Are injuries a result of poor play?

[RJ (not THAT RJ)]

Here's the number of guys on IR for the worst teams in the league:

 

Oakland - 4

Cleveland - 12

Washington - 10

Chicago - 5

Detroit - 16

Tampa Bay - 15

St. Louis - 11

Seattle - 4

Buffalo - 16

 

Doesn't look like there's a specific correlation between injuries and poor play........

 

 

Well... maybe all of them fired Rusty Jones?

 

[/TBD idiot]

[gobillsinytown]

Well... maybe all of them fired Rusty Jones?

 

[/TBD idiot]

 

That's really funny becasue Rusty Jones is Chicago's Strength coach.....

[BillsfaninFl]

how bored ar we? this is a disgusting disgrace to humanity. kill me

 

lmao

[BillsfaninFl]

I think also, many of the players who get injured are so irrelevant, that they just go on IR rather than lingering on the roster. I don't really know about the severity of most of these injuries, but it's not like there's a reason to save a roster spot for Marcus Buggs for 4-5 weeks.

 

Seriously, I think you make a good point. When players are so easily interchangeable because their skills are "average," it is not a prioroty to keep a roster spot open for them. Very few players (i.e. Poz, Lynch, Edwards, etc.) have been allowed to remain on the roster while healing. I know a nuimber of us have criticized those I just named, but the irganization considered them among our top players, so it makes sense.

[RJ (not THAT RJ)]

That's really funny becasue Rusty Jones is Chicago's Strength coach.....

 

 

I know.

[Red]

I believe that injuries are a result of several factors.

 

Obviously, the extreme contact nature of the NFL has always led to injuries. But the sheer volume of IR'd players, and certain types of injuries were simply unheard of a decade ago and are as a result of a couple of factors, IMO.

 

For the Bills, we play an aggressive, defensive style with an emphasis on defensive speed as opposed to size and strength. When we are playing most teams that employ a bigger team philosophy, as the game wears on and the offense cannot stay on the field, our defenders get worn down and beat up.

 

Another factor IS the increased size of today's player. These forces moving and stopping suddenly cause greater force per collision, and are harder to stop once started.

 

But perhaps one of the biggest influences is the amount and types of anabolic drug use of today's NFL. Torn tendons and muscles are as a result of too much muscle size/ force for the supporting tissue (tendons and ligaments) to withstand.

 

Can anyone site achilles tendon tears, biceps tear, pectoral tears, or tricep tears in the players of the 80's and 90's?

 

Now, we all know that anabolic steroid use was heavy in the 60's and 70's, and I doubt that it was truly eliminated in the 80's and 90's.

 

The NFL likes to boast about its drug testing program, but it has been proven that they are simply the best of the worst. The cost to truly test is exorbitant, and not even the Olympic Games truly test properly. We also see that rogue chemists and drug manufacturers (Ex: BALCO) have mastered designer drugs, created solely to beat any test and to stay one (or more) steps ahead.

 

Then again, alot of injuries are just a freak accident on a play.

[The Big Cat]

I'm not sure where the number "16" is coming from. Here are the 13 listed on the site that shall not be named:

 

1. Demetrius Bell, knee.
   
2. Eric Wood, leg.
   
3. Seth McKinney, torn meniscus.
   
4. Keith Ellison, quad.
   
5. Derek Fine, knee.
   
6. Kawika Mitchell, knee.
   
7. Marcus Buggs, knee.
   
8. Leodis McKelvin, broken leg.
   
9. Kendall Simmons, shoulder.
   
10. Derek Schouman, knee.
    
11. Brad Butler, knee.
    
12. Marcus Smith, sprained knee.
    
13. Lydell Sargeant, torn ACL.
    

 

Now, another poster was spot on saying that most of these were just to free up roster spots by shelving expendable players. To lop all the injuries under the same category is downright stupid. This is how they break down:

 

IR'd for Roster Space:

1. Seth McKinney, torn meniscus.
   
2. Marcus Buggs, knee.
   
3. Kendall Simmons, shoulder.
   
4. Marcus Smith, sprained knee.
   
5. Lydell Sargeant, torn ACL.
   

(Almost half)

 

IR'd for injuries arguably preventable:

1. Demetrius Bell, knee.
   
2. Keith Ellison, quad.
   
3. Derek Fine, knee.
   

(Only 3)

 

IR'd for injuries sustained in freak occurrences (getting rolled) or non-preventable circumstances (broken limb)

1. Eric Wood, leg.
   
2. Kawika Mitchell, knee.
   
3. Leodis McKelvin, broken leg.
   
4. Derek Schouman, knee.
   
5. Brad Butler, knee.
   

 

By my count, that makes 3 of our 13 IR'd players sidelined for injuries for which someone ought to be "blamed." Can this be the last thread on this topic now? If not, I will continually paste this post as frequently as the topic pops up.

[Thurman#1]

The Bills suffer an average number of injuries, and in fact have suffered fewer injuries than the Pats from 2006-2008 (see Mark Gaughan's chat today on the News' site for details). The idea that the Bills suffer more injuries than other teams is a myth that won't go away. It may seem worse for the Bills because the backups are so poor.

