LOST...Season 6

[ajzepp]

Is Tony Soprano dead or was that dude just going to take a piss?

 

Dead as a door nail.

[DrDawkinstein]

Well, if you guys have that solid of a grip on wtf is going on, then I'll shutup for a while and just watch the finale....lol I still see a helluva lot of carrots!

 

let's talk about them! that's been the BEST part of being a fan of this show for the past 5 years. the outside discussions. ive learned all sorts of things from talking about this show. from art history, to physics, to religious history, to philosophy and even psychology. if you have questions, dont be afraid to ask!

 

my most favorite part is being able to take wild tangent rides that end up going off topic, and then bringing them full circle back to the show. it's how a lot of the "answers" have been arrived at.

 

it's also, unfortunately, why MOST people are going to hate the last season. because we are getting answers that in no way can live up to the millions of crazy theories that people have already read. but we are going to get closure on the main story. anything left open after that is simply material to discuss and mull over in the future if you choose to do so.

[John Adams]

let's talk about them! that's been the BEST part of being a fan of this show for the past 5 years. the outside discussions. ive learned all sorts of things from talking about this show. from art history, to physics, to religious history, to philosophy and even psychology. if you have questions, dont be afraid to ask!

 

Umm, I enjoy a little outside discussion here and there but no, that's not the best part of the show for me or most of the people who haven't dressed up for Comic-Con. I dedicate an hour of my life during the season to watching the show Lost. It's not worth much more than that and if I have to buy a post-show encyclopedia to wrap up some questions, I won't and can't imagine many of the millions who watched the show will.

 

I don't care if they don't wrap up every open thread but they need to wrap up the biggies. And I hoep they haven't just left the magic of the island as the result of a gay unexplained "light." Now I know they have 3.5 hours to offer something a bit more on the "light," but I suspect that dedicating one crappy hour to its revelation is all we're gonna get. And if that's it, it was not a good idea or revelation. It's not as bad as "It's all a dream" but it's close.

[ajzepp]

Umm, I enjoy a little outside discussion here and there but no, that's not the best part of the show for me or most of the people who haven't dressed up for Comic-Con. I dedicate an hour of my life during the season to watching the show Lost. It's not worth much more than that and if I have to buy a post-show encyclopedia to wrap up some questions, I won't and can't imagine many of the millions who watched the show will.

 

I don't care if they don't wrap up every open thread but they need to wrap up the biggies. And I hoep they haven't just left the magic of the island as the result of a gay unexplained "light." Now I know they have 3.5 hours to offer something a bit more on the "light," but I suspect that dedicating one crappy hour to its revelation is all we're gonna get. And if that's it, it was not a good idea or revelation. It's not as bad as "It's all a dream" but it's close.

 

lol...that's kind of how I feel too...and if it's all someone's dream I'm gonna go apeshiit!

 

Dr.D: the only problem I have with this whole situation is that probably most of the answers you would provide about various questions/carrots would be at least PARTLY speculation on your part. Everyone and their mother seems to have theories on this or that, which is great when it's a few areas, but I really think a lot of people are feeling as if it's a LOT of damn areas that are left open ended. I guess that's why I'll take the advice of you and the others who said to wait until the last few hours, but that just seems like a tall order for them to wrap things up with any level of satisfaction. But I guess we'll find out in a few days!

[Lurker]

or most of the people who haven't dressed up for Comic-Con.

Yeah, we're getting dangerously close to Trekker territory, where you have to learn Klingon to fully appreciate what the hell is happening...

[Ramius]

What gets me is how some of you guys would simply be satisfied if the series ends with, "the whole point was to get a candidate to protect the light." That answers absolutely nothing. And while i like speculating, i also want some answers and a conclusion to the show. I watch LOST to get entertainment, similar to reading a book or watching a movie. You expect an entire plotline, with a conclusion that addresses subjects brought up earlier in the book/movie/series. Speculating and not knowing the truth behind a lot of issues on the show after the show is over becomes lame in a hurry.

[DrDawkinstein]

What gets me is how some of you guys would simply be satisfied if the series ends with, "the whole point was to get a candidate to protect the light." That answers absolutely nothing. And while i like speculating, i also want some answers and a conclusion to the show. I watch LOST to get entertainment, similar to reading a book or watching a movie. You expect an entire plotline, with a conclusion that addresses subjects brought up earlier in the book/movie/series. Speculating and not knowing the truth behind a lot of issues on the show after the show is over becomes lame in a hurry.

 

that's like, your opinion, man

[ajzepp]

Yeah, we're getting dangerously close to Trekker territory, where you have to learn Klingon to fully appreciate what the hell is happening...

