Obese air passenger in economy seat has picture taken

[KD in CA]

I was pointing to the isssue of how you determine who must pay additional not the fact that they will. Return to the other statement I made - I agree from a practical standpoint that something must be

 

There is a slippery slope here - who decides what and acceptable "girth" is? The f'in airlines that already cramp your legs? The government? Where else should the standard apply? (can't fit your ass in a movie seat, bus seat etc.)

 

Who decides? On an airplane, the airline decides. On a city bus, the city government decides. In a movie theater, the movie theater owner decides. What's so complicated? Tender feelings of a fat person really shouldn't take priority over the principal of private ownership.

 

The slippery slope here is legislatures and judges imposing their will on private businesses with no reasonable basis.

[Nervous Guy]

And you have scientific proof of this where exactly.....?

 

Not just, "Ho hos are bad for you," but some real, double-blind experiments and research.

there must have been some signficant genetic mutations that occured around 1976...that's when the trend towards obesity started.

[DrDawkinstein]

Good luck with that. Almost everyone around here thinks it's an easy solution - eat a salad, case closed. As a culture, we're not allowed to bash based on religion, ethnicity, etc, etc. But weight, for whatever reason, is culturally accepted and promoted.

 

because most overweight people are that way due to nothing but laziness and zero self control. you can claim genetics or glandular problems all you want, but the vast majority of overweight people ive ecountered, are that way simply because of horrible eating habits and no effort towards staying active.

 

i just got back from a month in the middle of Kansas. almost every person in that small town was overweight. yet, their favorite form of entertainment is the fast food places that keep opening, and for the month I was there, I saw only ONE person out jogging. the few people that were in shape, ate right and worked out regularly. it IS pretty simple. you want to be thinner? eat less, work out more.

 

i dont know of many races or religions that are draining healthcare like the obesity problem is.

 

and fatties dont get "bashed" nearly as much as other "addicts" like smokers.

[GG]

there must have been some signficant genetic mutations that occured around 1976...that's when the trend towards obesity started.

 

Or high fructose corn syrup was added to each food item

 

Or Jimmy Carter became president

 

Can't tell, which.

[DrDawkinstein]

there must have been some signficant genetic mutations that occured around 1976...that's when the trend towards obesity started.

 

cable tv, fast food?

[GG]

because most overweight people are that way due to nothing but laziness and zero self control. you can claim genetics or glandular problems all you want, but the vast majority of overweight people ive ecountered, are that way simply because of horrible eating habits and no effort towards staying active.

 

i just got back from a month in the middle of Kansas. almost every person in that small town was overweight. yet, their favorite form of entertainment there are the fast food places that keep opening, and for the month I was there, I saw only ONE person out jogging. the few people that were in shape, ate right and worked out regularly. it IS pretty simple. you want to be thinner? eat less, work out more.

 

i dont know of many races or religions that are draining healthcare like the obesity problem is.

 

and fatties dont get "bashed" nearly as much as other "addicts" like smokers.

 

FWIW, I see more fat people per square mile in Kingston NY than in NYC. Can't say that the difference is in the water.

[BuffaloBill]

The slippery slope here is legislatures and judges imposing their will on private businesses with no reasonable basis.

 

Do you not think we will get to exactly this scenario .... made worse only by Congress intervening at some point to hold hearings and then develop an inane law to address the issue? I keep returning to my devil is in the "how" this gets done point.

[Fezmid]

there must have been some signficant genetic mutations that occured around 1976...that's when the trend towards obesity started.

 

You should read this book:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...9042602711.html

 

For those who don't like reading:

"Highly palatable" foods -- those containing fat, sugar and salt -- stimulate the brain to release dopamine, the neurotransmitter associated with the pleasure center, he found. In time, the brain gets wired so that dopamine pathways light up at the mere suggestion of the food, such as driving past a fast-food restaurant, and the urge to eat the food grows insistent. Once the food is eaten, the brain releases opioids, which bring emotional relief. Together, dopamine and opioids create a pathway that can activate every time a person is reminded about the particular food. This happens regardless of whether the person is hungry.

