JohnC

The owner and hockey franchise have the right strategy in doing a major rebuild. They basically stripped the team of players and starting rebuilding from scratch. It is a painful process that takes time. Without a doubt it can be excruciating to watch. Steadily they are adding young players from their system and from making deals that will ultimately pay dividends. Instead of stagnating for a long time as a middle of the pack type team the franchise made a decision to completely deconstruct in order to reconstruct. If one doesn't have patience then one will be very disappointed. If one has patience then one can see what they are doing and also appreciate what they are doing. In a few years they are going to be one of the top tier teams in hockey. It takes times and wisdom. The HC and OC were working with the worst OL in the league and with the least talented qbing in the league. Scheme and strategy don't trump, and will never trump, a gross lack of talent on offense. I have watched pro football for a very long time. Our OL was constantly overwhelmed not because of the scheme but because too many of the players were incapable and not ready to play at that level. The former unlikeable HC got a very flawed team (on offense) to a 9-7 record. If the team improves it will mostly be due to an upgrade of talent.

The former HC and OC have nothing to do with the limitations of EJ. You can blame the former coaches for Manuel's ineffectiveness but that did not and could not overcome his limitations. Don't be surprised if this new staff comes to the same conclusion regarding his prospects as a franchise qb as the former staff does. We disagree on this issue. I credit Marrone for being decisive in making an obvious determination on EJ while you don't. Cassel is a pedestrian backup at best. He was brought in because the franchise needed a veteran presence at that position. If you believe that he is a legitimate long term franchise starter then you are being very wishful. Tyrod Taylor might become the starter by default. Is he a long term starter? I doubt it. But maybe he can pay dividends. As it stands what the new HC wants out of his starting qb is for him to play intelligently and not set it back. When you have limited players all you can ask them to do is to play within their acknowledged limitations. Your others comments regarding players that the organization brought in don't address what I was discussing i.e. a viable long term franchise qb.

Ozzie Newsome and Ted Thompson are classic GMs who run the football operation. That is the position that Whaley has. I still believe that adding another layer of authority, formal or informal, is a recipe for conflict. Bill Polian is at an age where 80 hr work weeks is simply too strenuous. Also, Polian is a strong-willed person and very combative. If there would be a divergence of opinion between Whaley and his staff with Wild Bill you can be sure that the feathers will fly. If Whaley fails to address the team vulnerabilities such as the qb position and the OL then ultimately he will be held accountable. That is how it should be. Don't be fooled by Pegula's lack of knowledge of football. He is not a wallflower. He invested more than a $1 B in order to be successful on the field. His approach, as exhibited by his ownership of the hockey team, is to allow those who are running the show to do their jobs and then hold them accountable. The regime currently running the hockey team is not the same regime when he bought the franchise. I disagree with your view on Russ Brandon's role with the franchise. He is running the overall business but he is not involved with the football operation. It wasn't that way when Ralph had him take over the football operation after the Levy fiasco. After a year he smartly removed himself from the football side of the business and got involved with managing the overall business. A lot of people are critical of Brandon but I think he is excellent at marketing and managing the organization. Pegula was very wise in keeping RB involved in managing the franchise.

I would be against adding another layer of authority in the management structure of the team. From what I read he was interested in the position while his family was adamantly opposed. They collectively felt that it was time for him at his stage in life and family situation involving the grand kids that he should be lightening up the load instead of adding to the load. He said that while he was enticed by the offer he felt that he owed it to his family that had sacrificed for him to decline the offer. Based on Polian's comments regarding the team's draft I agree with you that if he were in a position of authority he would have insisted and acted on upgrading the qb position. He would have been very much proactive either through the draft or through trade deals to address that long term issue that has plagued this franchise. Anyone who watched him on ESPN commenting on the Bills' qb situation would have noticed the conviction he had and the sadness/disappointment that nothing much has been done to change the situation.