 

lmao

[Rico]

Umm, I enjoy a little outside discussion here and there but no, that's not the best part of the show for me or most of the people who haven't dressed up for Comic-Con. I dedicate an hour of my life during the season to watching the show Lost. It's not worth much more than that and if I have to buy a post-show encyclopedia to wrap up some questions, I won't and can't imagine many of the millions who watched the show will.

 

I don't care if they don't wrap up every open thread but they need to wrap up the biggies. And I hoep they haven't just left the magic of the island as the result of a gay unexplained "light." Now I know they have 3.5 hours to offer something a bit more on the "light," but I suspect that dedicating one crappy hour to its revelation is all we're gonna get. And if that's it, it was not a good idea or revelation. It's not as bad as "It's all a dream" but it's close.

Nice post, I agree with the 1st paragraph, it's only a TV show, I just want to be entertained for an hour... much more critical of movies.

 

As for the second paragraph, I'm not too concerned at all with tying up loose ends. To tell the truth, I would rather have them left open & unanswered than ridiculously explained like some of the nonsense that was presented this week.

 

ETA: No offense to those who are heavily into it, looks like fun.

[UConn James]

A couple of notes:

 

A) There was a musical tribute to LOST on Friday in La-La Land, similar to the one a couple of years back in Hawai'i.

 

LOST LIVE: THE FINAL CELEBRATION - Oscar® winning composer Michael Giacchino conducted a live orchestral performance, featuring the iconic music of "Lost," at UCLA's Royce Hall on Thursday, May 13, to celebrate the upcoming series finale. The concert also featured appearances by LOST executive producers and cast members, in addition to, a special preview of the penultimate episode screened immediately after the concert.

"We introduced this mysterious 'heart of the island' and I think the finale had better tell us more about the heart of the island." -- Carlton Cuse, interview at "LOST Live." Who knows how much, but to those of little faith here, Carlton is throwing you a bone. So don't look longingly at high rooftops or sit in the bath with an electric toaster on the tub wall. We may get answers yet. Video Link (despite the site name, there are no spoilers on this page. But don't go poking around.)

 

2) The finale episode is frickin' huge, Mr. Bigglesworth! Ad rates are reportedly $900,000 for a 30-second spot. That's behind only the Super Bowl and the Oscars. Either the advertisers figure that the fanbase is really devoted or a lot of people who stopped watching the show are going to tune in to the last episode (and then B word, whine and moan that they didn't understand anything and that it's the writers' fault for not making it simple enough so the casual/one-episode viewer can "get it").

 

III) You know, the more I think about it, I wonder if Desmond's purpose was centered around the "heart of the island." He is immune to electromagnetic radiation... or at least, he can survive it. There may be a space-time detour, but twice now, he gets back to exactly where he was when the EM pulse went off --- that may be the sacrifice that Widmore was asking him to make. If we do get a closer look at the "light," it will be through Des.

[Assquatch]

Video Link (despite the site name, there are no spoilers on this page. But don't go poking around.)

It was taken aback seeing Daniel Dae Kim (Jin) speak without his accent.

[UConn James]

LOST 6.16 | "What They Died For" | 9 p.m. ABC

 

While Jack's group searches for Desmond, Locke comes up with a new plan.

 

Given that the remaining candidates now know exactly what FLocke is doing (namely, trying to get them to kill each other), he's got to change tactics. Methinks he'll be enlisting the help of the Ben/Richard/Miles group, unaware of the sub bomb, that went to the Barracks for explosives to blow up the plane. But what can kill the candidates now?

 

Last week's ep, titled "The Candidate" was about Jacob's candidacy. Still TBD who is the chosen candidate among the current pool. We'll also be learning an interesting bit about being a candidate vis-a-vis the names on the cave wall. Yellow-fonted for a spoilery tease: Kate's name was crossed off in the cave, so that means she's not a candidate anymore.... right?

[UConn James]

Doc Jensen's thoughts heading into WTDF. For those still questioning the worth of "The Candidate" (so, pretty much everyone) this is a worthy, quick read. Link.

 

In my recap of “Across The Sea,” I theorized that the Mother/Jacob/MIB drama created a mythic template (or followed and reinforced an existing template) for subsequent Island stories. In the same way many Christians believe the actions of Adam and Eve created a condition called original sin that affects all of mankind, Jacob’s early life trauma cursed the Island and affects those who come to it in various ways. The recurring motifs of mad mothers (Rousseau, Claire), Island birthright rivalry (Widmore vs. Ben, Ben vs. Locke), the conflicts between determinism vs. free will and faith vs. reason (Locke vs. Jack) and more — they can infect and take possession of Island visitors, especially ones already vulnerable to these themes. The Sickness that claimed Rousseau? Maybe it wasn’t a disease — maybe it was a story. The Island, then, is akin to The Overlook Hotel of The Shining, whose caretakers and guests risk becoming actors in a demonic play that haunts the environs.

...

