jimmyv.

You definitely uprgraded OL with Steinbach and draft pick, and resigning Nate lessens need area for CB in draft...TE you got a good man, no doubt. And you've got LB #1 to replace LF. Tell me more about this Willis guy...and Robaire Smith, as signing him also means DT not a prime area of need in draft. Overall Not a bad plan, my only question is do Bills have enough cap space to sign all these players?

I agree. However, if Bills can address DL run stoppers in FA, then using draft to get a CB would make sense.

We're talking apples and oranges. I could argue with each of your points in last thread, but there's no point. I stick to the original post that questioned taking of Whitner and McCargo.

I sure as hell Whitner turns out to be fine safety. I guess you have different standards than me.

Finally, a guy who understands what Bills needs are. I think P. Fewell was quoted as saying Bills need to get bigger and stronger on DL. Everyone agrees need at DT, and I think where everyone gets tripped up is to follow this narrow minded approach to get a DT that fits their system. That's the wrong way to go, if you have a run plugger, space eating monster, you get him. period. The DEs also need upgrading, as I'm not sold on either Kelsey or Denney as starters. LB and OL also need to be addressed. I hope that Bills don't start drafting CBs in early rounds, but something tells me they will. If they select a CB over DL, OL or LB of equal or near equal value/ability, then they're destined for mediocrity, IMO.

I do know what I'm talking about. You're taking everything I say out of context. So he made one good, or even great play, that means he has great instincts...right on with your asinine logic. I'm comparing him to other first round picks by other teams at the safety position, like S. Taylor and E. Reed. So far, Whitner has not shown similar ability or instincts, I stand by this statement, and I don't think you would hear much argument from anyone who knows football. Maybe, Whitner does turn out to be like those other DBs, I sure as hell hope he does. Tell me how many GMs or HCs in league would take Whitner over S. Taylor or E. Reed. I don't think you would find many, except maybe Marv or Jauron.

Exactly...build both lines. It amazes me that people still see the need to draft an early round CB this year...not the way to go, unless sure HOF drops to us. when I last checked there are no dominant type DBs this year. I didn't understand Bills draft a year ago, but, I hope it works out.

Good point. Improving DL, LB, and OL in that order of importance are primary needs.

good response. I guess some people are satisfied with " solid player" at #8 in draft; true you can do worse, but, point is the Bills could have done better, as you point out Holcombs Arm. I'd say I'd be satisfied with the description of K. Williams in round 5 turning into solid player.

I think the point in the beginning of this thread was the questioning of taking Whitner and McCargo in first round. Listen, I hope Whitner is all pro and makes 15 interceptions next year. All I'm saying is that so far I haven't seen anything in his play to justify his selection at #8 in draft. From what I saw of E. Reed and S. Taylor, I could see why teams selected them in first round, I think Taylor was taken #5 and Reed lower than Whitner, as they both showed the skills, hitting and tackling of impact players from the start. If Whitner can get much stronger, and develop better instincts, maybe he will turn out great... I sure hope he does.

Right on! Maybe Whitner improves his play, maybe not...jury is still out. For those that describe him as "great", apparently they saw things I didn't. He didn't impress me as big time hitter, very instinctive, disruptive in running game, or exceptional in coverage. The Bills head coach talks about his great speed, but great speed, while commendable for football, does not translate to being a great football player. I'm not saying he's a bust, but long term outlook is inconclusive. Other early pick safeties, like E. Reed and Sean Taylor, clearly demonstrated their star qualities from the get go.

Agreed!

Ngata went to Oregon or Oregon St. and was highly regarded in most circles. He did not dominate as expected in some post season all star games, and I think that is what lowered his grade. From what I read and heard, in regular season in Pac 10, he was dominant, great speed, quickness and strength. Watching Balt's D in game against Indy, he was a force in the middle of the line and showed good lateral movement. I stand by my statement that passing on Ngata to take DW was a mistake.

I agree with you. Ngata was the sensible pick, considering the Bills' needs; you never pass on a big DT (see R. Seymour, V. Wilfork-NE, the two big DTs with Jags, DT with Tenn., notwithstanding his current season's problems). Marv and co. made huge error in judgment, to get a DB who could have been obtained with 3rd round pick- see Pittsburgh and A. Smith from 'cuse- Then to compound that error, they take McCargo, 'cause he was the "3rd best rated DT in draft". Why not take the best in Ngata when you had the chance? You're right the rest of draft was ok, but jury is still out as to how good they actually are.

