Reason #55 why big-time college football is a joke

[el Tigre]

Can't help but notice that not a single person in this thread opining that there should be a 16 or 24 team playoff has mentioned anything about the players. Like how four more weeks of football games starting in December affects the kids' ability to take finals, for example.

 

Or why those same kids should risk injury (and subsequent paydays) four more times a year just so people can B word about which teams got screwed out of the 'playoff' instead of getting screwed out of the BCS.

That's becuz alot of playoff proponents are extremists. They could care less about the fact that the players are student-atheletes,and becuz of that,there are many limitations on how much time can be devoted to their sport. Not to mention the fact that a large(16-24 or more)playoff system ensures that these kids seasons will always end in a loss. The vast majority of them will never play in the NFL. Alot of these guys just want their playoff,the hell with the consequences to the student-atheletes. I'm not totally opposed to some sort of playoff or plus-one,but it has take these issues into consideration.

[Ramius]

Can't help but notice that not a single person in this thread opining that there should be a 16 or 24 team playoff has mentioned anything about the players. Like how four more weeks of football games starting in December affects the kids' ability to take finals, for example.

 

Or why those same kids should risk injury (and subsequent paydays) four more times a year just so people can B word about which teams got screwed out of the 'playoff' instead of getting screwed out of the BCS.

 

 

That's becuz some alot of playoff proponents are extremists. They could care less about the fact that the players are student-atheletes,and becuz of that,there are many limitations on how much time can be devoted to their sport. Not to mention the fact that a large(16-24 or more)playoff system ensures that these kids seasons will always end in a loss. The vast majority of them will never play in the NFL. Alot of these guys just want their playoff,the hell with the consequences to the student-atheletes.

 

Your 2 arguments are laughably pathetic. Like the NCAA and institutions care about the "student" athletes. And, for what its worth, finals usually occupy a grand total of 1 week in december. Don't give me any crap about these guys needing to study.

 

If the NCAA cares so much about the "student" athletes, please explain why Div I baseball had its season shortened time wise (same # of games over a shorter time frame) so most ball teams play 5 games in a week. Also please explain why no one complains about the "student" athletes in NCAA basketball who may be out of class from wednesday to sunday for 4 consecutive weeks for the conference tournaments and the NCAA tourney.

 

There are some arguments for not having a playoff, but the "student" athlete argument is one of the shallowest and most laughable out there. If the NCAA actually cared, they'd make these guys go to class and they'd attempt to do something concerning the fact that the majority of major programs graduate less than 40% of their "student" athletes.

[Lori]

Can't help but notice that not a single person in this thread opining that there should be a 16 or 24 team playoff has mentioned anything about the players. Like how four more weeks of football games starting in December affects the kids' ability to take finals, for example.

 

Or why those same kids should risk injury (and subsequent paydays) four more times a year just so people can B word about which teams got screwed out of the 'playoff' instead of getting screwed out of the BCS.

FCS (former I-AA) playoff begins Nov. 28, with championship game on Dec. 18. But of course, any FBS playoffs would run afoul of the big money behind the conference championshp games and the bowl system, so we can't have that.

[jjamie12]

You 2 are laughably pathetic. Like the NCAA and institutions care about the "student" athletes.

That's a problem.

And, for what its worth, finals usually occupy a grand total of 1 week in december. Don't give me any crap about these guys needing to study.

Football players don't need to study? How can you take your English Lit final on Thursday, or your Calc I Final on Friday when you're playing Friday night in Las Vegas or wherever the playoff game is held?

 

If the NCAA cares so much about the "student" athletes, please explain why Div I baseball had its season shortened time wise (same # of games over a shorter time frame) so most ball teams play 5 games in a week.

That's a problem.

Also please explain why no one complains about the "student" athletes in NCAA basketball who may be out of class from wednesday to sunday for 4 consecutive weeks for the conference tournaments and the NCAA tourney.

I do. And it's a problem.

