The Big Cat

Don't be inaccurate. They were 30th last year, they're 29th this year: http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/three-and-out-percentage/2016/ In the 18 games under Roman, however, they were the worst.

Hyperbole? Yeah, a little bit. A stretch? Not really:

At what point in this conversation did I indicate that the run defense was anything resembling good? Please. Tell me. Now: please also tell me if you truly believe that may be JUST MAY BE the run defense that was SUDDENLY suspect might have been--I DON'T KNOW--somewhat compromised by the fact that the offense had zero drives of more than seven plays until garbage time. Let me put it to you another way: The run defense was poor on Sunday because of poor technique and because they got beat up front. The run defense got its skulled kicked in on Sunday because the offense kept putting them back on the field. The former surrendered 6 points. The latter 22. Now. Tell me: which one resulted in the Bills losing teh football game?

I'm pointing to the drive charts as clear and present evidence that the offense did not do enough to win. It's not total stats, it's a visualization of how the game progressed. Nobody has pointed to anything to show that--in the games Buffalo has lost--Tyrod was good enough. This goes all the way back to last year.

Yeah, those three points crushed us. So did the other three they got from the only other drive they put together in the first half. What a !@#$ing joke some of these takes are.

That'll pretty much do it for this season. As we witnessed Sunday, they got precisely jack squat coming up behind him. I harped on it last year too: safety remains a need for this team. They will struggle without him. And idiots will blame Rex.

May be you can define "the defense sucked for the most part" I posted the drive charts. They show: Miami had 10 drives (not counting the two and one play drives to end both halves), 7 of 6 plays or fewer. Two of the three long drives resulted in a total of six points. Meanwhile: The Bills had 11 drives 9 of which ended in 6 plays of fewer. One of the ones that didn't was in "garbage time" So, help me understand how the defense giving up three long drives out of 10 is "bad" particularly when it resulted in a whopping 13 points. Then also help me understand how, with three minutes to go in the fourth quarter, the offense having only run 19 plays in the second half didn't contribute to the unwinding of the defense late in the game. Nobody talked about this in 2014 because it wasn't an issue in 2014. With Orton playing QB we didn't experience these kind of dry spells. Oh! You found the Raider game! Golly Goo! Then the epidemic of three and outs that has plagued the Bills for the last season and a half means nothing. Right, got it.

You knew it was coming because you watched an offense that couldn't sustain anything and you witnessed, first hand, how it caused the defense to wilt. Then you regretted knowing you'd hear about it. That's how it happened. Also, if the defense was so gassed after the opening drive, how did they manage to hold on five of the next six? Doesn't really add up, does it? And if you've never heard me be critical of the defense, then your memory is more selective than I could have possibly imagined. But to refresh it, here's one: when you have your opponent dead to rights on third and long in the fourth quarter and the QB heaves a wounded duck that underthrows the receiver by six yards and you're right there to make the play: MAKE THE !@#$ING PLAY AND DON'T GIVE UP A TOUCHDOWN. How's that?

CAN OVERCOME A FOUR POINT DEFICIT Come on, John.

Wow. I don't even know what to say to this. I can't tell if it's an unwillingness to accept that flat, empirical data, or if it's just because it's coming from me. But either way it's kinda sad?

Stopped him from scoring. But more importantly: do you understand the correlation that this demonstrated inability to produce on offense has to the defense? is it really hard to piece together how one leads to the other? The defense gave up ONE long drive in the second half. The offense had 5 drives of three plays or less in the second half. Understood that one of them went for a TD. But it was a one play drive. And when the D had to go BACK on the field, then they coudln't get off. Why is this very simple concept treated as raving lunacy around here?

That's no. 1001 on the list of 1000 things that could have turned this game around.

WHOA WHOA WHOA Want to know why a 200 pound back had a day? Are we still having difficulty with the idea of complementary football?

The fact that you keep harping on Jabari Greer means you're woefully incapable of understanding reality on its own terms. I'm fully aware of what Greer did after the Bills. He did it seven years ago. The activity of the FO in those days has NOTHING to do with what's happened in the last three years. Why is this so hard for you to understand?

My schtick is never say anything? That's rich. Explain that to my wife. And no that wasn't the question. But true to YOUR schtick which you've already been called out for in the thread, you posited something that never happened, ran with it, and drew a bunch of wild conclusions which you treated like absolutes. Speaking of schticks, didn't hear much from you during the month Shady dominated. Anyways, here's something I'll say, the question was what evidence is there that--as you asserted--both Browns are likely to let walk and create holes and needs. You said Jabari Greer. That **** was hilarious. Then you asked what evidence is there they won't be let go. That's a fair question, but to anyone who's been paying attention since DW took over it's a little odd, since the answers are obvious. Aquisitons or retentions or restructures which he's been responsible for since taking over which have not required finding replacements and have enabled signing other non hole creating players: Dareus, KW, Clay, NRC, AW, TT, Glenn, Incognito, Wood, Hughes All more relevant than Jabari !@#$ing Greer. Now this is also all to satisfy your tangential premise that PB SHOULD be kept. I'm not even of the mind that he needs to be and that his departure wouldn't be as calamitous as your need for it to be would.

Still blaming Whaley for Jabari Greer?

to be entirely honest, i wasn't sure we even had a GM when that went down

hence the half

Nobody is disputing that. That it happened 2.5 GMs ago is really at issue here. That he couldn't come up with an example as it pertains to the current GM was the point.

Jabari Greer? You're serious with that ****?

As evidence by?

Right, and him not taking risks is a big part of why they never crawl back in. Saves them on turnovers, though. It's a !@#$ing puzzle with this guy.

That shift eluded me. Again, I find it pretty remarkable that they've only trailed by 4 points or more in less than half of his games. That's not lost by, that's trailed by, at any point. That--in some measure--is a testament to his "overall" ability.

To be fair, the specific context here is not whether TT is a piece of garbage, it's whether he's a piece of garbage when the game is on the line. It's actually quite phenomenal, from a team perspective, that in only 10 of the 21 games he's started have they even experienced a 4 point deficit. But it's doubly phenomenal that all but one of those deficits couldn't be overcome. In that sense, sorry, he's a piece of garbage.

Two missed PI's in the endzone. We cover that yet?