JohnC

I respectfully but strenuously disagree with your point that Marrone and Rex are comparable coaches. Even if I concede that Marrone didn't hire a competent OC (I don't agree with that point) the reality is that the OL and qbing were so sub par that no highly regarded OC could have made that offense work. No play is going to work, brilliant or basic play, if the line can't block and the qb with a fading arm is immobile. I submit that if Marrone and whomever he had as OC worked with the additions of Incognito, McCoy, Clay and Tyrod Taylor the offense not only would be better but it would be more creative than it was last year. Hackett in general took a conservative approach in order to not make mistakes and turn the ball over. As infuriating as it was to fans considering what he had to work with his Jauron approach to offense was a reasonable approach to take. There are fair criticisms to be made against Marrone. But anyone who is fair-minded has to acknowledge that the team always played hard for him (even when it was over matched) and the team never quit for his as it has done for Rex, especially on defense. In my view Marrone simply was a better coach than the glib Rex.

Marrone left on his own volition so it is futile to discuss his departure. But what I will say about him and believe it is a fair analysis about his tenure is that he did more with less talent than Rex who did less with more talent. DM made a very early unfavorable assessment on EJ that proved to be right. He also made an early unfavorable assessment on Kujo that also proved to be right. On those two players both coaches agreed with each other. I bring up these two players because DM was skewered for not giving these players enough opportunity. In the end what he saw in each player materialized. It's difficult to make a fair judgment on a two year coaching stint. However, Doug Marrone took over a team that was in a rebuild mode. In his first year the team won 4 games. The next year the team won 9 games (some say 8) even though their offense was far from being adequately staffed, especially on the OL and at qb. Doug Marrone was a tough coach. He strictly held the players accountable. A lot of players didn't like him for his tough stance. But they always played hard for him. Compare that to what is going on now. Especially on defense this is a fractured team, a team that is in a free fall. My point is simple. Although Doug Marrone was unlikable he was a better coach than the more likable current coach. The bottom line is it is about the bottom line. Without any hesitation I would take the former dour coach over the present loquacious coach.

There are much bigger issues regarding Rex as a deficient coach that have little to do with his inability to bring in aging veteran players to teach his "system". Rex's record as a coach in NY was a losing record. By the time he got fired the team he was instrumental in assembling and coaching was in chaos. When you describe the character of a Rex coached team one word that won't be associated with it is discipline. Another word not associated with a Rex coached team is intelligence. Another word not associated with his teams is maturity. People are now bringing up hypothetical issues such as "what if this" and "what if that" in order to explain the stunning descent of a team. What has happened with the Bills should not have been a surprise. The same destructive cycle happened in NY. Our organization enthusiastically hired a failed HC that another organization was relieved to get rid of. Rex didn't have a successful tenure in NY. He had a cumulative losing record. Yet the Bills' organization found him to be an appealing candidate based on an impressive interview. Just think about it. A bullshiiiit interview proved to be more persuasive than a six year losing record ending in chaos The Jets are now a stabilized organization under a stolid but professional coach. This year they weren't subjected to the circus act that always surrounds this attention grabbing hound dog coach. When one of their marginal players punched their qb in the locker room and broke his jaw the Jets immediately responded by cutting him. Our clown coach immediately added him to the roster. That's the type of thuggish and dump player that appeals to this fool coach. The bottom line is that the Rex Ryan that we now got is the Rex Ryan we brought in.

Of course the systemic failure of the organization is a complicated issue going beyond a mediocre HC. However, just because he isn't totally to blame for this failed season doesn't mean that he shouldn't be held accountable for his contribution to it. I agree with you that I don't think he is going to be dismissed. That isn't something that I would celebrate over!

