only to get further out of position.

 

10 games in college. Undersized. OWNED.

So I guess it was a good thing that the Texans passed on that DE 1st overall a couple years ago and took Reggie Bush?

 

Mario Williams was no where near an impact player in his first year and he was taken #1 overall, by your moronic logic, he should have been a Pro Bowler just cause he was taken #1 overall and paid a huge salary.

 

I'm really surprised most of the lots at RWS aren't packed with more Short Buses on game day.....

[Nanker]

So I guess it was a good thing that the Texans passed on that DE 1st overall a couple years ago and took Reggie Bush?

 

Mario Williams was no where near an impact player in his first year and he was taken #1 overall, by your moronic logic, he should have been a Pro Bowler just cause he was taken #1 overall and paid a huge salary.

 

I'm really surprised most of the lots at RWS aren't packed with more Short Buses on game day.....

You mean This Mario Williams, he of 16 rookie game starts, 47 total tackles and 4.5 sacks? I'll agree that our guy with ZERO games started in his rookie year, 14 total tackles and ZERO sacks is, well, he's got his work cut out for him to get to the next level - that of an average DE in the NFL. Because right now he's a third string hanger-on.

[PushthePile]

So I guess it was a good thing that the Texans passed on that DE 1st overall a couple years ago and took Reggie Bush?

 

Mario Williams was no where near an impact player in his first year and he was taken #1 overall, by your moronic logic, he should have been a Pro Bowler just cause he was taken #1 overall and paid a huge salary.

 

I'm really surprised most of the lots at RWS aren't packed with more Short Buses on game day.....

Mario Williams is 6-6 300 pounds. He had 4.5 sacks, 47 tackles, 3 pass deflections, and a forced fumble his rookie year.

 

Aaron Maybin is 6-4 230-250 pounds. He has 14 tackles this season.

 

Granted Maybin hasn't played much this season but it's not like the team is loaded at OLB or DE this year. The amount of reps he sees is as telling as the way he looks on the field. Ryan Denney has a couple of sacks and 22 tackles at least.

 

http://www.aaronmaybin.com/ Is this a DE you have to gameplan around?

[mob16151]

So your no. 11 pick picks gets a monster contract, millions in salary and signing bonus for his first year and gets a free pass? Do realize how illogical that is when a DE as a rookie can have substantial impact immediately, unlike a a QB? He's Erik Flowers, that's who he is. Too small to play DE and gets absolutely manhandled at the pont of attack. He tries to avoid engaging, hoping his speed can allow him to make plays, only to get further out of position.

 

10 games in college. Undersized. OWNED.

 

 

You sir are a moron. Erik Flowers was 6 foot 4 inches, 273 pounds. How precisely is he just like Maybin? Unless of course you mean there both first rounders?

[apuszczalowski]

You mean This Mario Williams, he of 16 rookie game starts, 47 total tackles and 4.5 sacks? I'll agree that our guy with ZERO games started in his rookie year, 14 total tackles and ZERO sacks is, well, he's got his work cut out for him to get to the next level - that of an average DE in the NFL. Because right now he's a third string hanger-on.

But he was a #1 overall pick and paid a huge salary in his first year, would you pay top dollar for a guy who had those stats? The post I was replying too said that it doesn't matter if he is a rookie because he was given a monster contract he doesn't get a pass and should be playing up to that contract. I don't recall fans in Houston thrilled with Williams as a rookie

 

I'm not saying that Maybin is great right now, but he missed all of training camp (yes it was his fault for holding out) and hasn't even played a full season. Plus, he has had some guys ahead of him playing better at this point, so the Bills aren't forced to throw him in and force him to learn on the field during the season. His development doesn't have to be rushed.

 

Although it doesn't matter because there are so many expert player evaluators on this team, and since their guy wasn't chosen by Buffalo, they will never like the pick

[apuszczalowski]

Mario Williams is 6-6 300 pounds. He had 4.5 sacks, 47 tackles, 3 pass deflections, and a forced fumble his rookie year.

 

Aaron Maybin is 6-4 230-250 pounds. He has 14 tackles this season.

 

Granted Maybin hasn't played much this season but it's not like the team is loaded at OLB or DE this year. The amount of reps he sees is as telling as the way he looks on the field. Ryan Denney has a couple of sacks and 22 tackles at least.

 

http://www.aaronmaybin.com/ Is this a DE you have to gameplan around?

Were teams gameplanning around Mario Williams in his rookie year? As I said before, Texans fans weren't praising Williams in his rookie year

[Sisyphean Bills]

Plus, he has had some guys ahead of him playing better at this point

Which is a rather pathetic point when that line is 32nd best in the NFL against the run.

[PushthePile]

But he was a #1 overall pick and paid a huge salary in his first year, would you pay top dollar for a guy who had those stats? The post I was replying too said that it doesn't matter if he is a rookie because he was given a monster contract he doesn't get a pass and should be playing up to that contract. I don't recall fans in Houston thrilled with Williams as a rookie

 

I'm not saying that Maybin is great right now, but he missed all of training camp (yes it was his fault for holding out) and hasn't even played a full season. Plus, he has had some guys ahead of him playing better at this point, so the Bills aren't forced to throw him in and force him to learn on the field during the season. His development doesn't have to be rushed.