Absolutely agree with the original post and the above post. Good DL is the basis, then LB and OL...CB and DB are secondary. RB is also in need of immediate upgrade...I'm thinking more along lines of 3 or 4th round pick...there's still good value in those rounds for RB. I'm not totally sold on Willis either, as a long term- 4-5 yeears out- solution to RB.

My take is #8 ranking in pass defense is misleading...teams didn't pass much against Bills, because they could run on them easily, and lack of DL and LB strength was reason for low overall D ranking. I agree with other posts in this thread that we don't need to emphasize CBs and DBs in this off-season, at this stage. You build D from line strength first and foremost. Getting good or supposedly good safeties and CBs did nothing to help the D in critical situations all last year.

Not to pounce on Marv, but I agree that Marv had this team unprepared. Although he landed in HOF, Marv was outcoached in each of SB games...I don't buy the argument that Bills lost to better teams in each of those SBs. Remember that Bills dominated NFC back in '90's in regular season. In 90, they were 3-1 vs. NFC East. They beat the 'boys in Dallas opening day in '93, after losing in SB. Problem in '91 SB was that Marv and his staff never countered the Blitz packages that Bills initially faced against Denver in AFC championship game. If I recall, the Bills playing at home that day did not score an offensive TD in that game, and Denver's D manhandled our O by blitz and tough, physical play. Redskins copied Denver's D tactics in SB and Bills, with Marv in charge, never took appropriate actions (i.e. maximum protection, two TEs, screens, draws, etc. to counter). Bills kept on repeating same plays, four wide-outs, minimum protecton for Kelly play after play and ended in disaster...that loss is totally on Marv, for not responding to the Blitz.

I agree an uprgrade at MLB is needed; we need to get bigger, stronger, and younger at this position. In ideal world, if we had top notch DL, I think Fletcher would be fine, as we had a pretty high rated run D a few years ago when Pat W. and Sam A were here, but Fletch is getting on in years, and from value stand point, it would be hard to justify breaking the bank to re-sign him. So, I would have no problem with Bills drafting a first day LB in draft.

Thanks, everyone. Maybe, I can start by saying that Bills need to build their D with solid linemen, that can hold up against the run and rush the passer...I know it's easier said than done, but if there's ever a question as to whom they should pick in draft, DL or DB, it's a no brainer. Good linemen compensate for average backs, but reverse does not hold. In draft, the Bills need to focus on DL first and foremost. Right now, they only have one decent one in Schoebel, and a few journeymen, backups at all others. If there's a DT at #12, who is round 1 rated, nab him. They also need to sign a good, big run stuffer at DT. In this scenario, they can then move Triplett to DE. If, however, there is a talented pass rushing DE at #12, who is much higher rated than any DT, then can't pass that up, as you can never have enough pass rushers. Part of the major reason why NE has been dominant over past decade is that they have 3 #1 draft picks on their DL. Sad part is that Bills could have had two of them (Warren and Wilfork), if they had not made the deals they did in past. I hope that Levy is aware of his blunder in last draft, for failing to take Ngata when he had the chance, and addresses this issue in FA and draft both. Most important players on any team, in my opinion, are QB and DL. Before I get hammered on this point, I realized that that obviously you need supporting cast, but, most important are those two positions. I think we have QB finally resolved, now we have to get DL in order.

Bills Fans, Long time Bills addict and fan (since '64), have read messages on this board for past several years, those of you who are tech. and computer savy (sp?), please have patience with this older member, who will turn 60 this year. Believe me, nothing more than I would like is to see Bills finally crowned as champs; they were back in mid '60's, but NFL old guard doesn't recognize achievements of those teams...a shame, as I recall the late Paul Christman (old QB from champion NFL cardinals in '47) broadcasting Bills games back in '60's and telling Curt Gowdy, main play by play man, that the DL of the Bills in '64 was best line in pro football. Anyway, enough digressing...focus of off season needs to be both lines and LB corp, as primary needs. I have opinions on what the Bills need to do in later posts...Just want to say hello to everyone and hope this team can get back to playoffs and win it all!! and soon...as I'm not getting any younger. Thanks