Under the new owner and with a less shackled GM there is a realization that this franchise is more willing to take initiatives that they didn't try before. Whether one agrees with the moves Whaley has taken over the past year and a half there is a less stodgy and staid approach to running the organization that didn't exist before. Now others in the business are taking notice. http://www.si.com/nfl/video/2015/05/05/buffalo-bills-will-be-most-exciting-team-afc-east

Andrew Luck probably is the next highest rated qb prospect, I think? Where Luck may eventually surpass Elway is his mastery of the intellectual side of the game. Although Peyton lacks the arm strength and athleticism of Elway PM is better at reading defenses. I would rate Elway ahead of Peyton in the pantheon of qbs. The teams that Elway made it to the SB with were very pedestrian. He elevated those teams to heights they had no business being at. He was a player that I am very glad finally won a SB, even though at that time he was a shadow of what he used to be

What was seen in last year's training sessions, camp and preseason indicated to the staff that he was lacking. Some people very often imply that Marrone acted out of spite in his rather quick and damning assessment of EJ. I don't buy that notion. Is the staff going to allow EJ to fairly compete on an even handed level? I don't think so. My belief is that especially with what Rex had to deal with Geno Smith last year with the Jets that he is going to be more comfortable relying on an experienced qb such as Cassel rather than trust the rawer young qb. I wouldn't be surprised if Tyrod Taylor becomes the backup with Manuel sliding out of the picture. Your comparison to Jason Cambell is excellent. Excellent physical attributes that don't match on field performances. Good enough to stay in the league as a vagabound backup but not good enough to secure a starting position. Utility as a player but never becomes an essential player that is valued by a franchise.

John Elway. I belatedly noticed that McBride smartly mentioned Steve Young. So I will add a younger version of John Elway before he was beaten up and battered.

There is no doubt that a good qb prospect going to a better team has a better chance to succeed. You can say that about any position player. The most meaningful issue is if he would have been drafted by the Bills or any other team would he be an upgrade for that position or not? Not only would he have been a major upgrade at that position for us but he would have had a positive affect on the offense and the team's performance in general. It's not a stretch to believe that if he was our starting qb last year the Bills would have been in the playoffs, even with its wretched OL. It's not a stretch to believe that with a qb such as Wilson receivers such as Watkins and Wools would have been much more effective. As bad as our OL was having a mobile qb compared to the immobile Orton would have improved the performance of the OL, especially in pass blocking. Drew Brees falls in that stature category.

The qb I was eyeing was Hundley. He would have been a good developmental qb taken at a reasonable spot, fourth round. Whaley's trade for Brown last year in which he gave up a fourth round pick for a player who barely played didn't come close to paying off. Trading up is a good strategy but that isn't an easy task if you don't have trade partners. The primary reason why DM didn't play EJ even when his team was out of the playoffs is because he was pursuing the maximum number of wins over developing a young qb he had no faith in. Many people criticize him for that while I don't. The former HC made a decision very early on that EJ at that point was not ready to play and would probably not ever be a credible starter in this league. While most people are critical of his early judgment on his young qb I'm not.

From where we were drafting no qb available in this draft would not have been a factor for us this year or next. Why reach for a qb that won't be a factor for the next couple of years when next year you will be in a better position with a first round pick to select a better qb prospect. I understand your frustration with the lack of initiative over the past number of years to meaningfully address the qb position. The Levy two years, the Brandon one year and the Nix three years on top of the Whaley short stint gave scant attention to the position. I'm aware that Nix/Whaley drafted EJ in the first round. But in my view they over-reached (maybe out of desperation) in drafting a third round prospect in the first round. One of the reasons for the expression of so much frustration over the qb issue is that most people who follow the team recognize that this franchise is assembling a strong enough roster to be a contending team. On the other hand most people recognize that our current stable of qbs undercuts the overall strength of the roster. That's why the level of frustration is high for so many people. Based on past history the worst thing that Whaley can do is make decisiions out of desperation. If the opportunityh isn't there to accomplish what you want to do then bide you team and act when you are in a better position to do so. That is a sign of organizational maturity. And that isn't a bad organizational attribute to have.