You are absolutely right. I never liked the Rex hire. I didn't like him in NY and my preconceived thoughts about his competency have been realized, sad to say. A Rex Ryan coached team is not known for its discipline. The Bills are one of the most penalized teams in the league. You may be surprised by what is happening but I am not. A Rex Ryan coached team is not known for its collective intelligence. You may be surprised how often our players do stupid things on the field that can be crushing but I am not. This is certainly not a "grassy knoll" type of conspiracy against him. It is about actually watching the games in which he is coaching and in real time witnessing how things are transpiring. This is about performances that is being displayed for everyone to see and the record, which is the ultimate measurement of success and failure in this sport. You may be impressed by him but I am not. You may not find him accountable for the stunning descent of a team that was expected to be in the hunt for a wildcard playoff team but I do. What excuses are you going to come up with to explain this season? Are you going to blame the PSI levels of the balls we use? Are you going to blame the officiating? Are you going to blame the scheduling? You are right I never liked the Rex hire. It made no sense to me. When you hire a huckster you get a huckster. Watch the games more closely and you will better understand what I am talking about.

The Jets participated in the same draft and free agency that the Bills participated in. The team that the Jets have now made subtractions and additions to their roster just as we did. The roster that Rex worked with this year in Buffalo was an upgrade from the Marrone coached team he departed from. Again, the point is obvious. The team that Rex coached and assembled in NY was in a shambles when he departed. In his first year on the job in western NY the team that he is working with is currently in a shambles. The pattern is obvious and disturbing.

An interesting question is what was Whaley's input on the hire? Was he for it, have qualms, express doubts or simply acquiesce to the desires of the new owners who he didn't want to ruffle? Whaley certainly is familiar with the community of coaches in the league. Rex was a known quantity and had his own style of doing business. Considering that Rex had an extended stay in NY Whaley had to have a very good idea of what he was in for. I would love to know what he was really thinking at the time.

How did Rex do in his last year in NY? He left the team in a shambles. He took over a team that certainly had flaws but was on upswing. Now the second team he presided over is coming apart at the seams See a pattern?

Great Posts as usual Bill, Rex was fired by the Jets. He left the team in shambles. With mature and intelligent coaching the Jets regrouped and are now a serious playoff contending team. Addition by subtraction. With great fanfare Rex was hired. In his first year on the job a team that was on the upswing is now in a state of chaos. What was the attraction of him as a HCing candidate? I having figured it out yet. Subtraction by addition. Decisions have consequences. You get what you deserve to get. Have a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

I'm not blaming Whaley. How many times do I have to call this bullshiiit artist a huckster in order to know where I stand in this situation. This situation is a mess. Whether Whaley is the GM or not (I believe he will be back next year) the core of the problem will not be resolved until there is a more serious HC on the sidelines. I don't care who the GM is as long as Rex is the HC (I also believe he will be back) this team is going to be mired in the muck of mediocrity. The organization that has to be amused with our situation is the Jets. It's called addition by subtraction. As I stated in my original post the reverberations of that foolish/weird hire is on display. Most often when you make a dumb decision you get what you deserve!

There should be no surprise if the supposedly Whaley job status is true. Whenever a team underachieves relative to its expectations their is going to be in-house back lashing. The GM is naturally going to take the position that the players he provided are not being used properly and the HC is going to take the position (directly or indirectly) that the players he were provided with were not suitable to what he wanted to do. The same tumultuous process is happening in Indy, Cleveland, Detroing and St. Louis. Losing is an outcome that is going to cause in internal conflict and result in staffing changes. In my opinion the Rex Ryan hire was a disaster. What is starting to boil up here happened with much more intensity in Rex's last year in NY. I can't say for sure how influential Whaley was in the Rex hire. At this point it really doesn't matter. There is an obvious disconnect between Whaley's vision and Rex's vision on how a team should be constructed. That can't go on much longer. If Whaley is disappointed it is not primarily because of how the offense is being run. The disappointment comes from the defensive side of the ball. It took a dramatic fall under the new HC. Now there is public talk that this defense has to go through a dramatic personnel change in the offseason to accommodate the HC's defensive philosophy. Do you think Whaley is happy about such a major overhaul on that side of the ball? The Ryan hire was a foolish hire. The reverberations are starting to appear. When you hire a huckster to be your HC and give him a rich and long contract don't expect tranquility. Eventually there are going to be casualties. I hope it isn't Whaley but without a doubt he is vulnerable.