 

Combine that with:

The ingredient list for Southwestern Eggrolls mentioned salt eight different times; sugars showed up five times. The "egg rolls," which are deep-fried in fat, contain chicken that has been chopped up like meatloaf to give it a "melt in the mouth" quality that also makes it faster to eat.

 

So in essence, the food companies are doing what the tobacco companies do -- put additives into their food to help re-wire the brain to make it crave the unhealthy food, regardless of whether the body is hungry or not.

 

The difference between the tobacco companies and the food companies are that people NEED to eat to survive. Everyone eats, food is everywhere, especially in this country. Look at a regular American office - people bring in donuts for early meetings, have food in their cube to share with coworkers, many companies give away free pop. Peer pressure relating to food is everywhere -- heck, I had a business meeting yesterday where I was the only person who didn't order soup, and they gave me crap for it. My understanding is that in other countries, this is not the case. The book mentions that in France, for example, people are shocked to hear that people bring donuts into a morning business meeting. Oliver, care to comment?

 

Say what you want, it's NOT as simple as "don't eat bad food."

[DrDawkinstein]

You should read this book:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...9042602711.html

 

For those who don't like reading:

 

 

So in essence, the food companies are doing what the tobacco companies do -- put additives into their food to help re-wire the brain to make it crave the unhealthy food, regardless of whether the body is hungry or not.

 

The difference between the tobacco companies and the food companies are that people NEED to eat to survive. Everyone eats, food is everywhere, especially in this country. Look at a regular American office - people bring in donuts for early meetings, have food in their cube to share with coworkers, many companies give away free pop. Peer pressure relating to food is everywhere -- heck, I had a business meeting yesterday where I was the only person who didn't order soup, and they gave me crap for it.

 

Say what you want, it's NOT as simple as "don't eat bad food."

 

thanks for the link and the quote, good info.

 

but what you proved in your post contradicts your last statement. it IS as simple as dont eat bad food. dont eat processed foods, dont eat free donuts, dont drink a 2 liter of soda simply because it's free.

[Fezmid]

thanks for the link and the quote, good info.

 

but what you proved in your post contradicts your last statement. it IS as simple as dont eat bad food. dont eat processed foods, dont eat free donuts, dont drink a 2 liter of soda simply because it's free.

I suppose in a way, that's true. But it's not just about willpower, which is what most in this thread seem to believe. It's a MUCH more complex issue than, "Don't eat it," especially since food companies are doing their best to re-wire your brain to force you to eat more. The entire issue, taken as a whole, is not black and white.

[DrDawkinstein]

I suppose in a way, that's true. But it's not just about willpower, which is what most in this thread seem to believe. It's a MUCH more complex issue than, "Don't eat it," especially since food companies are doing their best to re-wire your brain to force you to eat more. The entire issue, taken as a whole, is not black and white.

 

I agree that its not black and white, but I dont absolve the "eaters" from being the cause of their own problem. The foods that those additives go into, arent healthy choices to begin with. They wouldnt be "addicted" to it if they weren't already over-eating them. Do you have any idea how much fast food you have to eat to cause it to re-wire your brain?!? I'm guilty of eating too much fast food myself, but I'm no where near addicted to it.

 

If so many smokers can quit every day, then I expect people to be able to make a choice that they arent going to have 3 BK value meals for dinner and instead are going to have some roasted chicken and potatoes and vegetables. THAT, in my opinion, is a much easier change to make than quitting smoking. yet, people continue to hit that drive thru cause they dont like healthy food.

 

The crux of the obesity problem in this country is in fact simple. Eating too much, not being active enough. If everyone thought of their body as a machine which you have to fuel, instead of a playground to stuff cupcakes into, then yes, the majority of the obese people left would probably be due to glandular problems (or something else out of their control). But then that number of obese people would be incredibly lower and it wouldnt be considered an epidemic.

 

see how this comes full circle to, after it's all said and done, eating less and working out more would greatly help the problem (and the people dealing with it).

[Gavin in Va Beach]

I suppose in a way, that's true. But it's not just about willpower, which is what most in this thread seem to believe. It's a MUCH more complex issue than, "Don't eat it," especially since food companies are doing their best to re-wire your brain to force you to eat more. The entire issue, taken as a whole, is not black and white.