I thought Hundley would have been a good developmental qb for us. The Packers moved up in the fourth round to select him. We didn't have a fourth round pick because last year we used it on a trade for a running back who we rarely used and who might get cut this year. On the other hand as long as Manuel is still being considered as a contender for the position it is understandable why the Bills didn't add another qb to the mix, especially one who falls in the developmental category. I got the sense when I heard Polian make his qb comment that he was underscoring the fact that as it stands our qb situation is very inadequate and that he is sad about that debilitating situation.

He was making the point that our qb situatiion as it stands is dreadful. Most people would agree with that point. If he would have stated which qb he would have taken and where in the draft his qb selection would have been made his comment would have been more interesting. It's apparent that he doesn't consider EJ to be a credible option as a starter.

His evaluations emphasize how a player plays in college over physical attributes. He would select a smaller and slower prospect who is very productive over a player who is more impressive physically but less instictive and pruductive on the field. Where he really shines is getting very good players in the lower half of the first round. I still remember when he traded back into the lower first round to select Flacco. That pick was a very important pick for the consistent success of his team. Because of where his draft board ranked Flacco he didn't take him with his first pick. But he maneuvered back into the lower part of the first round to take Flacco where he had him ranked. He has frequently stated that his approach to the draft is to be true to your board. Watching him make selections is like watching a maestro conducting an orchestra. He has a strategy and he follows it. He's at the top or near the top of his very challenging profession.

I have no problem with our selections. The organization took players the way their board stacked up. That's the right approach to take. As far as Max Williams if Ozzie Newsome took him in the second round then that is a major endorsement of him as a prospect. I believe that Ozzie is at the top or near the top of the GMs in the leauge and one of the best evaluators in the business. .His picks usually aren't dazzling so much as they are consistently good.

When I made the reference to Carr and Bridgewater I was not putting them in the category of elite. I am projecting them to be good middle of the pack franchise qbs. The question I am putting on the table is: Is it better to have a quality franchise qb without an elite receiver or is it better to have an elite receiver and have a game manager type of qb taking the snaps? If you assess the teams that make the playoffs and are serious contenders their level of qbing is substantially higher. We possess AA minor league qbs in a league where teams with major league qbs succeed. For a generation we have not even had a Dalton caliber qb (functional and average) leading the offense. The Bills have an elite defense. With a little more patchwork on the OL it can be ugraded to a respectable level. The organization acquired a big time back this offseason. When all is said and done you get nowhere without a good (not great) qb. We are still in searching.to fill the deficit that has a spill over affect for the whole franchise.

I will be very surprised if the Bills take Petty at #50. In my opinion the more conservative approach of selecting the best offensive lineman is the wisest approach to take and continuing to do their best to upgrade the OL. This team has a stellar defense and they have invested heavily in a prime time back with their trade with Philly. I just don't believe that they will draft a qb with their first pick when the front office and owner desperately want to qualify for the playoffs this year in order to break the ignomineous non-playoff streak. If this team could have made a deal for a qb such as Foles or Bradford this team this year as it is presently constituted would be a team to be reckoned with.

I'm not going to take the other receiver route argument. Regardless of the other high quality receivers abailable I believe that Watkins is the best of that groupings. I would still take him ahead of the others then and now. But a factor relating to Watkins's exceptional talent level is that it will not be maximized until there is a capable qb making the throws. In my view there isn't a qb on our current roster who will allow Watkins (or any other high end receiver) to come close to utilizing their abundant talent level. In my opinion the Bills will not be a serious contending team until there is an above average franchise qb taking the snaps. With our current stable of qbs we are very far from that requirement. Until that issue is addressed the Bills will be a border line playoff team. Would Carr or Bridgewater have been adequate enough qbs for the team to take the next forward step? In my view: Yes.

