Proteus

You criticized me for criticizing Whaley and called the line Marrone's project. Please just stop, you have no clue.

Good stuff here. When all else fails please fall back on, well who did you want him to take. So pathetic. The toxic response I got while saying Whaley should be back but saying he needs to take responsibility for his mistakes as well is pretty telling. Either some of you are such giant homers that you have to attack anyone showing any criticism whatsoever towards Whaley or he has made no mistakes.

I am sure this is meant for me. All I said is he did a bad job addressing the offensive line and QB position. Had no other criticism besides that. But that was too much for you to handle.

I still am waiting for you to tell me how Whaley has no responsibility for the personnel on the offensive line.

As for being a homer? Yea when I make a very legit post about Whaley where I say I want him to remain GM but he needs to correct these 2 things and pointing out his very legitimate criticisms, and you act like I came on here and did some sort of a hatchet job on Whaley, yea you sound like a complete and total homer. Basically I made a very fair post about Whaley and you tried to make my opinion seem invalid because you are a total homer and I don't need to read your last ten years of posts. The position you are taking in this thread is basically Whaley has done no wrong and that is the definition of a homer.

Clearly did not say that and if it came out that way it is nothing more than a grammatical error. For you to keep going back to this shows you have absolutely no points to defend your position. All you have basically said so far is Whaley deserves no criticism for the offensive line and anything bad with the Bills. Yet deserves praise for all the good things.

Got it. Marrone's made suggestions on who he wanted for the line and if Whaley listened to him then he bears no responsibility for missing in FA or draft picks. Do you guys actually read what you post? This is a real eye opener though. I was actually very complimentary of Whaley and said I want him to have this year to prove himself. I also stated obvious legitimate criticisms of Whaley's tenure that anyone can see, but that was too much for the homers to handle. According to them Whaley has done nothing wrong and bears no responsibility for the personnel on the offensive line. It is seriously a pathetic display.

I am done arguing about this. Whaley is the GM. His has done a terrible job at getting quality offensive lineman. That is his job, that is on him. Pretend all you want that we have an all-star cast on the line and it was all Marrone's fault, I don't care. There is no point in debating with someone who is such a homer that he feels that the our crappy offensive line has nothing to do with Whaley.

Well like I said I am taking this as year one for Whaley and I will judge him on what his does from here. I am glad you have made your opinion on the offensive line known in multiple threads, but you did not in this one and I am not about to go reading your previous threads that pertain to the offensive line. If you want to criticize then you should be able to counter with your own argument within the thread. If you can't do that, then you lose credibility. The offensive line may be "Marrone's project" but simply making this statement shows how disingenuous you really are. Glenn and Wood are the only lineman that anyone would call quality starters. Whaley let Livitre walk and replaced him with Legursky and Brown. Two guys who don't belong in the league. Is that Marrone's fault? This year he went cheap and signed Chris Williams. He had one great block against the Bears before he got injured and that was pretty much it. It was a FA failure. He drafted a RT in the 2nd who may be out of the league in a year. Marrone's fault too? The personnel on the offensive line is well below average and if you want to pretend that Whaley, the GM has nothing to do with the personnel on the offensive line then you can go ahead and do that and keep laughing when anyone tells you different.

I thought you might like that one.

Yea laugh it up. I must be an idiot and have no idea what I am talking about so you can just make a quick one sentence statement and laugh me off instead of arguing your own valid points which it appears you have none of. I am not going to defend Marrone's coaching because he wasn't good but to completely absolve Whaley from any responsibility for the offensive line is what is truly laughable. It is a position that only a complete homer would take. I would appreciate it next time if you actually post something that makes me think critically about my stance and maybe can change my mind a bit instead of saying pretty much nothing and just making an insulting laughing icon so you don't actually have to defend you position at all. It is weak as !@#$ and you credibility doing it. I think my position is completely reasonable and anyone who read my post with an open mind and isn't a giant homer would see that and see that I am being more than reasonable with my respect to Whaley. As for Kelly's question, I must have missed it. What was it?

How hard was it to see that Manning was better than Leaf after one year?

