smokinandjokin

Plus the fact that Holcomb was born to be a backup quarterback. I'm not going to say he sucks, because he doesn't. But it sure sucks for you if he's your team's starting QB.

Both are incredibly fun to bet on!!!

A can't miss OT drafted at #4? I've heard that one somewhere......

Per the Buffalo News (second bullet point in the article) Pat Williams has been placed on the Physically Unable to Perform list. He apparently reported to camp overweight. Minnesota's website only reports that Pat was held out of practice yesterday.

Maurice Clarett stole them at gunpoint.

Looking at the NFL divisions, where do rank each in comparison with the others? Below is each division with last season's record, and you can click here if you want to view them in more detail. You can rank your divisions as the toughest to win, or as the best teams, top to bottom. Let's see where they shake out. BTW, remember before the '03 season when every expert picked the AFC East to be the toughest in the NFL? Bledsoe and the Bills on the rise, the Jets coming off an AFC Championship game appearance, the Pats one year removed from their first Super Bowl, and Ricky coming off a career year for the Fins...It was set up to be a bloodbath, but that never panned out (well, ok, New England had a decent year.) The point is, don't be afraid to go out on a limb! Here's how I see them: 1. NFC East- that will be a dogfight. Nobody will walk over any of those teams. 2. AFC West- Again, top to bottom, there is not a 'gimmee' game in the bunch. I'm skeptical of Aaron Brooks in Oaktown, though. He could be really good, but he will probably be really bad. 3. NFC South- Tampa and Carolina were playoff teams. Simms has to prove that he's the long term answer, and Cadillac has to stay healthy. Atlanta is no pushover, and while Vick may be overrated, he wins more than he loses. The Saints with Brees and Reggie should make some noise. 4. AFC North- A bit top heavy, but Cleveland and Baltimore should both be improved. I wrestled with placing this division at #3 because the Steelers and Bengals are just that good, and the AFC has been better in recent years. 5. AFC East- Never easy playing one of these teams at their place. The Pats are still top dog until someone proves otherwise. 6. AFC South- VERY top heavy. Indy and Jax again this year. Houston could leapfrog Tennesee to get out of last place. 7. NFC West- Seattle alone keeps them out of the basement. 8. NFC North- Are you really frightened by any one of these teams?

Harry: I expected the Rocky Mountains to be a little rockier than this. Lloyd: I was thinking the same thing. That John Denver's full of schit, man.

On the first weekend, these look like the best matchups: Vanderbilt at Michigan- see what the Blue has got, and who's replacing Cutler at Vandy. UM fans would like to see Mike Hart get through this game without spraining his ankle. Northern Illinois at Ohio State- Buckeyes will win, but NIU is picked to win the MAC title game this year. Marshall at WVU- In-state rivalry. WVU will factor in the BCS and have a sniff at the national title, but not if they slip up in this game. Cal at Tennesee- Two underachieving teams last year look to get off on the right foot. Have both figured out their QB situation yet? Notre Dame at Georgia Tech- Can the Irish offense start rolling right off the bat? The Quinn Heisman watch begins. USC at Arkansas- Plenty of unknowns for the Trojans. USC's problem this year could be the beatings they've handed out the past three seasons. Other teams don't forget, and try to take advantage when you're vulnerable. Last year- 70-17 USC. Kentucky at Louisville- Always a biggie in NCAA hoops. Louisville will look to score a win for the criticized Big East over the SEC. And the doozy on Labor Day: Florida State at Miami- Actually a pretty ugly game last year, I think it was like 10-6 or something. I remember more the ineptness of the offenses rather than the brilliance of the defenses. Still, this game always puts 22 of the most athletic players in the country on the field at the same time. One month to go......

Can this dude run and catch or what?

