Dibs

.....or trading the #10 for Rob Johnson.......or the Saints trading an entire year & a 1st for Ricky. Trades are good when they turn out good & bad when they don't. Until they become history, nobody knows if they would have been good/bad. A trade down might well have landed us a bust in the 1st & who knows in the second etc......or might not. So Marv didn't chose to do a trade......so what? In hindsight it may have worked out better. If only he had his crystal ball on hand. Remember.......2 birds are worth a hand in the bush.

As I posted earlier.....if all you are saying is that Marv & Co. didn't have the best draft possible then you are not really saying much at all. It would be virtually impossible to have the best draft you could have.....at least it would be impossible to tell. So okeydokeythen......Marv could have had a better draft. Does that mean he didn't have a good one?

As further example for you....... 1995 Ki-Jana Carter, Tony Boselli, Steve McNair, Michael Westbrook, Kerry Collins, Kevin Carter, Mike Mamula, Joey Galloway, Kyle Brady, J.J. Stokes 1996 Keyshawn Johnson, Kevin Hardy, Simeon Rice, Jonathan Ogden, Cedric Jones, Lawrence Phillips, Terry Glenn, Tim Biakabutuka, Rickey Dudley, Willie Anderson 1997 Orlando Pace, Darrell Russell, Shawn Springs, Peter Boulware, Bryant Westbrook, Walter Jones, Ike Hilliard, James Farrior, Tommy Knight, Chris Naeole As long as fans see the 'exciting' top 10 pick as an expected 'can't miss', 'difference maker', GMs will continually look bad.

Only time will tell if that was the case......and in order to get a realistic expectation, one should gather information from multiple years. You'll find that most drafts have a similar result in the top 10 of about 1 in 2 being busts & under 1 in 3 being difference makers.

sarcasm

Hmmmmm. Is that a fact? This is where I know people get caught up in the "what should be" rather than the "what is". 3 random top 10s 2000 Courtney Brown, LaVar Arrington, Chris Samuels, Peter Warrick, Jamal Lewis, Corey Simon, Thomas Jones, Plaxico Burress, Brian Urlacher, Travis Taylor 2001 Michael Vick, Leonard Davis, Gerard Warren, Justin Smith, LaDainian Tomlinson, Richard Seymour, Andre Carter, David Terrell, Koren Robinson, Jamal Reynolds 2002 David Carr, Julius Peppers, Joey Harrington, Mike Williams, Quentin Jammer, Ryan Sims, Bryant McKinnie, Roy Williams, John Henderson, Levi Jones You'd be lucky if 1 in 3 are difference makers. Apart from the concept that Whitner may well become one of those difference makers (very few are difference makers in their rookie seasons), to expect a difference maker is an unrealistic expectation.

I don't believe this argument is still thriving. If the anti-draft Whitner brigade are saying "The draft could have been better(giving reasons how)". They are probably right. What are the odds that Marv & Co. had the best draft possible? Very, very, very low. So....YES!!!!!.....We could have done such & such.......YES!!!!......we might have gotten better value if we had blah, blah, blah. Was the Whitner selection a bad selection?. In the real world, half of the top 10 draftees will never pan out. We all can agree(I hope) that Whitner will be at least a solid starter for years to come......so......it can't be considered a bad selection.....and may well prove to be(if he makes multi pro bowls) a very good selection. Are people saying it was a bad selection? If they are, they certainly are not looking at the history of what actually makes a bad selection. Flowers, Williams come to mind. Whitner definitely was not a bad selection.

That's my guess too.......but I said that about Bush last year.

WOW! .....and I find it hard enough to predict who will go #1 in the draft.....I got it wrong last year. That's amazing. I'm amazed.

McNabb is only 30 years old. He is entering his 9th NFL season. He is entering the prime for an NFL QB. Unless you figure his injuries the last two seasons have permanently hindered his abilities, I would think there isn't a hope in hell the Eagle would spend sooooo many resources for a backup. Manning is entering his 10th season & is 31 years old......maybe the Colts will trade up to get him instead.

What's that you say about Turner, Willis & the media????? It sounds like you've got original thoughts combining all three topics......you should start a new thread about it.

I think it was The Dean. Edit Posted before I read through the thread.........I see he's decided to own up. Curse you, The Dean, curse you to a place where people don't often get cursed to.....just so you won't have company.

BTW, Sapp was/is 6'2" & 303lbs.....he is not the 'big' DT people believe him to be. I see what you're saying about Jenkins though......mind you, it sounds like the injuries have ended his uniqueness.

I honestly can't tell if you are serious or not here.

Surely this is plugging a square peg into a round hole situation. Even if it's a gold plated square peg, it still won't fit into that tricky round hole. Over & over again Marv. & DJ have shown that they are interested in "Tampa 2" type DTs not Pat William type DTs. We sign Tripplett(295)....ignoring all of the bigger DTs on the FA market. We pass on N'Gata(338).....& draft McCargo(295) & Williams(295) We trade for Walker(294) And we actually offer a tender to Anderson(304) Jefferson was the largest on the roster at 310. What makes people think that Jenkins(335) will even be considered for more than 2 seconds by Marv & Co.?

What he said.

