JohnC

Over the years the Bills have had plenty of opportunities to draft a reasonable qb prospect. And not all of the opportunities were in the first round. You do your due diligence and within reason take action. No one is suggesting that the Bills should do anything crazy and act for the sake of acting. The Bills have placed themselves in a good position for this draft. If not now then when?

When you are driving and focus too much on the rear view mirror instead of looking forward you are more likely to crash. It doesn't matter if this regime has failed for a half a dozen consecutive times to draft for a franchise qb. You have to keep trying. The draft position that the Jets moved up to allows them to take any one of the top three qbs in this draft class and have it work out well for them. Just keep swinging. Sometimes the ball accidently hits the bat. It's still recorded as a hit.

If you are too afraid to swing at the ball you will never hit it. If you are not going up to the plate to swing the bat then stay on the bench and spit out your pumpkin seeds. What's worse then failing is not trying.

The Jets have made some big mistakes with their qb selections. That's obvious and that's history. They shouldn't be criticized for making a rich investment in another attempt to get their long-term franchise qb. For their determination I applaud them. The Bills are probably going to copy them in making their own robust effort to get a long-term franchise qb. If they do that as most people assume I applaud it.

We really don't disagree as much as it may seem. There are plenty of different evaluations on the top tier prospects. You and others may have a negative view on Allen while others have the opposite view. Bandit is much more optimistic on Allen's prospects than Gunner. And both of them have good eyes when evaluating prospects. With respect to Allen I'm aware that he requires more developmental time than some of the other prospects. That doesn't bother me at all. If it takes a couple of years to get acclimated to the pros then so be it. I'm not excluding a talented player just because he wouldn't have an immediate impact.. In my opinion the two most pro ready qbs are Rosen and Mayfield. What I have said on a number of posts is that I am open to a variety of candidates. Whether the Bills make a dramatic move up the board or stand pat to select a qb I'm open to the approach.. While you are more adverse to Allen for the reasons you stated I'm less reluctant to take a chance on him with a first round pick. Although he wouldn't be at the top of my list he would still be on my list to draw from if that is how this draft unfolds.

There is a major difference between the Buffalo situation and the Cowboy situation. The Bills haven't had a legitimate franchise qb for nearly a quarter century. The Cowboys had a legitimate franchise qb for more than a decade prior to drafting Prescott. If drafting a qb isn't a priority for the Bills then when is it? If you are arguing that the Bills should wait on the qb issue then your position is apparently contra to the position that this regime appears to be taking. If you are arguing that it is more important to draft a back higher than a qb then that is an absurd position to take for this franchise. If you want to wait on this issue then wait all you want. Just don't be surprised that while waiting at the bus stop it blows by you without stopping. If your destination is the road to nowhere just keep putting the priority off.

Do these supplements really help? Or is it simply the users believe it does and are willing to take a risk for whatever advantage, even if it is miniscule. And are there clean supplements that work as well as banned supplements? Does a hard working athlete who eats well have a real disadvantage to an athlete who works as hard and eats as well but also takes banned supplements?

The pervasive draft talk on the football board has spilled over to the hockey board..

I don't understand the argument that by having a redshirt year in the pros that it is a strike against you. Goff and Mahomes didn't play much in their rookie years. For Goff that year mostly spent on the bench not only didn't hurt him but it enhanced his preparation. The mostly bench year for Mahomes allowed him to understudy to the point that the KC staff felt that he was ready to take over for their established qb. Dak Prescott certainly wasn't a polished prospect when he was drafted in the fourth round. Yet he was able to fairly quickly adapt to the pro game. When taking a calculated risk on a qb you have to consider not only his physical tools but also his personal qualities. If the prospect is a worker and is receptive to coaching then it's worth the gamble. Few would argue with you that Rosen is more of a finished product than Allen. On the other hand few can argue that Allen is more mobile and more durable than Rosen. Would I draft Rosen over Allen? Yes. But if my preferred option wasn't available then I would have no qualms taking Allen as a good option with the potential to end up being the best option. Going back to the Prescott analogy Allen is no less a prospect than Prescoot was coming out of college. (Most people would say he is a better prospect.) If he turns into a comparable player then who could say that it was a risk not worth taking.? The mistake made when evaluating qbs is that the issue shouldn't be what round you have him graded at. The issue is whether the qb has the potential to develop into a franchise qb. If you believe the answer is yes then drafting the qb prospect higher than his grade is the right thing to do. Dak Prescott and Russell Wilson clearly demonstrate that point. Allowing perfect to be the enemy of doing good is a self-sabotaging philosophy to take when making a decision on a qb.