True that Bart, it is always tough to have to change your schemes to adjust to a completely different style. I think Navy has led the NCAA in rushing several times over the past few years because of their triple option wishbone. Typically, the athleticism of the better team wins out, but the gimmicks can keep a game closer than it should be. Buff, you make a good point. A team in a conference will always have 2-3 cupcakes to play against, and they will be constantly rotating. Teams who are not in the upper echelon of the conference (like you mentioned, Illinois, Indiana, Northwestern, etc) will have up years and down years. Sometimes they will play better against Ohio State and Michigan, and sometimes those games will be blowouts, depending on the season. They could finish 10-2 or 2-10, who knows? What you said is exactly the point I'm making...Those schools (even the Indiana's and Baylor's of the world) have the ability to recruit players who can play at a national championship level. The service academies do not recruit those types of players, and frankly, it's probably because most of those players don't meet the extensive requirements necessary to be a student at one of the prestigous academies. That said, the stars will occasionally allign where Army or Navy has a class of well-coached, supremely conditioned athletes who can win more often than not. They will beat the bottom teams from BCS leagues. But they will not compete for a national title. Therefore, if you were making Notre Dame's schedule for the 2011 football season, scheduling Washington (2-9 in '05) or Kentucky (3-8 in '05) is uncertain, because those teams have the potential to recruit and turn things around quickly. On the other hand, scheduling Navy, Army, and Air Force is basically scheduling three automatic wins, no matter if they are in an "up" year or a "down" year, because the types of athletes at those schools are drastically different from the athletes at ND. That's why I was surprised ND scheduled all three in the same season. But the way it shakes out, they end up with a pretty fair schedule overall- 4 tough, 4 middle of the road, and 4 "locks." No doubt! Can't wait for CFB- start playing some damn games soon or we're going to go crazy! We're here talking Army football for gosh sakes!

NCAA hoops is MUCH different from NCAA football. No question the mid-majors have had a big impact on the national scene in basketball. But I wouldn't use that argument to make your point. First, there are only 12 players on a basketball roster. That leaves MANY, MANY talented players without a scholarship to UNC or UCLA or UConn. So they end up at Southern Illinois or sometimes even Niagara. And they know that if they perform, they will get the recognition, and a chance to play in the big tourney. There's no 1-A and 1-AA in hoops. In football, there are ~75 scholarships per team. All of the big schools get all of the big time athletes. Guys like Rothlisberger that go to a smaller school can maybe catch lightning in a bottle for one season and get ranked near the top-10, but they will never be national title contenders. An 18-year old with NFL aspirations will probably not end up at Army or Navy. The only reason I mention the service academies on ND's schedule is because we know right now that they will not beat the Irish this year, and probably not any year. Navy has not beaten ND in ~50 years, and they play every season. At least with a team like Illinois, there is a chance that they have the athletes who can get the job done. Notre Dame would probably win 90% of the time, but you never know. Stanford gave the Irish all they could handle last year. Those teams play the power teams in their respective conferences, and are not necessarily intimidated by a top-5 team. It's tough to picture Army getting reps for the Notre Dame game after going against Temple. No question the academies have had good seasons. Navy, especially in recent years. And no question that in an "up" year for the academies, they could beat a BCS-conference team in a "down" year. There will be various seasons where Army would be a tougher test than Indiana, but scheduling for five years away, I think you would bet money that Army will be an easier game.

Totally agreed. I have definitely tried to mention several times that their schedule is by no means easy. And you are correct, schedules are made 5 years in advance. Looking at Texas' and USC's schedule's from last year, neither of those squads is in position to complain about the softies. But it is odd to see one academy on a BCS team's schedule, much less all three. I suppose the main difference is that at the academies, they are football players third, behind being soldiers and students. Basically, they are grooming themselves for a different life from most 20-year olds. At BCS schools, they are football players first and then students when they have time. I think we all know that most blue-chip athletes are going to go where they'll be coddled and fawned over, where football is your job, rather than a place where football is a bonus.

I see and respect your point, but no, I don't think that lumping the academies in with cupcakes is arbitrary. The players at the service academies meet 100 other requirements just to be admitted to the school, and also happen to be decent football players. In contrast, at schools like Arizona and Maryland and Iowa State, which wouldn't be considered 'tough' games for a team like Notre Dame, the players are outstanding athletes who were recruited to play football, and match up against some of the top teams in the country (even if they get blown out.) Army, Navy, and (to a lesser extent) Air Force do not play ANY teams comparable to Notre Dame. At least a team like Illinois will have stepped on the same field as a team like Ohio State or Michigan, and know what it takes to compete at that level. The service academies do not, with the exception of Air Force, who has Tennessee on the schedule this year.