I caught the last two periods on TV (Center Ice Package). The Buffalo announcers stated that they were the right calls. Risto high sticked the player in the face, there was a tripping/holding penalty by Gorges in front of the ref and there was an obvious cross checking penalty by Frazen in front of the goal crease. There was a hooking penalty called in OT against a Chicago player. It was a phantom call. When it was replayed the Buffalo announcers chuckled that there was nothing there to be called. What was obvious in the two periods that I watched is that the Sabres kept up with the Blackhawks and were for most of the game a comparable team. The difference was that when Chicago needed to turn their offense up a notch they had that extra gear to do so. Chicago's Kane was the best player on the ice. He was so dynamic that he was mesmerizing to watch. Wow!

I never understood what he had to offer as a candidate for the HCing job. He had a cumulative losing record. His last year was a disaster. The team was in shambles. Was it all his fault? It's never totally one person's fault when a team fails but no one can say that he wasn't an instrumental person in the operation of the team. Don't accept the argument that the players on his roster added through the draft and free agency weren't the players he wanted, because they were. If anyone was going to describe a Rex Ryan coached team one word that wouldn't be associated with it is discipline. Another word not associated his team is intelligence. That certainly has been exhibited in his first year in western NY. There is no doubt that Rex was impressive when interviewing for the job. He is a charmer and is glib enough to say what you want to hear. The focus of his candidacy should have been on his record and performance in NY. With that record it becomes obvious that his tiresome bluster doesn't come close to matching his performance. The discussion regarding schemes and the necessity to find players who are a better fit doesn't hit the mark when discussing the issue of Rex's competency. What he has demonstrated as a coach is that he was incapable of adapting and adjusting to the situation he was in because he lacked the wherewithal to do so. The NFL of today is noted for its challenging environment of rapid change in personnel and circumstances. He has an old school approach to the football world of today that requires a receptivity toward new and different ideas. Being satisfied with what you as a HC might be comfortable with is inadequate for today's NFL of rapid change. The Pegulas hired Rex and gave him a rich five year contract. The Rex they now have is the authentic Rex. And that is why I am so frustrated with this peculiar hire. You can't blame others for your own self-inflicted wounds!

Let's be accurate.I never said sole reason. I said primary reason.

The reason why most people have the same perspective is that it is freaking obvious what this fool did to sabotage this season. Determining what the primary reason for this regression is not much of a mystery. There was a good opportunity to be seized here this season. Each season in the NFL is a separate challenge. There are no guarantees. When you are in a good position to take advantage of a situation and you squander it due to incompetence it is understandable why many people are irritated.

I can guarantee it that Rex in his interview with the owners and the GM didn't tell them that he was going to take their top tier defense and alter the style of play that would accentuate the players's weaknesses and and diminish their strengths. Without a doubt he expounded on how he knew defenses and that he would make this very good defense even better. The Pegulas were not equipped to discuss football topics related to schemes and philosophy. Rex is very glib and has an expansive personality. As an employee candidate he was much more appealing to work with than the dour former HC who to put it mildly lacked interpersonal skills. I understand why the Pegulas found him appealing. But acing an interview is acing an interview. He had a six year record in NY that was not stellar. He left the Jets in shambles. The Pegulas did not properly do their "due diligence" with this respective hire. To be blunt I had little regard for Rex when he was with the Jets and was very troubled when he was hired for the job in western NY. I consider him to be a self-promoting huckster who lacks the intelligence and flexibility to smartly adjust in a job that requires adjustment to changing circumstances. Words that have never been associated with Rex are discipline and smart. I did not expect Rex to take the players he inherited and apply schemes that took them out of their comfort zone to the extent that he did. He made players such as Dareus, Mario and collectively the LBs conform to his comfort zone by taking them out of their comfort zone. You need to recall that Dareus was such an interior force last year that he earned him a gilded contract. In Rex's scheme he was a shell of himself. Mario was a pass rushing force that opposing teams had to account for. His presence on the field positively impacted his line mates because he received so much attention. This season on the field he was invisible. Let's remember that Rex was present with the team when they participated in last year's draft and free agency period. The staffing on the defensive side of the ball barely changed. The first pick was used for Darby, a CB. The defensive lineup stayed the same. If he was so determined to change the scheme then there should have been more personnel changes on the defense to accommodate his scheme. I'm not talking about brilliant football minds here. I'm talking about the lack of common sense. A dumb person tried to outsmart others. That is a recipe for failure. The outcome was predictable. The Pegulas are mostly to blame for hiring this huckster. If you asked the Pegulas if it would have been smart to hire someone who would take an asset (the defense) and make it a turd they would have said no. They certainly expected that this glib talking and jovial personality to use a little more common sense. Ultimately they made the hire and they got what they deserved. Rex is Rex. And that is exactly what they got.