 

There are some arguments for not having a playoff, but the "student" athlete argument is one of the shallowest and most laughable out there. If the NCAA actually cared, they'd make these guys go to class and they'd attempt to do something concerning the fact that the majority of major programs graduate less than 40% of their "student" athletes.

All of that is a problem. And all of that is EXACTLY why I would be against making it any harder on these guys as 'student-athletes' (such as they are).

You 2 are laughably pathetic.

You know what, Ramius? I met you in 2005 in Tallahassee at the Bills Backer bar down there. We sat at the same table and watched the Steelers-Bills game in Week 17 (when we couldn't beat their backups). We had a nice time there, you told me about your PhD work (biology? microbiology? Something like that, right?), about how hot the FSU girls were, yada, yada, yada. If there's one thing I'm sure of it is this: You would never, in a million years call me (or anyone, for that matter) 'laughably pathetic' to their face. That's not your style. Save the internet tough guy routine, OK? It doesn't suit you.

[el Tigre]

You 2 are laughably pathetic.

Interesting. I guess becuz we disagree about a college playoff that makes me "laughably pathetic." Whatever tough guy. I think you illustrate my point about some of you guys being extremists.

[el Tigre]

That's a problem.

Football players don't need to study? How can you take your English Lit final on Thursday, or your Calc I Final on Friday when you're playing Friday night in Las Vegas or wherever the playoff game is held?

 

That's a problem. I do. And it's a problem.

 

All of that is a problem. And all of that is EXACTLY why I would be against making it any harder on these guys as 'student-athletes' (such as they are).

 

You know what, Ramius? I met you in 2005 in Tallahassee at the Bills Backer bar down there. We sat at the same table and watched the Steelers-Bills game in Week 17 (when we couldn't beat their backups). If there's one thing I'm sure of it is this: You would never, in a million years call me (or anyone, for that matter) 'laughably pathetic' to their face. Save the internet tough guy routine, OK? It doesn't suit you.

Good points.

[jjamie12]

FCS (former I-AA) playoff begins Nov. 28, with championship game on Dec. 18. But of course, any FBS playoffs would run afoul of the big money behind the conference championshp games and the bowl system, so we can't have that.

Agreed.

I understand your larger point, Lori, but here is something to consider, as well:

 

I took a quick glance thru the Top 25 of FCS and their schedules. The only Thursday game I saw was Temple-Villanova on 9/3. Everyone else played on Saturdays. No Tuesday games, no Thursday games, no Friday games. Saturdays. All of them. In addition, those Saturday games are usually played (relatively) locally. I would be very surprised if these teams did anything other than leave on a bus late Friday afternoon, stay over Friday night and be back on campus on Saturday night. These guys don't miss class (maybe the rare late friday afternoon class) for football, unlike just about every single FBS school.

[Ramius]

That's a problem.

Football players don't need to study? How can you take your English Lit final on Thursday, or your Calc I Final on Friday when you're playing Friday night in Las Vegas or wherever the playoff game is held?

 

That's a problem. I do. And it's a problem.

 

All of that is a problem. And all of that is EXACTLY why I would be against making it any harder on these guys as 'student-athletes' (such as they are).

 

You know what, Ramius? I met you in 2005 in Tallahassee at the Bills Backer bar down there. We sat at the same table and watched the Steelers-Bills game in Week 17 (when we couldn't beat their backups). We had a nice time there, you told me about your PhD work (biology? microbiology? Something like that, right?), about how hot the FSU girls were, yada, yada, yada. If there's one thing I'm sure of it is this: You would never, in a million years call me (or anyone, for that matter) 'laughably pathetic' to their face. That's not your style. Save the internet tough guy routine, OK? It doesn't suit you.

 

Sorry about the wording, its been changed. The student-athlete argument is laughably pathetic, not you guys personally. I actually agree with you on the issue that the NCAA needs a complete overhaul of their academic system and standards. But, my point is that it is ridiculous for FBS football football to hide behind the "academic" argument when the NCAA doesn't give 2 craps about student academics in every other Div I sport.