If you like Rudolph but prefer either Rosen or Mayfield then the question is whether it would be worth it to move up to get one of the qbs you like better or stay at 12 and get Rudolph and still have a full complement of picks? If either Rosen ,Mayfield or Allen slides then the price for moving up becomes less costly. My feeling is if you have a conviction on a qb or two then be aggressive. If there isn't much disparity in rankings then be less aggressive or simply wait for the draft to come to you. It's not an easy call. If I had to guess right now I would say that the Bills are targeting Rosen and Allen. If a reasonable deal can be made then I see the Bills making the move for one of them.

Gunner, Bandit and Bloke are terrific. What I find most interesting is not when they usually agree but when they have fundamental differences. I believe that it is Bandito who embraces Josh Allen more than the other two stalwarts. On this issue I lean toward the Bandit.

I was responding in jest because Gunner has also not been reluctant to go against the grain.

Are you talking about Gunner? If the criticisms get too heated he puts on his worn out raincoat and gets lost in the crowd at the neighborhood pub.

I don't believe the Bills would take Rudolph ahead of the top four (not including Jackson). Then the issue is If you liked Rudolph and were afraid to wait to take him with the 22nd pick because you feared another team taking him then is he worth taking at 12? I would say yes because you are keeping your high picks and should come out of this draft with players to address other needs. If you don't have much regard for Rudolph then taking him at 12 is going to negatively skew your perception of the draft. But if you believe that in time that he can be a franchise qb (as I do) then it wouldn't be a bad strategy to take. My approach to the qb position isn't so much about the grade (round) attached to the prospect. If a qb has a second round grade but is projected to be capable of being a franchise qb then over-drafting a round makes sense to me. In this draft the Bills have many options to take. Staying pat and getting a bone fide prospect and being able to fill out a thin roster isn't a losing proposition, it is a winning proposition. I'm open to however this regime is willing to take on this draft with the unyielding condition that it comes out of this draft with a good qb prospect. For me selecting Rudolph at the 12 spot is a reasonable approach to take.

Draft talk again only in a different sport. You know you have an inadequate team/s when the draft overwhelms discussion of the team/s.

I agree with you that collectively the receiving corps is mediocre. As it stands the Bills don't have a number one receiver on the roster. In my mind Benjamin will never be a number #1 receiver but he can be a good number #2. This tall receiver who has a history going back to his college days of never being in the best shape has an incentive to being more fit because he is playing for a contract. So the incentive is there to come into camp prepared. Without question Zay was a disappointment last season but he was playing hurt all season long. He was too productive in college to fall off the clip like he did in his rookie year. So I believe he also has an incentive especially considering his troubling and perplexing offseason behavior to prove something. If you add in Clay to the mix he has always been productive even when playing with a deteriorating knee. I'm not arguing that the Bills have an elite group of receivers. That would be a ridiculous thing to say. But I do believe that this group can be functional. I also think that McCarron's skill set compared to TT's is more suitable to improve the production for the receivers. (I'm not saying he is better or worse. I'm saying that he would be better running an offense that increases the production of this group.)There are so many positions that need upgrading that functionality is the best we can hope for right now.

I'm far from fatigued. This has been the most exciting and anticipated draft for a long time. Not only is it intriguing to watch what we will do but it is also inextricably linked to what the teams above us will be doing. There is a list of high end qb prospects each with different attributes. That's also what makes this draft exciting. All the qbs in question have different skill sets. How the Bills rate the prospects is probably not how the other teams rate the prospects. There are so many different options to explore. What makes this year unique for Bills fans is even though we are not currently near the top of the draft there isn't a team that has as much draft capital as we have. So in almost all the qb talk we are in the middle of the discussions. How much more exciting can that be? If you think about it the staging point for the qb discussion began last year when the Bills traded down with the Chiefs. Since then the table has been set as to how the Bills will maneuver in this upcoming draft. Mr Barbarian you may be exhausted but my juices are flowing with this draft talk. Although I wish there was more talk about the other positions that will be addressed.