If history is stuck in a rut of corruption and catastrophe, can it be unstuck? Can the vicious cycle be broken? Can the hopeless myth of damnation be replaced with a new, better myth? I would like to suggest that these questions represent the Great Work that Jacob has been pursuing over the past couple thousand years. And after much trial and error, and after a few failed approaches, Jacob has found a way to do it — though it will be up to the castaways themselves, and perhaps one castaway in particular, to actually finish his Island redemption project.

 

Before we get to the present, let’s review the past — specifically the trajectory of change in Jacob’s life. Jacob’s traumatic early years may be emblazoned on the Island’s soul, but his life story didn’t end with his reluctant choice to become Island guardian. Nor did it end with his choice to punish his brother for murdering their mother by tossing him down the Holy Wormhole and turning him into a smoke monster. Over time, Jacob evolved from hapless Momma’s Boy into his own man with a distinctly different worldview from Mother and his own approach to Island management. He rejected his mother’s cynical view of mankind as hopelessly corrupt. Instead, Jacob chose to see mankind as being capable of redemption. He also rejected Mother’s isolationism. Instead, Jacob began bringing people to the Island, presumably via some kind of psychic summoning. And at some point, he even began to journey out into the world and personally recruit people to the Island via his Global Touching Tours. I have to think this was a pretty ballsy thing to do for an eternal man-child who was raised to believe that nothing existed beyond the Island. What do you think he thought of the world of men? I’d like to think he thought: Mother, you were wrong about the world. This is not a place to run away from. This is a place that must be engaged and enjoyed. Yes, it is also a place of suffering and evil — which is why it is also a place that must be redeemed. Besides, the Apollo Candy Bars rock my socks off! (Or they would if I wore socks.)

...

Case in point: The Dharma Initiative. Dharma came to the Island with a seemingly spiritual orientation. They rejected the values of the world and wanted a place where they could live out their idealism of peace, love and harmony. Jacob must have been impressed that they identified themselves with the word Dharma, which embodies the ideas of law, rule following and reverence. But I wonder if he was also impressed by the whole “Namaste” business. “Namaste” generally translates into “I bow to you,” but more specifically, it refers to the idea that an aspect of the divine lives in all of us. Indeed, one translation of Namaste is “The light in me sees the light in you.” Another: “The divine in me acknowledges the divine in you and acknowledges that we are the same.”

[DrFishfinder]

a few years ago he said in an interview that they don't pay him enough to lose weight...

Seems like the more they pay him, the more he eats! He's one of my favorite characters, though.

[UConn James]

Another bit from an article Doc mentioned.... Link.

 

To start with what I thought didn’t quite work, I do think that joining Allison Janney’s “Mother” character in media res was a bit of a bizarre decision: while the why/how of the situation can’t be the show’s priority, the complete lack of context for how she arrived on the island and how she was given this kind of power seems incredibly bizarre to me. I’m very glad to see a woman in a role of authority on the show, and I thought Janney was great throughout, but I still feel like this flashback episode needs another flashback episode. I don’t necessarily think this is the case, as I think the episode derives enough meaning from the island’s past to build momentum heading into the final three and a half hours, but I nonetheless felt like something was missing, a takeaway that I think Lindelof and Cuse could have avoided with some sort of context for her position. This is very clearly Jacob and [MIB]’s story, but I think Janney’s character’s existence gestures too closely to mysteries that it is clear the show has no intention of solving.

 

However, I’m fine with the decision because it is another reminder that it doesn’t particularly matter what started this process, or what it is which lies at the heart of the island: the show isn’t about the island itself but rather the people who are drawn to it as part of this massive game of sorts, so it makes sense that the show would focus on how the island changed Jacob and [MIB]’s relationship rather than how this entire situation came to be. The important thing is that Jacob and [MIB] were not always omniscient beings, and that they were once humans who were fighting over whether or not they should leave the island just as Jack and Locke would do centuries later. The two child actors were well cast, and Mark Pellegrino and especially Titus Welliver stepped up to the plate to humanize two characters who have always seemed a bit obtuse. This wasn’t quite as successful as “Ab Aeterno” at creating an emotional core to their characters, if only because it was so concerned with creating thematic meaning for the rest of the series at the same time, but I thought the actors really brought it to the table and managed to show us the origins of these two characters without it seeming like the show just connecting some dots. We better understand why it is that [MIB] would be so focused on leaving, just as we understand why Jacob would be so concerned with finding someone to replace him (as it was his task, bestowed to him by his mother before her death). All of that works pretty well, and I’m officially campaigning for Welliver to grab an Emmy nod for his work in this episode (Janney’s a lock based on her pedigree, one would think).

 

Agreed on both points, even tho they seem to contradict. We won't have another mythology ep, and may not even get another flashback scene.

