LOST...Season 6

[The Jokeman]

1. from what ive seen, he changed forms in order to manipulate people. as Dogan said, "he will be in the form of someone familiar and dead". what's an easier way to manipulate someone than showing up as a dead loved one and asking them to do something? plus, it seems the "rule" was that he could only take the form of someone dead and UNBURIED on the Island. I think this was why it was so important that Richard took the body of the Dharma leader back to his people. So they could bury it and know it was not Smokey visiting them.

I'm not sure how true the UNBURIED on the island would be as while there's no proof he took her form I believe Smokey took Alex's form. As think he did so when Ben was being judged as it was his way to fool Ben that he needed to kill Jacob and she was definitely dead and buried on the island per Richard telling Ben he had buried her under the swing set.

[extrahammer]

I'm one who initially put some interpretation stock into that. That was pretty ****ty of the network to do, especially w/o asking the producers. They wanted from the start to have the last, last, last image of the show be Jack's closing eye, and some stooge just had to ---- with it. Hope it's fixed in the DVDs.

 

It would've helped immensely to have put some kind of word mark there, a tribute, a thanks to the fans, a "THE END" etc. to really hit it home that the scene was separate from the storytelling/content of the series.

 

I took it under interpretation, but my old college buddy who works in TV said he thought ABC just threw it in there. You're right UConn, a mark or something would have been helpful.

[duey]

I'm not sure how true the UNBURIED on the island would be as while there's no proof he took her form I believe Smokey took Alex's form. As think he did so when Ben was being judged as it was his way to fool Ben that he needed to kill Jacob and she was definitely dead and buried on the island per Richard telling Ben he had buried her under the swing set.

Your absolutely right. Alex was buried under the swing set and I believe he did take Alex's form when Ben was being judged. And don't forget what Alex said..."she" told Ben he had to do whatever John Locke said...basically setting up Ben killing Jacob.

[duey]

I took it under interpretation, but my old college buddy who works in TV said he thought ABC just threw it in there. You're right UConn, a mark or something would have been helpful.

To me it just smacks of the network having no friggin' clue about the show, its storylines and its fans. Anyone with any interest or knowledge of the show would have understood how something like that would detract from the actual ending of the show. Dopes...absolute dopes.

[DrFishfinder]

To me it just smacks of the network having no friggin' clue about the show, its storylines and its fans. Anyone with any interest or knowledge of the show would have understood how something like that would detract from the actual ending of the show. Dopes...absolute dopes.

Ham-handed, arrogant futhermuckers. May Dick Jauron become head of programming for ABC.

[SonOfWade]

The ash they used to spread to keep smokey away. Do we know what that was or where it came from? Why it was so powerful?

 

I'm guessing it's ashes from the banyan trees. In the first episode, the smoke monster wouldn't follow Jack, Kate, and Charlie into the banyan trees. There are several other examples in the Lostepidia entry for The Man in Black under the Banyan trees section. The trees appear to be Smokey's Kryptonite. Garlic and holy water for vampires, fire for Frankenstein's monster, silver for werewolves. Every monster has it's weakness.

[duey]

I'm guessing it's ashes from the banyan trees. In the first episode, the smoke monster wouldn't follow Jack, Kate, and Charlie into the banyan trees. There are several other examples in the Lostepidia entry for The Man in Black under the Banyan trees section. The trees appear to be Smokey's Kryptonite. Garlic and holy water for vampires, fire for Frankenstein's monster, silver for werewolves. Every monster has it's weakness.

Very nice catch...and remember, MIB said that he's been looking for the cave of light for a very long time and was never able to find it.

[SonOfWade]

Very nice catch...and remember, MIB said that he's been looking for the cave of light for a very long time and was never able to find it.

 

I don't think anyone can find it unless accompanied by the current protector.

[ThePebble19]

Ham-handed, arrogant futhermuckers. May Dick Jauron become head of programming for ABC.

 

 

It's hard to win over fans on ABC.

[Cugalabanza]

I don't think anyone can find it unless accompanied by the current protector.

Which is ironic because it follows that the best protection would be to not have a protector at all, because no one would ever find it to do it any harm.

[DrFishfinder]

It's hard to win over fans on ABC.

heh.

 

I wonder what ABC's got left? Dancing with the Kardashian's Chef's Apprentice?

[MattyT]

Which is ironic because it follows that the best protection would be to not have a protector at all, because no one would ever find it to do it any harm.

oh snap!

