Reed83HOF

^^This

Flawed premise, you need more than a running game. You need a QB who can move the chains to keep the defenses honest so your run game actually works when you need it to. It isn't an either or, you have to be able to not be one-dimensional on offense, move the chains running and throwing the ball and keep the other offense off the field; you also want a defense that won't get steam rolled and can get off the field without giving up many points... Our defense stinks and you could theoretically help them out by keeping the ball and having a good TOP advantage so they don't give up a ton of TDs. Even with a great D, they will get beat from time to time; it would be handy to have a ball control style offense to keep their sorry butts off the field so you stand a chance. It goes the other way too - if your offense is having trouble scoring a good D can stop the other team and give you more opportunities to score... The D doing the heavy lifting with TT and his limitations as of now; is not well thought out IMO

No impact players (Sammy is my favorite player on this team, but he doesn't win us games - see point #2) and not one that honestly makes a difference with regards to our record (Sammy is not the OBJ who wins us games - yes I know Eli > TT). If none of them were on our team our record would be virtually unchanged, case in point Sammy is always injured - do any of these other players do much of anything?

It is almost a certainty...

So you really are Russ.... Where do I sign up to get Seasons again?

A$sho!e you took everyone of my responses! Good Job!!!

Great question Dave! That is exactly what you hope for! Don't see it that way at all; fair question...instead of trying to type it all out - this is why personally I really like the ST coordinators for HC gigs... "Arizona Cardinals head coach Bruce Arians is convinced of the same. He is well aware of the daunting challenges that special-teams coaches face on a weekly basis in trying to mix and match personnel for coverage and return units when injuries and roster moves made to address more pressing offensive and defensive needs dictate the players at their disposal. "When you talk about the special-teams guy, he’s in front of the entire team," Arians said. "He’s not like a quarterback coach or coordinator who only has half the team. He’s got the entire team and in a very big setting as far as classroom work. "They’re probably as adept at addressing a football team as anybody."" http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/nfl-head-coaching-openings-special-teams-dick-vermeil-john-harbaugh-bill-cowher-mike-ditka-121615 Here is why I like Toub and I'm pissed we aren't looking at him... "Special teams coordinators are often overlooked as head-coaching candidates, but reality is their job is easily as difficult as an offensive or defensive coordinator. On top of that, the special teams coach has to work with players from both sides of the ball every day in practice, teach them specific skills, and coordinate units that have a lot to do with winning or losing in any given game. Special teams coordinators have to game-plan on a weekly basis just as the other coordinators do. Toub has done that very successfully for 13 years. The fact is, year in and year out, Toub's special teams are in the top third in the NFL in every category rated. When looking for a head coach, clubs look for a person who has outstanding motivational and leadership skills, can communicate with both players and management and be able to put together a strong staff. Under Toub's leadership, several of his assistants have gone on to lead coordinator jobs around the league. Having worked with Toub for eight years I know and understand his ability to prepare and motivate. Those traits are among the best of any coach I have ever worked with and I have worked with some of the best (Parcells, Belichick, Dan Reeves, Tom Coughlin and Ron Rivera). Toub is an excellent evaluator of talent and I doubt you will find a more loyal person anywhere." http://www.profootballweekly.com/2016/12/19/greg-gabriel-chiefs-special-teams-coordinator-dave-toub-should-be-an-nfl-head-coach-in-2017/a9bleyy/