I've always been very fond of the 'panic' option. We could do that for an hour or so......until whichever player we wanted to trade down for is no longer a 'reach'.

At the risk of removing any doubt.....I'm a dick Sorry Simon. I think this is yet another case of "only read the last(or first) bit" syndrome. I don't know why....I normally thoroughly read posts.......it doesn't matter. I apologize unreservedly.

As I said, it used to be the name of a shade of brown......a dark brown. I even vaguely recall a tin of really old shoe polish in the cupboard when I was a kid with the colour being 'N*gger Brown'.

....and there I was thinking a similar thing about you. Honestly, all I expected was a......"I didn't mean that there was no possibility that Lynch can't become a star. I just think it extremely unlikely." Yes, I can be a dick(as can we all).....but in my mind there is a big difference between predicting somebody can't achieve a certain level.....and predicting somebody has little chance to achieve a certain level. But hey......it's a message board & that's just my opinion.......I realize that everyone has one......

The second list are RBs that were considered to be outside the elite level.......just as Lynch is. I'm on the same page as you now. Obviously things will happen how you predict because it's you who is doing the predictions. I didn't realize I had entered into an "I'm right/your wrong" discussion. I guess I'll take your word for it. Lynch can't become a star because he just hasn't got it......and obviously neither will any RB drafted this year apart from AP. How could I possibly have thought to try & point out the futility of having a dogmatic opinion on talent evaluation. Sorry. Won't happen again.

I'm not commenting on what the Bills should/shouldn't do. I was commenting on your statement of...... ....so yes, I put the quote above into my words......but it was still your meaning. Lynch won't be a ProBowlin, playmakin, bigballin, bluechip stud......& Peterson is the only guy you see that can be a ProBowlin, playmakin, bigballin, bluechip stud. Those 14 guys I listed were all drafted in the top 12......therefore were certainly considered potential ProBowlin, playmakin, bigballin, bluechip studs at the time of drafting. None of them lived up to their pre-draft billing. Those other 10 guys I listed were all drafted after the top 12(into the 2nd, 4th, 5th rounds)......therefore were certainly not considered potential ProBowlin, playmakin, bigballin, bluechip studs at the time of drafting. All these guys became the ProBowlin, playmakin, bigballin, bluechip studs that you are after. How can you possibly say that Lynch can't become one of those STAR type players.

Why should I believe you? Everyone......absolutely everyone is predicting AP to be a top 5 talent.....whereas Lynch is wavering from #10 to bottom 1st round. It seems to me that when you have an opinion that is so vastly different to the majority, (particularly in the realms of talent assessment) some major humility should be present when said opinion is uttered.......or at least some majorly intelligent argument. You may well be right......but you give me no reason to think so.

I find this school of thought intriguing. So Peterson definitely won't be like Thomas Jones, Ron Dayne, Curtis Enis, Warrick Dunn, Lawrence Phillips, Tim Biakabutuka, Ki-Jana Carter, Garrison Hearst, Tommy Vardell, Blair Thomas, Tim Worley, Sammie Smith, Alonzo Highsmith, or Brent Fullwood...... and Lynch definitely wont be like Steven Jackson, Larry Johnson, Deuce McAllister, Shaun Alexander, Eddie George or Robert Smith....not to mention the 2nd+ rounders....ok, just a few......Portis, Davis, Martin, Dillon, etc, etc, etc. I've said this a lot in the past year........The draft position does not mean the draftee will be a better player......it means you have a (theoretically) bigger chance of getting a better player. ProBowlin, playmakin, bigballin, bluechip studs are found after the #12 pick every year....lots of them. This means that every year every single team thinks "Player X is the only player of Y position I've seen in this draft that fits that description."......and every single year they are wrong.

Just a few things..... Cardinals: I simply cannot see that they could consider AP. Edge was the FA signing of last year. He is a franchise back on a 4 year 30mil deal. 11.5mil was up front. There is no way they could grab another franchise RB.....particularly with all their other needs. Texans tempted? Hell yes.....but they couldn't select AP. Green is a top RB.....6 1000+ years out of 7(injured in 2005). They have just signed him to top money(7mil guaranteed). In the salary cap era, is there any team that has managed 2 franchise backs? I can't think of any. Raiders: I really can't see them select RB with Johnson & 2 QBs available......possible but extraordinarily unlikely. I bow to the wisdom of other posters & (in my mind) remove the Cowboys & Panthers from the 'maybe' list......though I think adding the Falcons seems warranted......& if High Motor is correct, I wouldn't be surprised to see AP in a Falcons uni post draft. "Am I mistaken, or is there an absolute glut of RBs in the league at the moment?" When I asked this, I refer only to the fact that there seems to be far more teams set at RB than at any time I can remember. Patriots, Jets, Dolphins, Ravens, Bengals, Steelers, Colts, Jaguar, Texans, Chargers, Chiefs, Broncos. AFC has only 4 teams not set in stone at RB with the Browns & Raiders servicable Eagles, Cowboys, Redskins, Bears, Vikings, Lions, Saints, Panthers, Bucs, Seahawks, Rams, 49ers, Cardinals. NFC has only 3 teams not set in stone at RB with the Giants serviceable & the Falcons actually good but wanting a change of style.