I have no problem with rebuilding the defense. That isn't the issue. This year he had a set of players on defense to work with and didn't put them in a position to accentuate their assets. Instead, he put the players he had in a position to fail. That isn't smart coaching. I agree that Mario and KW will both be gone next year because of cap reasons and scheme fit reasons. However, I still strongly believe that this team as it was constituted this year should be in the playoffs. Compared to its talent level this team underachieved. That is very much attributed to a coaching failure. Barely making the playoffs is not a be all and an end all. But it is something to build on, especially for a team that has not participated in the post season for a generation. When you have an opportunity to accomplish that minimal achievement I would have preferred that this loud coach acted more smartly and seized the opportunity. He didn't. That is disappointing and infuriating.

What the loud HC did with the roster he inherited on defense is not too difficult to figure out. It's like a marathon runner who excels at long distance contests. Rex would enter him in a sprint race. It's like having a sprint runner who excels in short races. Rex would enter him in a Marathon. There are good baseball hitters who are suited to bat at the top of the order. Rex would probably have that light hitting contact hitter batting fourth. There are power runners who productively run straight-line and inside the tackle. Rex would use that type of back for sweeps and scat back assignments. In warfare it would be suitable to use tanks in open desert field battles. Rex would use tanks in a guerrilla war fought in a dense jungle. Rex is the type of person who if he had Donald Trump as an employee he would assign him to negotiate a settlement in a complicated Mideast multi-country war. If Donald Trump asked Rex to set him up for a blind date. Rex would give him Rosie O'Donnel's number and be confident that it was a good match. For Rex it is not about the fit. When you have a scheme you are married to the scheme, no matter what. As Forest Gump has smartly stated: Stupid is as stupid does!

The coach is going to be back and the GM is going to be back. As you know very well I don't have much regard for Rex. I consider him to be a self-promoting huckster who at best is a mediocre HC. However, the unappealing reality is that he is coming back. I'm a Whaley supporter. Overall, I believe he has done a solid job. Has he made mistakes? He certainly has but so has every GM in the game, especially GMs who are not afraid to make moves in order to get better. My fear in this upcoming offseason is that the current HC will be given a greater say in personnel matters. If you think he has done damage in handling the talent he inherited wait and see how much damage he can do if he is more influential in selecting players. This is a guy who left a franchise in shambles at the end of his tenure in NY. Don't believe the false claim that he didn't select the players he had to work with in NY. He was very instrumental in assembling that roster. The Pegulas are not rash in the way they run their sports businesses. But they are not afraid to make tough decisions. Whatever changes that are going to be made regarding the front office or the coaching staff won't be done this offseason. The offseason following this one is going to be the make or break time for the front office and coaching staff or both.

Who would have predicted prior to last season that the Mets would have been in the World Series? As the Mets demonstrated success in baseball is very much predicated on pitching and in the NFL success is very much predicated on the qb. As I have gotten older I have been more intrigued by the caliber of organizations and its management styles in all the major sports. There is no one approach that is inherently successful but the difference between good and bad organizations is very evident. St. Louis in baseball, San Antonio in basketball, New England in the NFL demonstrate that with good management you get more sustained success on the playing field. Franchises that have the most financial resources don't always succeed. Toronto and the Maple Leafs support that point in hockey, NY and the Knicks in the NBA and Washington and the Redskins in the NFL.Under the prior owner Buffalo and the Bills were in an altogether different category. With the Pegulas in football we won't always win but they will strive to be winners.

