Fan in Chicago

You refuse to acknowledge what I first state and ask me the same question back. I explained in my previous posts where you have been changing arguments. It is apparent that you are more interested name calling than engaging in a debate which sticks to the point and is supported by facts. So, this is my last response to you in this thread. Have fun imagining that you 'won' this argument.

You keep changing arguments when facts supplied by me debunk what you claimed. First you implied Vick will make Bills better but when I pointed out he is neither a good passer nor that his rushing would help us to a better record, you changed to say he would be better than our backups. Then I pointed out his rushing stats as related to the Falcons W-L record, you point to their defense. So did Vick cause their better record or are you agreeing to The Dean's point that it is the team that wins and not the QB ? I am saying Vick will not make the Bills better. It is your posts that make you look like an idiot and a dumba$$ who cannot stick to one line of argument and continuously deflect arguments when you cannot win any. I am not participating in a national debate which place emphasis on grammatical superiority. So, STFU !

I am going to ignore the insulting tone of your note (for now) First of all, him rushing a lot and gaining yards does not make a team a dominating rushing attack. A great rushing attack is when a team can rush when they want to , for the yards they want especially to gain the critical first downs. The fact that he would take off at every opportune and inopportune moment does not define dominating. To your point about his quality as a passer, how can you call his performance decent given the stats ? A 53.8 completion percent and 3-2 TD-Int ratio is not good. The drift of your earlier note was to get him and make Buffalo 'more dangerous'. The implication here is that he is a starter for the Bills. Which means you were implicitly comparing him to Trent Edwards - a drift you changed in this post. As a backup, he does not make the Bills dangerous cos he will be on the bench. If you explicitly said or implied you are comparing his stats to those of Fitzpatrick and/or Hamdan, I would have no argument. If we need to pull stats of pocket passers, here are a few from 2008: Peyton Manning 95.0; Kurt Warner 96.9; Tony Romo 91.4. My point is that I can pull out stats also to show that other pocket passers have better records. Then you compare his rushing ability. In 2004-2006, the Falcons led the league in YPG rushing yet their record declined every year. If there was credence that his rushing makes the team record better, then this should have been reflected in their W-L record. If I can use my weak comprehension skills, I am assuming you mean that if he was the Bills QB during that period the Bills record would have been better. How does the data support your theory ? I pulled stats in response to your specific points. The stats do not support either point - he is a decent passer or that his rushing ability makes for a better W-L record. Finally, I have not indulged in name calling so I suggest you extend the same courtesy. (You seriously want me to work on my subject-verb agreement on a message board ? )

Yikes - I missed that. Thanx for correcting me.

Jeff Garcia ?

I sincerely hope mrags does not spend time Photoshopping pics of Russ Brandon !!

To mis-use a cliche - a picture is worth a thousand words

He cannot play because he does not have a contract in place. Reason he does not is because of some imaginary salary slotting. I am not empathizing with him because of the monetary issue. My point is that I want a player on the team who is eager to get the paperwork out of the way so he can practice and help the team. I want a hungry, dedicated and motivated player. What is so unbelievable about that ?

First of all, I agree that Jauron will not allow a QB to play in constant broken-play mode. Secondly, I do not particularly like this type of QB in general. Let alone for the Bills. A scrambling QB tends to confuse the blockers and WRs. While he may add positive yardage, passing skills and knowing when to hand off to the RB are crucial in scoring TDs. Overall, besides all the moralistic issues surrounding Vick, I entirely agree with you that he is NOT the right QB for the team as primary or backup.

Thanx for the link. Read the article then heard the song. Yep - the female chorus most definitely says "Lost Wages". Strangely, I noticed this time that Fagen never sings either Las Vegas or Lost Wages in the entire song. Before yesterday, I could have sworn he has those words in his part of the lyrics.

I am with C.Biscuit on this (unless he was being sarcastic) If a player is stoic and refuses to negotiate quickly, he is an a**hole (e.g. Peters). And if a player is reported to be unhappy because he cannot play, he is a sissy ? Come on guys, perhaps this article is for publicity but I rather read a story about a rook feeling bad that he cannot play, than one about one who is goofing off unconcerned about what stage the off-season is in. I see in this story a guy wanting to get on the field and learn. In my books, that is quite all right. For our team's sake, I really hope he is the hard-working type and turns out to be a dominating player.

I already posted his stats earlier which say he has a career completion percent of 53.8. In 6 seasons, he had 71 TDs versus 52 interceptions. Passing yard average is 6.7. All show that he is NOT a decent passer. Let us look at the Falcons record since Vick joined them Games Started Team Record 2001 2 7-9 2002 15 9-6 2003 4 5-11 2004 15 11-5 2005 15 8-8 2006 16 7-9 2007 0 4-12 2008 0 11-5 The 2004 season was the best for the Falcons when Vick played almost the entire season. They took a dip in 2007 after the Vick fiasco but last season was 11-5. This data does not help make the case that he was instrumental in their success. In any case, the word 'tremendous' is not the first that jumps to mind.

Fair enough regarding the stats of Vick versus or #2 and #3. RF's stats are terrible.

And how does that situation improve if we sign Vick ? Vick Stats Trent Edwards Stats

Well said. I fell into the same 'sky is falling' trap when I read the text. --------------------------- TO has been excused from morning walk thru. "He's been excused," said Jauron. "Iill address it further tonight". --------------------------- Reading this in the middle of a work day can cause a grown man to cry.

Just got the text myself. My first reaction is 'wtf' ?

Actually, you are correct - Ticketmaster was showing me main floor pricing by default. Balcony is $72.

Should have had one with FM too, so he would get no static at all. But in all honesty, I found out about the name's dildo origin about 2 years after first hearing and appreciating their music. Too bad their current tour is so o ver-priced. Rent Party for $145+ ??

And here are some lyrics to "Dirty Work": Times are hard You're afraid to pay the fee So you find yourself somebody Who can do the job for free When you need a bit of lovin' Cause your man is out of town That's the time you get me runnin' And you know I'll be around

Fantastic !! Thanx, Scott. You continue to bolster the case of this being one of the best fan sites.

New DT Depth, camp fodder, insurance ??

You must have a lot of time on your hands.

Time to change the title of this thread - it is not confirmed that he is going to sit 2009, just a rumor/speculation

Maybe after week 8 of the regular season.