 

It would be interesting to learn how Mother became the Island's protector, but that may very well just lead to another island protector whose story we'd be curious about, and from that, another. This whole "game" as Richard's backstory title would suggest, has been playing out 'since the beginning of time.' How many iterations of the Candidate process must be shown before we're appeased? I think it's enough to take what we've been shown.

[Cugalabanza]

I still feel like this flashback episode needs another flashback episode.

 

It's turtles all the way down.

 

I noticed in the “Across the Sea” that there was a shot--while Boy-in-Black was staring out to sea—of a turtle washed up on the beach. I believe this is a nod from the writers telling us that we will not be getting anything definitive about any “first causes.”

[UConn James]

A little more from that last 'Cultural Learnings' link:

However, the big element of the episode is the introduction of “Light” as the term to describe the essence of the island’s power: from what we were told, it seems that “Mother” was protecting this power, and she took on the two sons as a way to pass on that responsibility to someone else. She explains that the light is beautiful, and something that is inside of everyone, but also something that inspires greed and malice; if they tried to abuse it, it could go out forever, and then the light would go out everywhere. At first this seemed a little bit far-fetched, but it was never intended to be literal: while there is an actual light that we see in that tiny little cave, the metaphor of light is meant to capture something larger, and we are inspired to make various connections not only to past discussions like that one (like Jacob explaining the whole Hellmouth-esque theory of the island to Richard) but also past events where “life, death and rebirth” (the three qualities the light represents) have played out on the island. We start to wonder whether the temple was built over this pool of water and whether that water is the same which [MIB] flowed into at episode’s end, and we start to realize why it is that the screen flashed to white after Jughead exploded rather than fading to black as we’ve come to expect. “Light” may not mean anything considered in the abstract, but as a metaphor for what we’ve seen it helps us piece together what it’s all meant.

 

Of course, some of the connections are more clear, and they create further mysteries: we still don’t understand how it is that [MIB] knew that his donkey wheel would somehow tap into the power of the light in order to transport him off of the island, or how the people within his community would eventually inspire the Dharma initiative. There are gaps to be found that perhaps Widmore and Ben can fill in, but there isn’t enough time to do flashbacks of every stage of the island’s development. I don’t know if these “new” mysteries were intended as mysteries or rather simply shortcuts to get us to the emotional stages in the episode, but I think that we are at the point where Lost viewers are intelligent enough to derive meaning from the events without getting entirely caught up in the “how/why” of things. What happens to [MIB] at episode’s end shows us how it is that he came to be the smoke monster, but rather than getting hung up on the metaphysical properties of the transformation I found myself wondering how that compares to what happened with Claire and Sayid, and whether the transformation was the result of the light’s general powers or the result of Jacob going against the letter (if not the law) of his Mother’s “rule” and allowing [MIB] to live on beyond his mortal death.

 

However, I’ve never been one to get caught up on “answers” when it comes to Lost – there’s a point where Janney’s character shushes Claudia and tells her that every question she asks about the island will only create more questions, and I felt like it was a less than subtle nod to the audience. These sort of meta moments, sprinkled throughout the episode as it starts to piece together certain things from the show’s past, kept the story of Jacob and [MIB] from forming its own entity, but that was the point of the episode. The point was that this wasn’t a new story so much as it was a story we’ve never heard before but seems awfully familiar. Lost loves to keep us on edge, and now that we’re all desperate for some sort of conclusion they gave us an episode which masqueraded as one thing (the backstory of Jacob and [MIB]) and ended up being a broad thematic investigation of the island and its meaning with a few pretty unsurprising “facts” about our favourite frateternal (invented word alert) twins.

[DrDawkinstein]

It's turtles all the way down.

 

I noticed in the “Across the Sea” that there was a shot--while Boy-in-Black was staring out to sea—of a turtle washed up on the beach. I believe this is a nod from the writers telling us that we will not be getting anything definitive about any “first causes.”

 

thank you! i havent had a chance to go back and re-watch the episode. i thought i saw a turtle on the beach, and then they cut to the boy sitting there and i thought i might have just mistaken a shot of BiB sitting on a log for a turtle.

 

i agree, there is no other reason for that shot but to tell us to stop digging.

[Spun]

I haven't spouted much about Lost in a while but I am up to date with the episodes. I find it comical that as we speculate about who will live and die, we have to think about who is still alive after all these time shifts going on. They still call James, Sawyer and Smokey, Locke! Hurley was on Kimmel last night (along with his deformed action hero doll!). Jack was also on Letterman but didn't say a whole lot.

 

Try as they may, they will never come close to replicating the quality of this show. Enjoy the last episodes as a classic is passing before our eyes!

[Lockport Bills]

Try as they may, they will never come close to replicating the quality of this show. Enjoy the last episodes as a classic is passing before our eyes!

 

+1

 

Can't wait for tonight's episode!!!