truth on hold

i think, and i could be wrong, the ball is marked where the runner was when the foul occurred, no matter where the foul occurred, - 10 yards for the penalty.

he couldnt have been anywhere near graham when the penalty occurred. He rushed manning so he was probably in their backfield. theres no way he hustles backwards 30+ yards to be near graham. whatever it was must have been taking place somewhere near the line of scrimmage.

we needed to put points on the board on those picks to make manning pay. w/o unusual penalties both returns were well withing FG range. Instead broncos defense got a lift holding us to nothing

they never showed it but im guessing he must have been at least 30 yards from the spot of the foul how does a holding call that far from the play happen? how often is holding called on a pick?

For me it was KC. Literally a fraction of a second from IMO an insurmountable 2-score lead. Would have been badly needed conference win, and against a WC contender. I think if we win that the following games work out exactly the same, putting us at 8 & 5, tied with 3 other teams for the 2 WC spots. Not a bad spot.

At his presser marrone would take no part in criticising the officiating, he only criticised himself for reacting to some calls and setting a bad example for the players. I'm like wtf? I thought this was a new era where we had a coach that wasnt afraid to get in the refs faces for all the bs. Instead we have one who aspires to jauron-stoicism

14/31, 140, 0 TDs, 2 INTS .... yeah he's great lol. only 7 of browns points not from Colts turnovers When was the last time Hoyer threw a TD? like 4 games ago?

677

2nd season in a row the Hoyer's witness a game brother Brian doesn't finish against Bills

it's the latest invoice from attornies defending the Rice appeal

could be it, what a bunch of thin-skinned weaklings

with our red zone problems and inability of WRs and TEs to win physical matchups, I find it hard to argue with the case he makes for himself

so much for the injury excuse "Watkins also dismissed that he's any more banged up than any other NFL player this time of year. "Later in the year, defenders read your body language, how you come off the ball," Watkins said. "There's some things I got to switch up. That comes with just changing your game up. If you do the same thing for nine or 10 weeks, people can figure out how you do things." http://www.nfl.com/n...ugh-rookie-wall

the only one being an obnoxious ass about the QB controversy is Hoyer. Whereas JF respects coaches decision, Hoyer is going public with statements like he was shocked he was pulled (yeah after sucking hard for 3+ straight games), acting like 7&5 is 11&1, and taking credit for the team's perceived success instead of complimenting team mates. If JF acted like that you and the other haters would be all over him, but when it's Hoyer all we hear is .... http://youtu.be/K8E_zMLCRNg

Wonder if that's why meatball went easy on him. Rare you get 2 guys straight up so square to each other like that

true, but Id attribute that more to our problems on offense. Any defense will eventually cave to a good offense if their own offense isnt getting them any relief

Broncos have been relying on run recently, if our defense plays up to it's standards that should change. So the main question when Broncos have the ball: what happens when Broncos have to rely on Manning throwing 40+ times again? His arm strength is being quesitoned more and more, as is the health of a number of the their WRs. I think if we had an average offense, we could at least contain Broncos to scoring no more than 24 of on us .... .... which brings to next point. How will our anemic offense do against their very good defense? IF, and to reiterate it's a BIG IF, the game planners can come up with a respectable, effective plan for offense, this game is a toss up

resorting to advice that's impossible since I dont have their #'s and they wouldnt answer the phone anyway, and as Ive said it's my preference competitors take themselves out anyway ... this thread is not going well for you

IMO they do it's simply a matter of if he's ready or not. IYO he's not, and you're obviously in the camp of hating the guy because of his attitude or whatever ... fine w/ me. Im happy to see Browns take themselves fully out of the race

if they know JF is the future, no it's not. Their odds right now are less than 10% .... so you roll the dice with a less than 1 in 10 chance, risk polluting the image of your guy, and enter 2015 with the QB battle still unresolved? Pettine knows his job is safe for next year given the debacle from firing their 1st year coach last year, and that they've already won 3 more games. Hoyer is the free option ... if he and the team exceed expectations, fine ... if not, they're setting JF as the long term starter anyway. It's wholly consistent with how they've been approaching it since camp.

I think the other agenda -- and this would be just like the loser Browns mentaility - - is to let Hoyer start a few more games and look bad, just so they can say they gave him every opportunity before letting him walk in FA. This way they also save JF the blame for not making the playoffs. Contrary to popular opinion, it could be the case that Browns have concluded they most likely not make the playoffs and that's why they're playing Hoyer and sitting JF.

he had a "successful" (your word before subsequently changing to "great") college career, period. If you just separate out picks as if that's all he's ever done then he's been a terrible Pro QB too. He was a 6th round pick because his combine #'s made him look too skinny and slow. and how in the world can you conclude that JF "sucks in the NFL" from the very limited data set

Brady was successful in college he was just drafted low During his first full year as starter, he set Michigan records for most pass attempts and completions in a season (214).[20] Brady was All-Big Ten honorable mention both seasons and team captain his senior year. The Wolverines won 20 of 25 games when he started, and he set a school record for completions in a 31-16 loss against Ohio State in 1998, a season in which Michigan shared the Big Ten Conference title. Brady capped that season with a win over Arkansas in the Citrus Bowl. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Brady

Your statement contains no math or data Here's examples of some that do for Hoyer: - 1 td and 6 picks over last 4 games - Lowest QBR over 3 games of any starter this year, in this case his last 3 games - 3+ qtrs against Bills: 3 points, 0 TDs, 2 picks

He did more in one drive than hoyer in 3+ quarters. Also showed greater mobility and a stronger arm. If they want to stick with Hoyer, his 1td and 6 picks in last 4 games, and lowest QBR over last 3 games of any starter this year.... oh well same old Browns