Whaley should be a pro-personnel Director; not a GM... I feel like all of this has been discussed adnasuem on this board by other posters who are not "pro-Whaley". Acts as a GM especially concerning the draft he has not been great with. Yes all GMs miss on some players since there are things that just cannot be measured, I love Sammy and he is my favorite player on this team; trading up for him was a waste and yes missing that 1st rounder next year for where we were as a team was not a smart move. We draft to either fill a need or fill a hole created by a new coaching staff, we do not draft BPA and we do not value positions correctly IMO. I think #BADOL has a great take on what rounds to take which positions btw... 2013 Draft (yes Whaley owns this and took ownership once he became GM, is that the case or not - tough to figure out from the narrative Russ and Berchtold created) 1.) Manuel was way overdrafted, not even in hindsight, most knew that right then 2.) Woods - nice pick 2.) Alsono - correct defensive player from Oregon, not Dion Jordan - nice pick 3.) Goodwin - terrible 4.) Duke Williams - no comment 5.) Meeks - no comment 6.) Dustin Hopkins - wish we kept him 7.) Chriss Gragg - LOL 2014 - Way too many trades for a team short on talent 1.) Sammy - love the player, but not in the position to give up a 4th & 2015's 1st. Plenty of impact players with our original pick 2.) Cyrus - looked okay the last couple games, still not a full time starter possibly should be 3.) Preston Brown - no comment 4.) Cockrell - great on the Steelers 5.) Cyril - no comment 6.) traded for Mike Williams - sigh no comment 7.) Randall Johnson - who? 7.) Seantrel - just a damn shame; I like this guy 2015 1.) Oops 2.) Darby - we will see what year 3 brings; great value last season 3.) Miller - great value 4.) Traded to Browns; Stevie traded basically for Bryce Brown. Great job with our WRs there 5.) Karlos - good value 6.) Tony Steward - known more for his wedding than his football career 6.) O'Leary - role player and depth thus far. WHat you hope for here 7.) Dez Lewis - our new Da'rick 2016 - Still a bit early to tell, but 1.) Lawson - that sure helped Rex and the team this year 2.) Ragland - I really hope he isn't a 2 down player 3.) Washington - our Interim Coach benched him in a meaningless game 4.) Cardale - we will see 5.) Jonathan Williams - to backfill for Karlos 6.) Listenbee - right type of player to draft here 6.) Seymour - right type of player to take here We really have not improved the overall talent of this team by drafting the best players available based on their talent. These picks reek with the stench of filling self-inflicted holes by a team whose front office lacks a cohesive vision for what they want their team to look like. Teams miss out on so many good players because their coaches are tied to schemes, this is one reason why the cook shouldn't always shop. They should be aligned, but talent always needs to win out; in the end that is what truly wins the games (once in a blue moon you will need a Bellicheat* gray area). We draft LBs, RBs and $hitty Safeties, and a few OL/DL sprinkled in. The only difference maker we drafted honestly was Sammy - he is either hurt (not his fault, possibly the QBs though) and he has to ask for the ball to be thrown his way. We spend a lot of money on Clay and never throw to the damn TE, Wouldn't Stevie, Sammy and Woods be better than Woods, Sammy, Salas & Bryce Brown? There is not one impact player besides Sammy in any of these drafts. Shady fell into his lap because Kelly wanted his Duck back. Hughes honestly wasn't a difference maker this year; last year meh - he gave up costly penalties too that negated his good plays.... Our talent on our roster blows.... I'm not trying to be a turd btw. I don't know how you untangled what is true and what isn't with all of the spin that has gone on. Even if you don't give him the 13 draft; the others still really suck. I'm not sure if it is the scouts or Whaley, but IIRC Whaley was a pro-personnel guy and not really a scout - that is where he is lacking as far as a GM goes. I cannot even really put the Watkins trade fully on Whaley because it simply could have been Russ at that point. Regardless of the names and who did what; the results are just not good enough and not getting it done. Personally I really prefer the GM finds talent and the coaches are scheme diverse and run plays that are suited to the talent of their players - that gives sustainability to the franchise by the virtue that ablue print cannot be copied ot stop a specific scheme and honestly in the end; more often than not the more talented team wins in the long run... I kinda hate the term czar, but there needs to be a strong football person in there who knows how to handle the football side of the house; whether it is a Sr. VP of Football Ops, Team President, or a GM like friggin Ozzie Newsome...

He did run the 13 draft as well by his own admission...

ST coaches have to coach players from both sides of the ball, make snap judgments (quick decisions) in the game, are not married to schemes, etc... It is a shame that Toub, even Shanny Jr., is not part of this search, fire-able offense IMO if we don't interview them.

No the defense isn't great, but the offense could help them out by chewing clock and moving the chains; therefore keeping them off the field...He is spot on with what many see with TT...