I very much agree with your commentary. I have defended the Watkins deal. Giving the situation at the time you make decisions on real time knowledge. But that doesn't mean that one can't in hindsight go back and take a "what if" view. As I have stated and you have also often stated many times Watkins is a special top shelf talent. However, from a longer view perspective wouldn't there be a greater impact on a franchise if a qb such as Carr or Bridgewater were taken instead of a dynamic receiver. The next issue is are Carr and Bridgewater franchise qbs? I think they will be. If that is the case then it is not unreasonable to take the position that it would have been better to draft one of the lesser rated qbs instead of the more highly rated player at the receiver position because of the impact and importance of the position. Let's understand what I'm stating here. I'm not denigrating the pick because I very much supported it. All I'm saying is that in looking back would an alternative approach have been a better approach for this franchise?

I respectfully but strenuously disagree with your view that coaching was the main reason why EJ has struggled. Without a doubt it is still early in the assessment process. But in my view he has flaws that are fatal and that no amount of coaching-up can rectify. He is not accurate enough and I have doubts regarding his ability to make the right read and then appropriately react. For me his accuracy level can be improved with better mechanics but in my estimation it will never get to the point of being good enough. EJ Manuel reminds me of Jason Campbell. A long tenured qb who has carved out a respectable and profitable niche as a backup. Not good enough to be a starter but good enough to have on your roster as a reserve qb. I want EJ to succeed. He is a high character person with an impressive work ethic. But I have major doubts about him as our franchise qb. This year you should get a definitive answer as to how the organization views his place within the organization. If Cassell gets the starting nod then that is all you need to know. You have a lot of disdain for Marrone. But that doesn't mean that his evaluation for EJ was wrong. He made a very quick (some would say premature and prejudicial) assessment of EJ's talents and believed that he couldn't win with him. I happen to agree with the unpopular HC on this issue. Cassell is at best an adequate backup qb. Odds are that he is going to be the starter for the new HC because it will give him the best chance to succeed. Ultimately (in my opinion) Rex is going to come to the same conclusion regarding EJ that the former HC that you reviled so much earlier came to.

There are no guarantees of long-term success especially after one season. I'm not declaring that he will develop into an elite qb. But from what I have seen I believe that he will be a better qb than any of our current qbs. I'll say the same about Carr from Oakland. I would take him over any of our qbs. Am I making an early assessment? Of course. I'm comfortable in saying that I would prefer Carr or Bridgewater entering their second year over any of our collection of qbs.

You can use whatever standard you want. For me it is very easy to say that based on his rookie year that Bridgewater is more talented, and will get even better, than any qb currently on our roster. If you don't believe that Bridgewater has more upside than our trio of qbs then that is fine. I disagree with that assessment.

Terry Bridgewater is a better qb than any qb on our roster. He is a legitimate franchise qb. He had a good enough rookie year to indicate that he is worthy of being a starter for the franchise for a very long time. As I have stated very often I believe that Watkins is a dynamic talent. He is the type of talent who would be in the top five of every draft. Would I prefer having a long-term quality starter (not elite) instead of him? Absolutely so.

Just to let you know where I stand I have supported the move to draft him. But in hindsight (that is what we are doing here) would we have been better off trading down and getting an additional pick or so and keeping this year's first pick and then selecting either Bridgewater or Carr as our franchise qb? Would possibly getting our franchise qb last year resolve an issue that has plagued this franchise since the retirement of Kelly and has gone on for litterally a generation. I like both qbs and believe both will be good (not elite) qbs in this league.

I'm not disagreeing with you in regard to your point that factors other than his on the field play contributed to his HOF selection. He was the qb on the first AFL team to beat an NFL team in the SB. That was a pivotal and elevating moment for the AFL. It gave the AFL a boost in its credibility as a league. That surely was an important factor to his Hall selection if not more so than his individual stats. Putting aside his public personality he was a terrific player whose career was plagued by multiple knee injuries and surgeries. There are few players who can be put in the category of iconic players: such as Jimmy Brown, OJ, Payton etc. He, in my opinion, falls in that special category.