My soul is not crushed but the entertainment value is declining. The NFL games in general are a tough watch. Excessive penalties and little flow to the game have diminished the product. I'm starting to become more interested in the Sabres. You can see the rebuilding plan being smartly implemented and progress being made. If there is something to be optimistic about it is that I believe the Pegulas are good owners. They are committed to their teams (and the community) and will eventually get things done.

I salute your dedication. The regular cycle of mediocrity is wearing me down a tad. The hiring of Rex infuriated me so what followed was not surprising to me.

Most people point out that Mario is a disappointment. And that is the case, obviously so. But the player who has been castrated by this change in scheme is Dareus. He was a standout last year. He was one of the best DTs in the league at providing pressure up the middle. That's why he garnered such a large contract. He is now a shell of what he was the prior year.Coaching matters! In hindsight I wish Schwartz would have been named the HC. He would have exercised more intelligence and common sense. When you have dumb people trying to outsmart others you are asking for trouble. We got exactly what we got!

You are deliberately missing the point because it doesn't comport with your view. Buffalo has had injuries, more so on the offensive side of the ball. That is acknowledged. But that isn't what is being stressed here. Our defense has been relatively healthy. Kyle Williams is out for the season but there was still some adequate depth behind him. The stark difference is that players such as Mario, Dareus (and even Kyle Williams when he played) and the LBers have played poorly compared to how they performed under the prior regime. The noticeable decline isn't primarily due to them being lesser players but it is the direct result that they were playing in a system that accentuated their weaknesses instead of playing to their strengths. Our offense as it was constituted was not going to be a prolific offense. It didn't need to be. Everyone is aware of that, including the organization. What was required for this team to have a successful season was for the defense to play at a near or even lesser level that it did in the prior two years. It didn't. It took a dramatic fall that precluded this team from having a serious chance to be a serious team. You can be annoyed all you want. But the truth of the matter is that this dopey HC felt it was more important to adhere to his time-tested scheme that worked for him at other places with different players instead of taking an approach that less adhered to the scheme he was comfortable with and more suited to the players he inherited. This team, especially on defense, underachieved relative to its talent level. This season has been squandered because the loud coach who was hired with much fanfare demonstrated how mediocre of a coach he really is. The organization got what they brought in. They deserve what they got. I can assure you that the Jets are very happy and relieved that this self-promoting obnoxious huckster is working on the western end of the state.

You make excuses why the Bills lose and then follow it up with making excuses why other teams win. The Bills are not a complete team. Neither are most teams. The front office took the right approach this offseason in bolstering the offense with the acquisitions of Incognito, Clay, McCoy and Miller compared to the attention he defense got this offseason. Although there weren't many transactions to improve the already highly effective defense the team used its first pick in the draft to select a CB who is in contention to be a defensive rookie of the year. We went into the season with a better OL (although still problematic) with the addition of Incognito who is playing at an all-pro level. The major impactful addition was the unexpected emergence of TT. TT is demonstrably better than the immobile Orton in his ability to throw and run. Not many people expected him to be as good as he has been. My point is that this was an upgraded team that RR took over. To be a wildcard playoff team this team needed the defense to play near the level of the prior two years. However, the drop off of our defense has been dramatic. Has the defense sustained injuries that set it back? Somewhat. But not beyond a level that most teams endure. The last DC very adroitly rotated linemen. So there was some depth there. The dramatic decline in the defense's performance has to do with the altering of the scheme that affected the play of its players, especially Dareus, Mario and the LBs. It was the DC's decision to install his scheme before he had the players that were more suited for the scheme he preferred. That was not an intelligent approach to take especially considering that our team was in a good position to make the playoffs for the first time in a generation. That goal is not an end goal but it is something to build on. I have said it before and I will say it again with great conviction: The Jets are a better team without the loud former HC and we are a worse team with him. As much as the dour Marrone is criticized he did more with less while Rex did less with more. When Rex took over the Bills were still a work in progress but with an upward trajectory. RR has taken this franchise backwards in his foolhardy attempt to move forward. This franchise has handcuffed itself with its own stupidity. You are entitled to your opinion that Rex is a good coach. But in my view when a team underachieves relative to its talent level the coach is a failure.