 

 

 

As of today, the Pats* have 6 guys on I.R. and the Bills have 18.

 

In 2008, they had 12 on I.R. The Bills also had 12.

 

In 2007, they had 7 on I.R while the Bills had 17.

 

These clearly show the Bills have many more SERIOUS injuries than the Pats*. The Pats* are famous for the games they play with the injury list each week, but that's different from the I.R.

[Thurman#1]

I think also, many of the players who get injured are so irrelevant, that they just go on IR rather than lingering on the roster. I don't really know about the severity of most of these injuries, but it's not like there's a reason to save a roster spot for Marcus Buggs for 4-5 weeks.

 

 

You do if you think he's better than the guy you would bring in. And if you didn't think so, the other guy would have been on the team instead of Buggs.

[Thurman#1]

I believe that injuries are a result of several factors.

 

Obviously, the extreme contact nature of the NFL has always led to injuries. But the sheer volume of IR'd players, and certain types of injuries were simply unheard of a decade ago and are as a result of a couple of factors, IMO.

 

For the Bills, we play an aggressive, defensive style with an emphasis on defensive speed as opposed to size and strength. When we are playing most teams that employ a bigger team philosophy, as the game wears on and the offense cannot stay on the field, our defenders get worn down and beat up.

 

Another factor IS the increased size of today's player. These forces moving and stopping suddenly cause greater force per collision, and are harder to stop once started.

 

But perhaps one of the biggest influences is the amount and types of anabolic drug use of today's NFL. Torn tendons and muscles are as a result of too much muscle size/ force for the supporting tissue (tendons and ligaments) to withstand.

 

Can anyone site achilles tendon tears, biceps tear, pectoral tears, or tricep tears in the players of the 80's and 90's?

 

Now, we all know that anabolic steroid use was heavy in the 60's and 70's, and I doubt that it was truly eliminated in the 80's and 90's.

 

The NFL likes to boast about its drug testing program, but it has been proven that they are simply the best of the worst. The cost to truly test is exorbitant, and not even the Olympic Games truly test properly. We also see that rogue chemists and drug manufacturers (Ex: BALCO) have mastered designer drugs, created solely to beat any test and to stay one (or more) steps ahead.

 

Then again, alot of injuries are just a freak accident on a play.

 

 

 

All of that may be true, but it does not even begin to explain why the Bills have many more players on I.R. than other teams. The one point that you made that seemed relevant was that we have lots of small guys because we play the Cover 2, but the other Cover 2 teams have many fewer injuries than us.

[Thurman#1]

I'm not sure where the number "16" is coming from. Here are the 13 listed on the site that shall not be named:

 

1. Demetrius Bell, knee.
   
2. Eric Wood, leg.
   
3. Seth McKinney, torn meniscus.
   
4. Keith Ellison, quad.
   
5. Derek Fine, knee.
   
6. Kawika Mitchell, knee.
   
7. Marcus Buggs, knee.
   
8. Leodis McKelvin, broken leg.
   
9. Kendall Simmons, shoulder.
   
10. Derek Schouman, knee.
    
11. Brad Butler, knee.
    
12. Marcus Smith, sprained knee.
    
13. Lydell Sargeant, torn ACL.
    

 

Now, another poster was spot on saying that most of these were just to free up roster spots by shelving expendable players. To lop all the injuries under the same category is downright stupid. This is how they break down:

 

IR'd for Roster Space:

1. Seth McKinney, torn meniscus.
   
2. Marcus Buggs, knee.
   
3. Kendall Simmons, shoulder.
   
4. Marcus Smith, sprained knee.
   
5. Lydell Sargeant, torn ACL.
   

(Almost half)

 

IR'd for injuries arguably preventable:

1. Demetrius Bell, knee.
   
2. Keith Ellison, quad.
   
3. Derek Fine, knee.
   

(Only 3)

 

IR'd for injuries sustained in freak occurrences (getting rolled) or non-preventable circumstances (broken limb)

1. Eric Wood, leg.
   
2. Kawika Mitchell, knee.
   
3. Leodis McKelvin, broken leg.
   
4. Derek Schouman, knee.
   
5. Brad Butler, knee.
   

 

By my count, that makes 3 of our 13 IR'd players sidelined for injuries for which someone ought to be "blamed." Can this be the last thread on this topic now? If not, I will continually paste this post as frequently as the topic pops up.

 

 

 

 

Of course they are trying to free up roster spots. That is the whole point of the Injured Reserve list. Other teams use it the same way we do. If you don't think a guy is going to play much or at all for the rest of the year, you I.R. him. Doesn't matter whether he's a scrub or a mainstay. The point is that injured guys are a waste of a roster spot.

 

You have a category of guys "IRed for roster space." Well, everybody on the I.R. was IRed for roster space. That's the whole reason the I.R. even exists. And in that category, you have a guy with a torn ACL and a torn meniscus. So I guess you're saying that if they weren't scrubs, the Bills would have poured their medical resources into the fray and these guys would have been playing in a week or two?

 

And knee injuries ARE preventable in a large number of cases, as the stabilizing and supporting muscles absolutely can be strengthened and injuries reduced though certainly not eliminated.