You present a good historical record of what transpired in that draft year in which Donahoe sought Roethlisberger. It didn't work out as planned as many drafts are apt to do. That isn't what has marred this franchise thereafter. It has been an inability to find a quality franchise qb. There are years when it was just out of our hands and the chips didn't fall in our favor for a variety of uncontrollable reasons. However, when the lack of success in securing a franchise qb through the draft, free agency or trade stretches for two decades then that is an systemic organizational failure. And it is inexcusable. What no one can say is that the Bills haven't had opportunities. They either made bad choices or let them pass. I still can't figure why Whaley was so passive on this issue. It made no sense. And without question it was a factor why his tenure was abruptly ended. What is obvious is that this new regime is focused on getting a high end prospect from this draft. They clearly have made multiple moves to position themselves to secure a more than credible prospect. No one can say for sure whether things will work out as planned but at least you see the effort. It hasn't always been that way. That's why I am very optimistic about this draft. As far as I'm concerned this is still a multi-year rebuild. But the most important element to the rebuild is getting a legitimate franchise qb. I see it happening this year.

I agree with you. The position I stated can also apply to the Jets. They positioned themselves to get one of the qbs on their preferred list. If their list included Darnold, Rosen, Allen and Mayfield from where they are they will get one of them. Was it too costly to make the deal? I don't think so because they should be able to come out of this draft with a franchise qb. For the Bills right now it makes more sense to wait and see how the draft actually unfolds. It appears that Beane is exploring preliminary deals with the teams ahead of us. He then will wait to see where his targeted qb/s will fall. Why make a more costly deal with the Giants when a less costly deal can be made with the Colts, Denver and Tampa that will still meet our need?

If you have identified three qbs who you believe can be franchise qbs for you then you have more flexibility. The big gamble is staying at the 12 spot and waiting to see which qb falls in your lap. You may end up waiting at the altar while the expected bride is shacking up at the hotel with her real love object. However, if you maneuver yourself into the 5-9 spot you are hedging your bets and increasing the odds of getting a qb that meet your needs. The point is that this isn't an all or nothing proposition. There are some very good options that can be taken.

The attach link is an SI article based on an interview of Jordan Palmer who worked with Darnold and Allen when he was working with them together. There are a number of people who are reluctant to use a high pick on Allen. I'm not one of them. https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/04/06/jordan-palmer-sam-darnold-josh-allen

I know what the definition of prodigy is without having to look it up in the dictionary.

What is authentic is the reaction of the prospect and their family whether it is in the Blue Room or at home when the call is made. Many of the prospects came out of challenging situations.Through talent and hard work they defied the long shot odds to get the call that few get. Whether the player came out of difficult circumstances or favorable circumstances, like the Mannings, Longs and McCaffrey. the one thing they have in common is the incredible effort they put in to be where they are. .

We have heard plenty of speculation that Buffalo is targeting Allen. We have also heard that other teams are targeting Allen. However, we really don't know if that is true. You will get no argument from me that the people who favor Allen are doing it based on physical attributes more than performance. My position is I prefer the other top three over him but I'm open to all the high candidates.

The new regime came in and assessed what they had. What did you expect them to do right away? They dealt Kane for what they could get and they made minor roster changes. They have some young players in the pipeline and some players who might be ready such as Nylander. There will be roster changes such as Lehner not being retained but most of the departures will be secondary players. Botterill is an organizational man who believes in developing talent and not rushing the process. Without a doubt this season was a major disappointment. The heart of the matter is that there is a lack of talent and the manner in which the roster is built is flawed, simply too slow and sluggish. I'm not as pessimistic as many but realize this isn't a quick fixer upper project. My optimism is based in my belief in Botterill. He is the right person to lead the organization.