[UConn James]

I have a few questions upon further reflection. (Please keep in mind, per my earlier posts, that I was in the too-many-unanswered-questions/complainer camp, but came to realize that the actual problem was me: I had not invested enough time and neurons to index all the facts and conjecture, so the questions seemed unanswered when they were actually resolved or resolve-able through inference.)

 

Anyway, here are a few things that still don't make sense to me:

 

1) Why did the smoke monster need to change human forms? And was one of his forms Christian Shepherd? And/or anyone else other than MIB and Locke?

 

2) What happened when Jughead was detonated? Why didn't the Lostaways die? Was there a time flash that took them away from the actual detonation? Or were they immune to it because they couldn't be killed by a non-candidate (Juliet)?

 

3) Why/how was Sayid revived from death? And why did Dogen subsequently tell Sayid that he had the "wrong kind" of energy based upon the torture test?

 

OK, that's it for now. I appreciate everyone's knowledge and wisdom, and have hereby sworn off claiming that there were too many unanswered questions!

hey UB, im glad you decided to join the discussion! half the fun was talking about the show and now its all we have left and these are some great questions. probably the best ive seen after i asked someone to list their remaining questions.

 

1. from what ive seen, he changed forms in order to manipulate people. as Dogan said, "he will be in the form of someone familiar and dead". what's an easier way to manipulate someone than showing up as a dead loved one and asking them to do something? plus, it seems the "rule" was that he could only take the form of someone dead and UNBURIED on the Island. I think this was why it was so important that Richard took the body of the Dharma leader back to his people. So they could bury it and know it was not Smokey visiting them.

 

2. Great question. not sure that we'll ever really know exactly what happened. what we do know is that when it detonated, the LOSTIES jumped back through time to present day, so we can assume that the release of that energy sent them through time instead of blowing them up in the explosion. This post has some pretty good ideas about the Alt timeline, and how the detonation created it, and what it meant to the LOSTIES.

 

3. "HOW" is going to have to be left up to faith, one of the show's main themes, as I can not tell you the science behind bringing someone back from the dead I'll assume that the waters in the temple, were the same that ran to the Light Chamber. While it was never fully explained, we know that is where Richard took Ben when he was shot as a boy to be healed. NOW, I also believe it was pointed out that the fountain did not work for Sayid, and it was not the water that brought him back to life as he did not revive instantly. So this might mean that the MiB got to him somehow, just like he can get to other dead bodies left unburied on the Island, and that gave him the "wrong energy". There is a lot of grey area on this though. Great question.

 

I was thinking about things that were left unexplained last night, and thought about Dogan's test as well. It doesnt seem to relate to anything we saw.

 

The Smoke Monster could take the forms of the buried. He used Alex's form during Ben's "judgment" and we learned that Richard had buried her near the Dharma-ville swingset. It could also take the form of people whose memories it downloaded, who were never on the island e.g. Ben's mother, Isabella. I think Richard may have brought Paul's body to the Temple, as that was the only place Smokey/Cerberus couldn't go.

 

The Jughead detonation is and will remain a mystery. One could even question whether it blew up at all. Perhaps the energy release that produced the time-flash was just the effect of the drilling. The DI could then have used a lot of concrete to contain whatever radiation emanated from the exposed Jughead core, and/or used it as a power device for the Swan hatch. As UB2 wrote, the candidates couldn't die... or at least not by the hands of Juliet. But there may well have been a small explosion (without the rest of the bomb, the core explosion wouldn't have been nearly as large), and the DI built the Swan to contain the Source energy release to levels where it wouldn't do harm. That actually makes sense as I write it now. Just so everyone knows, the Incident is where Richard "saw them all die." Per writer's-room white-board that was shown in S5 DVD commentary, there was to be a scene where Richard witnessed the Incident, and it evidently didn't make the final cut. This link gets it totally right (but, screw the writer's "thoughts and wishes"). Jacob loosely orchestrated everything.

 

Man, I can't stop thinking about 'The End.'

 

If Aaron's one of the castaway's moving on from the sideways world, how come he's still shown as a baby? And will Claire and Charley be changing dipers in Heaven for all eternity? Sigh...

 

Aaron was a part of the core S1 group, and apparently, the island experience was the most important part of his life.

 

Different from Des and Penny's son, Charlie, who had no real connection to the island. Not quite sure how Penny is there, but then again she did serve as Desmond's constant.