I think our old pal R. Rich was being sarcastic...... I haven't read one publication, article, website, etc. that projects Leinart as the starter in Arizona. He has been mentioned as the 'most-NFL ready' QB compared to Cutler and Young, but I don't think anybody is touting him as this year's savior. I agree that Leinart's college success was very much a function of him playing on one of the most talent-laden teams in NCAA history. However, he was a VERY good QB. I see him having a very good career, but not necessarily outstanding. I envision more Boomer Esiason rather than Ken Dorsey.

I think WVU is a favorite because of their schedule. When Louisville and Pitt are your toughest games, you have a good shot at going undefeated. I'm not dogging ND's schedule, they do have some toughies in there and there are games they will lose if they don't play their best. You can't blame them for middle-of-the-road teams like GT, Purdue, and UNC, because like I said, if they were a member of a conference they would have 3-4 'easy' wins every year from the lower tier teams. Just because they're independent doesn't mean they have to schedule all 11 games from the top-25. I also understand their long-standing agreement with Navy. But adding Army and Air Force this year creates a trifecta that probably hasn't been seen in many, many years from a title contender.

Why don't they just go to the movies like last year?

I understand ND's situation as an independent. If they were in a conference, they would no doubt have some cupcake games against the bottom feeder teams. But when is the last time a favorite for the national title had Army, Navy, and Air Force on the schedule in the same season?

Let's see if we can't get this moving in the right direction: A 6-year old boy is sitting on a park bench enjoying a nice day. An old man is taking a stroll through the park, and sits down on the bench also. The old man glances over at the boy and notices that he has a plastic bag with him. Just then, the boy reaches into the bag and pulls out a candy bar. He quickly unwraps it and stuffs it into his mouth, barely chewing before it's gone. Again, he reaches into the bag and pulls out another candy bar. Same as before, he unwraps it and quickly devours it. At this point, he definitely has the old man's attention. Once again, the boy reaches into the bag and pulls out a third candy bar. Like the first two, he chomps it down in a couple of bites. The old man is sitting on the bench with a puzzled look on his face, and he says to the little boy, "You know son, you really shouldn't eat all of that chocolate so fast. I don't think it's good for you." The young boy replies, "My grandfather lived to be 105 years old." The old man lets out a chuckle and says, "Really? Wow! And did he eat candy bars just like that?" "Hell no," the boy replied. "But he minded his own !@#$ing business!"

The back of his neck looks like a package of hotdogs.

I can't say I've heard a more rediculous way to rate cities than by comparing the kitchens at what one person considers to be upscale country clubs. And while we're on the topic, the bathrooms in Buffalo Arby's are much cleaner than the bathrooms in Rochester Arby's.

I'd give up and cash out. It's pretty much over. You peaked at 28.

WGR has reported for the past three days that McCargo arrived in Rochester on Wednesday in anticipation of signing his deal and getting right into camp. The deal was all but finalized. Everyone knew it but you. Sad you keep using this sorry line. It made no sense when you first typed it, and after the fifth time, it's just tiresome. The interesting part of all of this is they will be conducting afternoon shows live from St John Fisher daily. You know, in the afternoon, AFTER they actually practice, when there's something to talk about. Thanks Lv, I'm all set with this thread. It's been a pleasure. Your ability to see and understand all of the various sides of an argument is astounding.

What the hell is this, Lv-Bills? Is Promo working for WGR now? Why is he not telling us what's going on?

Hey bro, they've been saying for a week that both sides are very close, they're working out the details, and they expect both players in camp very soon. No lengthy holdouts expected. It's not unexpected that he signed. But perhaps Howard Simon should've reported at 8am today that McCargo signed at 11am...TODAY Do you think Marv is going to go on WGR and give ANY TYPE of insight into the nature of the contract negotiations??? They've been saying all the same bullschit for weeks, "Fair deal, good for both sides, get them in camp, reflective of the marketplace, etc etc etc" What are you looking for? Just to B word about WGR?

Marv might be a little busy today. Especially considering the thousands of interviews he's granted WGR over the past two months. Okay, ready? Quote from (insert WR's name here): "I'm very excited to get out on the field and show the coaches what I can do. We have a very talented group of receivers here so I'm looking forward to getting on the field and performing. I have always had confidence in my ability...The time has come where reading the playbook is over and you have to show it on the field" Why don't you let them start camp first and then I'm sure you'll hear all about it. Stop making yourself look like a stooge. Yeah, let's get some reports from beat writers in Boston and Miami about how their camps, which haven't opened yet, are going. We get your point. Your point sucks.