 

Obviously we met since you remember my work , but it wasnt the pittsburgh game. I was at that one at the Ralph.

[KD in CA]

Really? We're resorting to the 'they need to study' argument?

 

As though the difference between playing 13 games currently and 14-16 under a simple playoff scenario (for 4 teams out of 110 mind you), is going to turn a would-be doctor into a bum in the gutter.

 

 

 

btw...Basketball season lasts for 5 months and teams play up to 40 games; half of them on the road.

[Cynical]

Commonly used arguing tactic: Make the problem sound too enormous to be effectively fixed. We're not "building an ICBM", we're creating a plan for a simple football tournament. It's not difficult.

 

Never said it was difficult, but it would not be as easy as some you claim it would.

 

Feel free to critique the details of my playoff scenario posted above, which does not include any byes. You're hinging your argument on finding one flawed detail in one person's suggestion.

 

You're right. I only focused on one area of the their arguments: the bye.

Why?

First, I AM NOT OPPOSED TO A PLAYOFF SYSTEM. In fact, please reference post #18 where I said I would lean towards (read "prefer") a 16 team system.

I prefer a 16 team system because every conference champion would make it, and every team would have to play the same number of games to win the NC.

Incorporating a bye means a team could win the NC playing one less game than some other team.

And how hard is it to fathom the fans of a repeat conference champion, that never makes it beyond the second round, bitching and complaining they are getting screwed because they never get the bye.

So, I find no real fault in your suggestion other than I do not believe you should limit each conference to only two teams. Would you only limit the amount of independents eligible to only 1?

 

Faulty assumption. Why do you assume that a true playoff would have flaws? What flaws would those be? What are the major flaws you see that keep the I-AA football playoffs from being a better system than the current I-A arrangement?

 

College BB has 32 conferences vying for 64 spots (65 if you count the game played to determine the 64th seed).

D1AA football has 8 conferences that are vying for 16 playoff spots.

 

D1A football has 11 conferences. Notice a difference? 11 doesn't play nice with 8, 16, 32, etc ...

 

How does 'too many teams' make any difference if each conference champ gets a bid? And stop using the 'never be a perfect system' line as an excuse to ignore the fact that the current system sucks.

 

Never said the current system does not have problems. It does.

My argument has been a playoff system will not solve the issues (or perceptions) of bias, teams being screwed, etc ...,

and at some point down the line will cause people to start complaining of the how system needs to be fixed.

As you guys like to keep saying. It's not rocket surgery. 11 does not divide cleanly by 2.

 

PTR is spot on. You SEC guys don't want to change a thing because right now your conference champ has to win 3 tough games to get an automatic bid to the NC game.

 

Talk about your faulty assumptions ...

[Gordio]

That's becuz some alot of playoff proponents are extremists. They could care less about the fact that the players are student-atheletes,and becuz of that,there are many limitations on how much time can be devoted to their sport. Not to mention the fact that a large(16-24 or more)playoff system ensures that these kids seasons will always end in a loss. The vast majority of them will never play in the NFL. Alot of these guys just want their playoff,the hell with the consequences to the student-atheletes. I'm not totally opposed to some sort of playoff or plus-one,but it has take these issues into consideration.

 

Sorry, not buying this arguement. These kids go to school for free because they are elite athletes at a kids sport. The average college student will come out of college with a degree that does not guaranty them a well paying job anymore & $100,000 in student loans. To bad if they have to play a few more games or their season will end in a loss. If basketball could do it & DIV 11 football can do it so can they. I do not think it is too much to ask.

[justnzane]

You would never, in a million years call me (or anyone, for that matter) 'laughably pathetic' to their face. That's not your style. Save the internet tough guy routine, OK? It doesn't suit you.

 

good points there, but be easy on ramanus. he's good peoples on the interwebs.