Fan in Chicago

Anyone watching? Three INTs by Manning so far. Denver's D has managed to contain the damage

Or we can thank them for influencing non savvy teams to allow Glenn to fall to us in the second. If indeed Glenn turns out to be a dominant LT, he will be a steal even at the top of the second round.

I think Bill is too classy for that. CJ played a heck of a game yet again. I was one if his doubters but no more. The guy has that elusive quality and big play ability that we sorely need. McK on the other hand had a great return which showcased his athletic ability of which there was rarely any doubt. But, he was drafted high to primarily be a CB. In his fifth and contract year, he continues to underwhelm us in that role. As valuable as todays TD was, I would have rather him having panned out as a shutdown corner.

I am wondering the same thing esp considering out LB'ers are young and inexperienced (Shep, Moats). Also, is Tarvaris still not 'ready' ? Glad to see TJ is active. Hope he plays and provides a much needed dimension to the passing game.

QB T. Jackson, RB F. Jackson, DB D. Howell, DE K. Moore, LB K. Morrison, OL S. Young, OL C. Brown.

Talent, experienced DC and decent play by the maligned LBs makes me give this group a.pass for this and a couple of more games to get their act together. I really feel they cannot play any worse. Tell the damn O to stop giving them a short field to defend so often.

My memory is better than the evidence you present. It was a forward pass and we were robbed.

Simon stated in a thread that Buddy Nix wanted VY. There was not much support for him in the FO but others went along with Nix as he is the big man.

Unless it is cross-eyed Mary

If Scott was never born, we wouldn't have this awesome website to vent our frustrations and seek dating advice. Happy birthday, SDS !

Should I suggest banning you for a week because you are not too emotionally invested in the team ? My point is that everybody takes it differently and railing on those who take it worse than others is kinda silly. I am frustrated as I feel apathy coming on earlier and earlier as the seasons go by - with Jauron, it would be typically be by game 6-8, last year it took longer but this year has the makings of an early disaster. In other news - you are a reasonable poster so don't take this as a call to arms.

Are you expecting the passionate fan base to shrug off this loss and not feel emotional about it ? The rest of my life is perfectly happy but the Bills OTOH make me want to shout (with despair).

Why is it 'end of discussion' ?

But I see the non-QB picks that we have and don't see a resounding success either save for a Dareus or Spiller. My point being that even though I don't have the data analysis of LiterateStylish, I can bet that you can apply the success rate you quoted to pretty much any position in the NFL and come up with a justification to not draft that position. Hassle is, QBs are few and good ones even less so. At the time the pick is to be made, there were atleast 2-3 choices over the past three drafts which could have been deemed risks worth taking (I am not talking about the first round). Let me turn this argument around - should we ignore the QB position in the next draft also worried that the one we pick may bomb out ? How long does this last ? In the last draft itself I was screaming to take a QB so that he can sit behind Fitz and be ready when the rest of the team is ready to contend. But here we are in year 3 of the 'show me the baby' regime with no confidence that the stud surrogate father is fertile or has been shooting blanks. Even if we get a QB next draft, we will wait a year or two for him to develop. Bad strategy and quite depressing if you think about it. What has Fitz shown in the past 2+ years that gives anyone the warm fuzzy that he will not tank in a big game and throw away a roster full of talent (on D, OL, DL and RB)? This is not over-reaction. This is the cumulative effect of this one game past Sunday piled upon a sucky last year. Sorry to go all BillsVet on you.

What reality would that be ? The reality that several teams in the past 3 years (just this regime), drafted QBs while we have this slavish and OCD-level adherence to BPA ?

We agree many times but this time I have to (slightly) disagree. Over three successive drafts, pretty much any team that needs a QB figures out a way to get one. We have for one reason or the other pointedly avoided doing so. I am not arguing in favor of the ones we were not in a position to draft (Newton,Luck, RGIII) but I do wonder how it is that each of the ones that were available to us in the lower rounds are not upgrades to Fitz ? I am not stuck on needing a 'franchise' QB, but I do want at least a competent, reliable, no frills/no boo-boo QB to lead this team. I am not so sure that one or more of the others you list is not that guy. Also, Gailey is known to develop QBs. He may have done a better job of these prospects. I frankly think Gailey is at his wits end w.r.t Fitz and his leash is getting shorter and shorter. IMHO, while Fitz is not as bad as he looked last Sunday, he has consistently underperformed and made cringe-inducing errors that cost us games (Giants game last year, the three INTs this Sunday). His problems are beyond what coach Lee can fix. I was happy imagining him to be a mid-tier QB but continually he is proving me otherwise. I had similarly given up on Losman and Edwards several games before they were ditched by the Bills. I am reaching that point fairly rapidly. I was told the rib injury and injuries to others on O hampered Fitz in the second half of last season. While I somewaht agree, the start of this season is trending to point us otherwise.