 

Although it doesn't matter because there are so many expert player evaluators on this team, and since their guy wasn't chosen by Buffalo, they will never like the pick

I understand that Maybin shouldn't be written off yet. The concern doesn't stem from stats only though. Watching him get physically dominated is more troubling than no sacks IMO. I see flashes of the speed at times but it doesn't overcome the lack of strength and technique.

 

I look at Maybin like I look at Hardy. They both have an attribute that this FO fell in love with. The problem is that the rest of the package is a complete project. I'm down on both of these guys and would love to be proven wrong but I fear they are going to end up in the bust category.

[aristocrat]

wow, todd mcshay got freakin owned in that piece

[In space no one can hear]

I have been buying the Pro Football Weekly Draft Guide for over 20 years. I have found them to be among the best sources for draft information.

 

 

Pro Football Weekly's current evaluation of Locker:

 

 

1. Jake Locker, Washington (Jr.)

6-3e, 220e, 4.45e

 

Not all evaluators like Locker's lofty stature, considering he has battled injuries throughout his career. And not all are sure he has broken his habit of running at the first flash of coverage. However, since head coach Steve Sarkisian arrived on campus, Locker has settled down, begun to trust his instincts more in the pocket and honed his accuracy. He is so gifted athletically that he could play four positions, including free safety, receiver or running back. His competitiveness, toughness, leadership, arm strength and athletic ability all suggest he could be the draft's most coveted talent.

 

 

Thus, they support McShay's evaluation of Locker.

[Nanker]

But he was a #1 overall pick and paid a huge salary in his first year, would you pay top dollar for a guy who had those stats? The post I was replying too said that it doesn't matter if he is a rookie because he was given a monster contract he doesn't get a pass and should be playing up to that contract. I don't recall fans in Houston thrilled with Williams as a rookie

 

I'm not saying that Maybin is great right now, but he missed all of training camp (yes it was his fault for holding out) and hasn't even played a full season. Plus, he has had some guys ahead of him playing better at this point, so the Bills aren't forced to throw him in and force him to learn on the field during the season. His development doesn't have to be rushed.

 

Although it doesn't matter because there are so many expert player evaluators on this team, and since their guy wasn't chosen by Buffalo, they will never like the pick

Okay, I'll buy it. But I'll be feeling a lot better about him once he gets his azz in gear. Next year - new coaches and an off season conditioning program and a full training camp behind him - there'll be no excuses.

[Tcali]

Says who?

 

Did he say that Maybin would be the best prospect in his first year? LINK?

 

We don't know what Maybin will be. He's still extremely young.

which is a great basis upon which to use the #11 pick in the entire draft

[apuszczalowski]

Okay, I'll buy it. But I'll be feeling a lot better about him once he gets his azz in gear. Next year - new coaches and an off season conditioning program and a full training camp behind him - there'll be no excuses.

No doubt, by next season (barring injury, have to add that since he does play for the Bills) he should be showing some of what made him a 1st round pick

[MRW]

Getting back to the point of the original post, I'm not sure at all what Florio's point is here. He trots out an anecdote of one draft "expert" rating a guy a lot higher than some other draft "experts". But that doesn't come close to making any kind of argument that this "expert" is any better or worse than the rest of them. Teams miss, and miss badly, year after year in the draft, so it will take a lot more evidence to say if McShay is much worse than the norm.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Getting back to the point of the original post, I'm not sure at all what Florio's point is here. He trots out an anecdote of one draft "expert" rating a guy a lot higher than some other draft "experts". But that doesn't come close to making any kind of argument that this "expert" is any better or worse than the rest of them. Teams miss, and miss badly, year after year in the draft, so it will take a lot more evidence to say if McShay is much worse than the norm.

 

MRW, the person Florio quotes is a "league official."

 

In addition the thrust of the PFT post was that Locker "submitted his name for consideration to the NFL Collegiate Advisory Committee" which, according to the NCAA is made up of 12 general managers/personnel directors of NFL clubs and the directors of the NFL’s two scouting combines.

Under this program student-athletes that are at least three years out of high school may receive a general assessment of their draft potential. The committee will provide the player its best estimate of the highest round in which he has the potential to be drafted. Locker got a 2nd round grade. Of course all it takes is one team to think otherwise but still, these are the opinions of professional scouts.

 

As also stated in Florio's post, the league source said "McShay is clueless. Up until three weeks before the 2008 draft, he said that [Kentucky's] Andre Woodson would be a first-round pick. He went in the sixth and is out of the league."

 

I don't know whether I'd call McShay clueless but his resume would suggest that he's not really as qualified as a scout. He played a bit in high school and college and has never worked as a scout.

 

Thus, Florio's point is that not only is McShay's evaluation questionable, but his evaluations can be a great disservice to players considering whether to declare for the draft.

 

Do you think that the opinion of the NFL Collegiate Advisory Committee does not carry more weight than the opinion of Todd McShay?

[Nanker]

No doubt, by next season (barring injury, have to add that since he does play for the Bills) he should be showing some of what made him a 1st round pick

Here's one for both of us!