Never said he wasn't good a pro-personnel... He's not good at knowing how to build a team and the draft...

John Wawrow ‏@john_wawrow 6m6 minutes ago Plan? What plan? John Wawrow ‏@john_wawrow 5m5 minutes ago Well, there's always next year. #toosoon?

Not everything has to get blown up Browns style - make some moves to clear cap room and get some picks to get new younger talent with a HC that you are comfortable with and has the same vision for the team as the owners and GM do. Whaley seems to go after whatever players the coach wants, which is good and bad. While he appears to be great in identifying pro-personnel, his drafting have been mostly WOOF... I have been saying this exact thing for awhile now; this is why I fear we will be in the 4-6 range next year and Whaley will be a goner...There is no way we can fill the holes and improve the weak positions this offseason....

McCoy fell in his lap and IIRC, Nix was still GM when the Hughes trade went down. I am amazed that there are so many on here who are unable to fault Whaley at all or at least look at things objectively and listen to what the "other side" is saying. It falls into the category of just give EJ more time....

The talent on the roster isn't that great aside from a couple players...IMO a soft blow up with moving on from some vets, getting a few picks and clearing up some cap space to be able to build the roster up might be just hat we need.... Yup. Well Said!

Jim Kelly is an anti- Tyrod - said we need more from that position, needs to keep moving the chains and get first downs and he doesn't do that....

I was speaking after that disaster of a press conference, which it was; I really don't think they expected it to go as poorly as it did. He is learning the hard way, that he should have cleaned it all in one big swing of the axe or left it as is for at least another year with an ultimatum to get the Defense right or everyone is gone.... But yeah he should be looking in the mirror as well...

if you look at what jw said in the other thread, this is what his fear is; in 12 months we will be doing this again. If that is the case rip the damn band aid off now....

I know you are shocked at the revelations....

Thank you for everything John... This team...sigh

If he wasn't tuned in with someone and right as often as he has been; I wouldn't put too much in it. One thinks that Terry has to be fuming a bit though

And indefensible it is...you are correct Pegs is learning the hard way, but just get the inevitable over with and hit the RESET button...

Time to go drill another well IMO. Need to burn it at all down...

nickellion79 ‏@nickellion79 1h1 hour ago with news that Lynn might pull his name, this is getting UGLY. How is Pegula happy with this? Tell me you have good news. Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 1h1 hour ago It is bad. No one is happy. A lot of people are worried on one hand & feeling like they have nothing to lose on the other. nickellion79 ‏@nickellion79 1h1 hour ago I was hoping you might have something more positive. Any chance Pegula is mulling a change after this week? Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 1h1 hour ago I don't know. That is being asked at every level under Whaley. But he insists he is safe as can be until at least next year. nickellion79 ‏@nickellion79 1h1 hour ago which is terrible for selling to a new coach Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 1h1 hour ago Still, other HC candidates are accepting invites and answering advance questions. nickellion79 ‏@nickellion79 1h1 hour ago any new names? I just can't believe Pegulas accepting of this ... other owners have to counseling them right?? Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 1h1 hour ago No new names here. To clarify, I hadn't heard Lynn was having doubts. But I don't believe Whaley is super high on Lynn. nickellion79 ‏@nickellion79 1h1 hour ago latest video with @AdamBenigni Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 1h1 hour ago Yes, I saw that. I mean I hadn't heard it independently. nickellion79 ‏@nickellion79 1h1 hour ago oh copy ...sorry about that. You know anything about Goodwin? He and McDermott intrigue me Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 1h1 hour ago No. Coordinators getting real consideration. The needed balance w/ candidates who were HCs is happening but not visible yet. In response and a repost to the Polian article in the D&C Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 13m13 minutes ago Don't underestimate Bill Polian's influence on the Pegulas. He could be running the #Bills right now if he wanted. ricky ‏@pawlikIII 7m7 minutes ago can u update the coaching candidates please? And who Whaley likes the most? Joe Chenelly ‏@jchenelly 7m7 minutes ago I don't have additional info to share right now. I certainly will when I do.