It is more about the fact that he did not draft a QB in the last draft, and please don't come with "who did you want him to draft." Listen there are a lot of things I like about Whaley and I think he has done a fair job. That said under his watch the offensive line has gotten much worse and he traded up for a WR, giving up a future first, in a great WR draft, with no established QB in place. That is bad asset management. With all that said, I think Nix who was a terrible GM, put Whaley in a really bad position with the QB. Nix said QB was his #1 priority, yet he ignored the position for 3 straight drafts (good QB drafts at that), then backed himself into a corner and reached on a guy, in a bad QB draft when he already had one foot out the door. Considering everything that is happened, I am going to look at this like year one for Whaley and there are a couple of things he needs to do to prove himself. First go out and sign the best free agent offensive lineman you possibly can. Don't be cheap and go moneyball with a Chris Williams like signing. That is like paying for a cheap appliance. Yea it may work for a little bit but in the long run you are going to pay a lot more. Our offensive line is straight up bad. Adding a middling free agent isn't going to be enough. Stop being cheap on the offensive line. Number two, draft a QB on day one or two this year and yes I realize we don't have a pick on day one and would have to trade up to do it. We could be the best defense in the league the next 3 years and if we don't have a legit QB, we will be lucky to sneak into the playoffs once. Those great defensive players come and go because we won't be able to resign them all. If you don't find a QB that great defense will be all for nothing. The Bills need to start drafting a QB or two every draft until we find one. If he doesn't realize this he doesn't belong in the league as a GM. Let's say the Bills are still looking for a QB in the 2016 draft. They are picking right around 20 in both the 1st and there are a couple prospects that they like. If I am GM and they are both there when I pick in the 1st, I take the one I like more. If the other one slips to my 2nd round pick, I take him too. If Whaley isn't thinking like this then I don't want him as my GM. Whaley failed miserably last off-season. I don't care who he signed or how many lineman he drafted, the line got significantly worse. He has to take criticism for that. He also was either too concerned about Manuel's feelings or just doesn't get it because he ignored the QB position in the draft. Either reason, it has got to stop. If Whaley shows me that he understands the importance of the QB position with his actions, then I will want him here. If he doesn't draft a QB early this year, I am done with him.

Yea it can't possibly be that Whaley wiffed on the pick. Has to be Marrone's fault.

He drafted 3, one is looking like a huge second round bust, Richardson might be a decent backup someday and Henderson was a nice find in the 7th round but far from a solid starter at this point.

All that matters to you is Watkins was drafted by the Bills therefore he is better. Also how have I made up my mind about Watkins career trajectory? I think he could end up being a HOFamer and the best Bills receiver of all time. How is that making up my mind? It just happens to be clear to anyone not wearing Bills rose colored glasses that Beckham is better. It is not even an argument. He was targeted 20 times a game so his 10 catches 150 yards and 1 TD per game doesn't really count. Just a pathetic stance to take.

I love Sammy Watkins and I have a lot of faith that he is going to be a great receiver for the Bills. He is not as good as Odell Beckham, plain and simple. I really don't understand why that is so hard to admit. Sometimes there are guys who come out of the draft that are just on another level, Beckham is one of those guys. I don't give a flying **** how many times he was targeted per game. That is such a weak argument that I would be embarrassed to bring it up if I were you. Watkins is going to have to battle it out to be the 2nd best WR to come out of that draft with Mike Evans, and right now he is 3rd to Evans. Oh wait I forgot, Evans had McCown and Glennon throwing to him.

Isn't it though! What is amazing is that everyone gets so defensive when you say that a WR drafted with Watkins is better. Beckham had 91 receptions, 1,305 yards and 12 TD in 12 games. Over a full 16 game season that is 121 receptions 1740 yards and 16 TD's as a rookie, Oh yea he had arguably the greatest catch of all time too. Wait a second.... I forgot the Peyt.... I mean Eli "I threw for 3,800 yards 18 TD's and 27 Int's in 2013 without Beckham" Manning was throwing to him. I guess if that is the case there is no way he could be better than Sammy. It doesn't take a genius to see that Zack Martin's career trajectory is better than Cujo. Beckham is going to be an all time great. Please for the love of God let's stop worrying about our guy being better and admit Beckham is better.

Beckham is better man, get over it. It isn't a slight against Watkins, Beckham may end up being a top 5 receiver of all-time. Most GM's would have taken Sammy over Beckham so we can't fault Whaley for that, but we can fault for the trade. Watkins is going to be great, maybe the best Bills WR ever but Beckham is better. It might be a little hard to swallow as Bills fans but we can't pretend like Beckham isn't better so our feelings don't get hurt.

I am torn on Whaley like many people. He has done some very nice things. That said he failed miserably to address a bad offensive line last off-season and the line actually got worse. The Chris Williams was criticized by media and fans alike and they proved to be right. We needed a much better upgrade than Williams and Whaley failed on that one. He also ignored the QB position last off-season and was ready to go into the season with EJ, Lewis and Tuel. I don't care that he signed Orton a week before the season, he should have been more prepared and done more in the off-season. I said going into last off-season that he needed to sign a vet and draft someone. Draft someone so there has been someone in the system for a year already in case EJ fails. If Whaley isn't about to start taking the QB position seriously and draft someone on within the first 3 round every draft until will find a capable long term starter, then he can get the hell out.

Those of you saying his name belongs on the wall are cowards.

He is obviously talking about Shanahan, is obvious.

Only people calling it a debacle or circus are melodramatic Bills fans.