I think the OP's point is that we have not even tried with any seriousness to address the QB situation. Quite galling to me is that even the current regime 'always looking to upgrade any position' has pointedly ignored the QB and, to a certain extent, WR positions. History sometimes can teach us to do different in the future Question in my mind is which of them would have done better for us last season and this one ? Which one would have offered a glimmer of hope for the future ? Not saying we should have done anything wild like trading a bunch of picks (Cutler, Palmer), but is it too much to ask for drafting one of the other young ones ? Were all of them such clear underperformers that we didn't draft any of them ? The draft is a crapshoot. The same logic that can excuse the FO from not drafting a QB can be used for pretty much any position ('he was not good enough'). Were Dalton or Kaepernick so poor in comparison to Aaron Williams ? Are you ready to excuse the FO for not attempting to upgrade the most important and difficult to fill position on the team ?

That thought has crossed my mind several times since Sunday. For all of Gailey's reputation as an offensive genius, is his offense too complex for players to pick up ? Is the general ineptness of the offense since the second half of last season more due to the hard headed nature of his system and the unwillingness to adjust ? Not sure of the answers but VY having difficulty, TJ inactive because 'he was not ready', Tarvaris not yet fully prepared (granted he was signed late) is leading me to wonder if simplification may solve some problems on O.

Every 9/11, I relive the memory of the broadcast on the local rock station saying 'reportedly a plane crashed into one of the towers'...... Still feel emotional after all these years. Never forget.

I am repeating myself from another post but is probably appropriate here. There are a lot of new players/players playing new positions on the D. They need time to gel and start being a cohesive unit. Gilmore is a rookie, Moats is playing LB. In this situation, the D was put in bad situations early and often. This was probably the worst of all situations coming at the same time. We will have to wait for another 2-3 games before we start showing outrage about the D. I am pretty sure that when you put this collection of talent together, results will come. The O, on the other hand, I have less hopes for considering the lack of WR talent and continued poor QB play.

Fun game. Exciting to see two competent teams slug it out. Tracy Porter having himself a heck of a game.

I would love to blame the D and perhaps to a certain extent I do. BUT, the D is far different from what we had for much of last season - Kyle back from injury. Mario W, Anderson on the DL. Moats as LB. Gilmore as starting CB. I would allow them some time to gel. The O did not do them much favors by the bad positions where the turnovers happened. Before the D could get any sort of momentum going, they were continually on the back foot trying the defend a short field. For this week, I give them a bit of a pass. Not totally, but would say they were last of the problems (and we all know that is not saying much)

The Cromartie one. I think it was the third one - sorry if I forget which one in this sea of offensive hilarity

It could be a combination of reasons - maybe this incompetent display is on Gailey as he should have had the O ready. If so, he should relinquish calling plays and get himself a dedicated OC. It could be the WRs we have - besides Stevie (who did not seem to by playing at full speed) we did not have anyone distinguish himself. I have no idea why TJ was inactive. But this situation is on Nix. Why did we stubbornly not try to upgrade that position ? Why was Gaffney not brought in for a look see ? Lastly, as I ranted about Fitz in Bill's thread, his performance was really pathetic. Maybe it was timing but there were throws, in particular the third INT where you had to wonder wtf was he looking at. Was his hand eye coordination so shot that he cannot make that simple throw ? I am not even talking about a deep out which needs a strong arm and accuracy (both which Fitz can only dream of having). A simple throw above the defender would have resulted in a decent gain. Sorry, Simon but I am totally pi$$ed at Fitz for propagating that loser feeling in the team.

Sorry, Bill. I have to disagree with you also. I have been a CJ doubter so far even after his decent performance in the second half of last season. I still feel that the pick could have been used for a different position. But, today, the kid played with heart. He kept trying and despite his fumble, did not sit moping around. I was, however, shocked and sickened by the incredibly incompetent and atrocious display of QB'ing by Fitz. Not that I expected him to suddenly be transformed into an upper echelon QB. But is it too much to expect a Dilfer-like average performance ? He single handedly sucked the life out of the O and the entire team. I wish we could throw out his second half numbers and show him out to be what he really did - one of the worst first half performances we have ever seen. The third INT had be shaking my head - there were two receivers in that area and there was no pressure in his face. Yet he underthrew that ball right to the defender. Finally, agree with you on McK. I have been advocating seeking out a trade partner in the past offseason for any team dumb enough to give us anything. Don't know if we tried but we should do so now or when we have Brooks back at the latest. The earlier we cut our ties with this sorry excuse for a CB, the better off we will be (eball - I hope you are listening)