 

Interesting to note that only Boone and Locke are without a coupling in the final church scene (and, no, they're not sitting close together, either).

 

Just read a theory which I posted in another reply, that says they were not all moving on to heaven or the afterlife, but that they were then finally able to move on with their lives. and that the ALT timeline was just that, an alternative place with no time, but space.

 

here is the theory with the information from Faraday's journal. kinda changes things a little if true.

 

http://theoriesonlost.blogspot.com/2010/05...rything-by.html

 

Not any kind of judgment on you, but Doc Dank, that link is a pure canard. There is nothing to it, that's not from an interview with JJ Abrams, and most of the ideas in it are directly opposed by what we saw and what Christian said in the "The End." The Sideways world was not reality, they are all dead, and the time lines do not merge, beyond the consciousness merges of certain of the Lostaways from the original timeline into this purgatory/intermediary stage where they 'waited' (but, "there is no now, here" so there was no wait as such) for everyone to corporeally die and then decide whether to move on/let go. I put no stock into this link's contents.

 

Smokey took the form of MIB, Locke, Christian Shepherd, Richard's wife and, I believe, Eko's brother. Sometimes I wonder of some of the dead people Hurley saw were smokey. I also wonder if Kate's horse was smokey.

 

I believe so. Also, the cat Sayid saw at the Flame station. Every vision was an effort by the MIB to push the Lostaways on. As much as he accused Jacob of "pushing" them all to the island, he was doing the same thing. But whereas Jacob largely left people to make their own choices, MIB was using ghostly persuasion.

 

a friend just messaged me the following thought:

 

If it was the Jughead detonation which caused the childbirth issues on the Island, then Juliet CAUSED the childbirth problem. The same problem she was brought to the Island to fix 30 years later, which then set her up to go back in time and again, cause the problem.... and so on.

 

Yeah. That seems clear. Ethan was the last baby to be conceived and born on the island.

 

After a few days thought... Im not a fan of the ending, but it could be a lot worse... most of the time a finale doesnt come close to expectations and could even ruin a series (see Sopranos, The). I think the writers needed some sort of major event and/or major twist at the end. The whole "purgatory" thing was just fabricated from material introduced in the this season.

 

Also, if you look at the final conflict it is pretty unsatisfying. Like WTF was the point of Ben turning in the 2nd last episode? The final fight wasnt good at all, there were much better fights throughout the series. The final resolution to the whole thing was unplug a mysterious plug so light stops shining in a cave, throw the evil guy onto rocks, then plug the thing back in?

 

I saw much better conclusions written by fans on the internet over the course of the past few years. Pretty bad writing here iMO. The series (potentially one of the greatest serieses ever IMO) went out with a whimper. Also take into account that fans have been looking forward to a huge "mind f*ck" at the end for 6 years.

 

If you're unhappy with the ending and/or the last season, that's your prerogative... to be unhappy. Personally, I don't want to be moany and groany. We got a pretty darn good resolution, the story came full circle, and it was a beautiful message at the end. I'm sorry you didn't like it.

[duey]

As if I needed another reason to buy the Lost Six Pack on August 24...

 

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1640174/2...527/story.jhtml

 

'Lost' DVD Set Will Feature Hurley/Ben Epilogue

Star Michael Emerson says bonus feature will show 12-14 minutes of the duo's Island adventures.

By Adam Rosenberg

 

Hurley: "You know, you were a real good number two." Ben: "And you were a great number one, Hugo."

 

This brief exchange between Hurley (Jorge Garcia) and Ben (Michael Emerson) in the final stretch of "Lost" series finale "The End" suggested that a lifetime of adventures unfolded for the Island duo before they eventually moved on and reunited with their friends in the pre-afterlife. And fans will actually get to glimpse those adventures when season six of "Lost" arrives on DVD and Blu-ray.

 

"For those people that want to pony up and buy the complete 'Lost' series, there is a bonus feature — you could call it an epilogue, a lost scene," Emerson said during an appearance on G4's "Attack of the Show." "It's a lot, 12 or 14 minutes, that opens a window on that gap of unknown time between Hurley becoming number one and the end of the series."

 

The revelation was greeted with gasps of surprise from the studio audience. Additional answers had been promised for the "Lost" season six DVD release, but no details had been revealed before Emerson spoke. Asked if he regretted making the reveal, the actor replied with a smile, "I'm rolling over that in my mind."

 

The follow-up question, of course, is if this footage might hint at some kind of "Lost" spin-off, something that showrunners Carlton Cuse and Damon Lindelof have sworn time and again won't happen — at least, not with them at the helm.