 

 

Those people on that Biggest Loser show drop a ton of pounds because they exercise and eat better. It ain't rocket science. If we're all slaves to our brain chemistry we'd never stop smoking, eating, or !@#$ing.

[GG]

I suppose in a way, that's true. But it's not just about willpower, which is what most in this thread seem to believe. It's a MUCH more complex issue than, "Don't eat it," especially since food companies are doing their best to re-wire your brain to force you to eat more. The entire issue, taken as a whole, is not black and white.

 

Isn't there an option to switch your food vendor? Not all food processors and suppliers pump their products full of additives. The body does not get addicted to the additives no matter how bad you think the craving is.

 

The only addictive foodstuffs I know are coffee & chocolate. And the two cancel each other out when it comes to weight gain (esp if you only stick to bitter chocolate)

[bills_fan]

I disagree. For most, it is pretty simple. Don't consume more calories than you burn in a day. Ergo, you will not get fat. If you have a sedentary office job and do not work out, adjust your eating habits accordingly. Instead of hitting the vending machine, have an apple. Instead of a huge dinner, have a decent sized lunch so that you have time to burn off the calories. Its not rocket science.

[BuffaloBill]

If we're all slaves to our brain chemistry we'd never stop ..., or !@#$ing.

 

If participation is frequent and vigorous it could help with weight loss

[Fezmid]

I disagree. For most, it is pretty simple. Don't consume more calories than you burn in a day. Ergo, you will not get fat. If you have a sedentary office job and do not work out, adjust your eating habits accordingly. Instead of hitting the vending machine, have an apple. Instead of a huge dinner, have a decent sized lunch so that you have time to burn off the calories. Its not rocket science.

 

Let's see... Who is more believable, a Harvard-trained doctor, lawyer, medical school dean and former commissioner of the Food and Drug Administration.....? Or a random poster on a message board who says, "It's easy!!!! D'uh!!!!'

 

So tell me, bills_fan, how much training in brain chemistry have you had to know that it's not really a problem?

[DrDawkinstein]

Let's see... Who is more believable, a Harvard-trained doctor, lawyer, medical school dean and former commissioner of the Food and Drug Administration.....? Or a random poster on a message board who says, "It's easy!!!! D'uh!!!!'

 

So tell me, bills_fan, how much training in brain chemistry have you had?

 

he's not wrong. it IS that simple.

 

stop eating junk food, start eating healthy food, and dont consume more calories than you can burn. THAT is exactly how it works.

[Fezmid]

he's not wrong. it IS that simple.

 

stop eating junk food, start eating healthy food, and dont consume more calories than you can burn. THAT is exactly how it works.

 

Your quote from above:

because most overweight people are that way due to nothing but laziness and zero self control.

 

Oh look, another random poster who is smarter than a PhD who has actually done RESEARCH on the issue! We're so lucky to have people who don't need to waste time with things like science to come to conclusions on this forum.

[DrDawkinstein]

Your quote from above:

 

 

Oh look, another random poster who is smarter than a PhD who has actually done RESEARCH on the issue! We're so lucky to have people who don't need to waste time with things like science to come to conclusions on this forum.

 

im sorry, but where does your PhD guy say that what we're saying is wrong?

 

You linked one article that is about a very specific topic. Food ingredients helping cause obesity. But that doesnt completely acquit fat people for stuffing their faces and sitting on their couch.

 

do you suppose that if you asked him, he would say "Exercise and eating right have nothing to do with it. It's all the food company's fault."?!?!

 

do you reeeeally think that someone so well versed in nutrition would disagree with what we are saying regarding eating less, eating healthy, and being active?

 

is that what you are arguing?

[DrDawkinstein]

go ahead and google "how to prevent obesity" and also "how to fight obesity"

 

and every article you find, written by plenty of doctors and experts, will tell you the top two ways are:

 

1. Get Active

2. Eat Healthy

 

http://www.ehow.com/how_2048302_prevent-obesity.html

http://lifestyle.iloveindia.com/lounge/how...esity-3945.html

http://www.weightlossnutrition.org/how-to-prevent-obesity/