 

"It's self-contained," Emerson replied. "Although it's a rich period in the show's mythology that has never been explored. So who knows what will come of it?"

[DrDawkinstein]

Not any kind of judgment on you, but Doc Dank, that link is a pure canard. There is nothing to it, that's not from an interview with JJ Abrams, and most of the ideas in it are directly opposed by what we saw and what Christian said in the "The End." The Sideways world was not reality, they are all dead, and the time lines do not merge, beyond the consciousness merges of certain of the Lostaways from the original timeline into this purgatory/intermediary stage where they 'waited' (but, "there is no now, here" so there was no wait as such) for everyone to corporeally die and then decide whether to move on/let go. I put no stock into this link's contents.

 

of course, i just thought it made for interesting conversation, and was another way of looking at the ending. since im not in the camp that has to have exact and definite answers laid out for them, i think it's interesting that there's some mystery there. good catch in Faraday's journal, and if that is true, then it does leave some wiggle room. im going with the general consensus that it was the afterlife, but "what if" it wasnt. or what really is the after life? maybe now they get to go on and live a "perfect life" together? i dont know. i just really liked how this theory was able to bring some of the science side into play.

 

As if I needed another reason to buy the Lost Six Pack on August 24...

 

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1640174/2...527/story.jhtml

 

AMAZING! was going to purchase anyways, but now it's a must have.

[The Jokeman]

AMAZING! was going to purchase anyways, but now it's a must have.

Meanwhile those of who have bought each series at they come out get the shaft!

[DrDawkinstein]

Meanwhile those of who have bought each series at they come out get the shaft!

 

general rule of thumb for any media nowadays: always hold out for the special edition Bluray Box Set

 

of course, in a few years (months?) that rule will change when there is an even better format available

[UConn James]

of course, i just thought it made for interesting conversation, and was another way of looking at the ending. since im not in the camp that has to have exact and definite answers laid out for them, i think it's interesting that there's some mystery there. good catch in Faraday's journal, and if that is true, then it does leave some wiggle room. im going with the general consensus that it was the afterlife, but "what if" it wasnt. or what really is the after life? maybe now they get to go on and live a "perfect life" together? i dont know. i just really liked how this theory was able to bring some of the science side into play.

 

I'm also keen on the idea that going into the Light triggers the "rebirth" that Mother stated was one of the Light's properties. And, if this group all goes into the light together, they are with each other in their next life. One could also argue that they had achieved 'Dharma' in the Buddhist sense.... and that the Dharma Initiative actually helped bring about these peoples' Dharma.

 

AMAZING! was going to purchase anyways, but now it's a must have.

Meanwhile those of who have bought each series at they come out get the shaft!

 

It's a little unclear to me whether this epilogue going to be on the S6 DVD/BD set for those of us who have purchased all along, or if it's exclusive to the Complete Six Season Collector's Set. It would suck a bit if it's not, but hey, they need to create their incentives so they can make more $. Also, it will doubtless be on Youtube about 10 minutes after that set is released, if not before, as many of the S5 extras were.

 

-----

 

Just found the sensibility in this posting to be very nice. These LOST threads are the place we made to be together....

[The Jokeman]

general rule of thumb for any media nowadays: always hold out for the special edition Bluray Box Set

 

of course, in a few years (months?) that rule will change when there is an even better format available

True. Yet with LOST I really didn't have an option because when the show first started I didn't watch it and I only got into the series after they started re-airing episodes after a brief interuption in the first season. I then bought the first season to get myself caught up on some episodes that weren't reaired and as they say, the rest is history.

[UConn James]

general rule of thumb for any media nowadays: always hold out for the special edition Bluray Box Set

 

of course, in a few years (months?) that rule will change when there is an even better format available

 

And that's the sh---- part as media gets more complicated beyond stone inscriptions. Paper, celluloid, DVDs, the ether that we call the Internet, etc. don't last. Hell, even stone carving doesn't last. The question becomes, as new media arises, whether a work will survive and be translated into the next format. Or how long that translation might take. There's countless works that have just been lost to history through disinterest, natural disaster / calamity, projects that get perpetually postponed, moneyed interests and the George Lucases and Peter Jacksons of the world that are content to just sit on things, release one improvement at a time to try to get fans to buy thirty-eleven copies of their movie sets.

 

One would hope that the quality of LOST will always draw people to it.