Max Fischer

Pressure from which players? The veterans right? Would that be Moulds and Milloy? Where are they now? Where are the coach and GM who didn't make the decision that Giants and Cincy had the balls to do? Where is their responsiblity? All Holcomb proved that it wasn't JP alone, the whole organization failed. Was any questioning JPs character? No. First, this post topic has nothing to do wiht the QB competition. There is nothing to "consider" re: his character or maturity. Moreover, it's easy to re-write history and say that Holcomb was any way shape or measure robbed of the starting job. Kelly simply did not make the case that he was clearly better the JP and JP needed to sit on the bench. Nall: please. I'm sure you read when he played and under what circumstances and you STILL sure that Nall is better than JP? Unbelievable.

Read it again, Professor. I said he was the leader of Tulane. And besides Moore, no other player is ever quoted.

Given your posting history there is no doubt you are displeased and/or disgusted by the Bills recent history of 4th round picks. Please tell us what is the acceptable ratio of 4th rounders who contribute. I see our last four 4th round picks are still on the team, including: one pro bowler, a possible starting guard or center, a very good special teams player and a TE back up. Is that bad? Keith Newman is a 7 year vet who played a lot in MN last year. Brandon Spoon STARTED 14 games in 2001 as a rookie when Cowart got hurt. He played very well (esp for a rookie thrown into fire). He projected to compete for a starting job and was at least the primary backup LB when he ruptured his bicep and never really played again. Only Black and Collins never really contributed in the NFL. Is 7 of 9 pretty good? Please inform us.

Uh, what about Tripplett, Royal and Davis? Tripplett is an upgrade over Adams - Royal is a definite upgrade over Campbell (esp as a blocker & there is potential in Everett), they franchised Clements, Andre Davis may be the other burner they need to stretch the defense. Please explain what Marv should/could have done differently? Free agency isn't like grocery shopping (or Madden), it's a competetive market place of zero sum games, and most often it is out of your control. Your just sour grapes until you can rationally explain what you would have done differently up till now.

There are two camps: 1. People who like Marv because he hasn't lost a game. 2. People who dislike Marv because he hasn't won a game. Then, of course, there is the smaller camp of people who will reserve judgement until the conclusion of the first game.

Thanks, I'm waiting for the "ignore" function in the chat room.

"The only part of the deal that has yet to be finalized is what the Texans will give the Bills as compensation. " In other words, "I bought a car but we haven't agreed to the price."

No, that's the point. They are not "well documented." It is only well documented that we have well informed fans who like to use rumors as fact to build their case. I have no doubt that Moore didn't like JP. In fact, I'd be shocked if any person didn't have detractors especially on a bad team like Tulane; but that doesn't prove a thing; it only means that Moore could have been wrong and was in fact a problem. It's far easier to prove that Moulds, Milloy and Adams were the problems last year, hence their exits.

Hey, if you can't fight with facts just make it up, right?

*Sigh* Again, where are these "plenty of rumors about JP's character in college? They exist in your mind. All anyone who saw how JP conducted himself last year through the most trying times should clearly see the difference between a "character problem" and someone who wants to win. Jeez Louise, just take some time to see how people actually regarded JP in college -- he was fiery leader on a very bad team. He wanted to win so bad I think it hurt. It's amazing to me that people on this board can call JP both a "RJ clone" and a "cocky in your face guy." Hello? The way I see it we're getting rid of bad character's and cancers that helped destroy, not help overcome the team's problems last year. Yes, that means you Moulds, later Sam, and my biggest disappointment, Lawyer Milloy. Leaders lead, not breed discontent.

Wrong. Again, there is scant evidence that JP has or had "maturity problems." This is just not true and for days I've asked over and over for some proof other than the "well documented" RUMORS. From my point of view, a persons overwhelming desire to win in college and the pros in the face of steep odds is not a character flaw. JP led Tulane under very trying circumstances, overcame great odds and was a worthy number 1 draft pick in a stocked year. I thnk JP would welcome the "luxuries" he had in Tulane -- only a bad OLine instead of a horrific one -- "veterans" who acted like winners and a coaching staff that cared just as much for the team than themselves. JP was the leader of that team and I won't believe these "rumors" unless someone can present "facts."

What, no CTM response?

Bill Godwin

Please list these "rumors." For the record, just list them and ask them to be pinned. Moreover, explain why you think the "rumors" have so much credence as to make you conclude they are "true." I will venture a guess that this is (again) a case of "I believe the rumors because they support my position." I'll also venture you'll look like foolish trying to prove your case. [Or foolish by never attempting . . . ]

. . . of propoganda. Please cite credible stories by Bills insiders or "respectable" reporters that JP has lost the faith of the team, coaches and adminstration. That he indeed is so bad that Bills are willing to cut or trade him. Seems to me, with scant evidence, the anti-JP crusaders are skilled enough to prove we did not land on the moon or that the virgin mary appeared in last night's vanilla pudding. That is, "evidence" other than: 1. JP was the last QB is named in a quote by a former teammate of Nall's . . . 2. Marv/Jauron did not name JP the starter therefore he's not in their plans . . . 3. Marv hasn't yet ripped off his finger to write in blood, chisled in stone with his teeth and/or bet the life of his grandkids that they will not draft a QB, trade a QB or bring in a veteran QB to replace or bench JP. 4. Holcomb took a few snaps from Fowler in Cleveland therefore he will start. 5. My dog or Soprano9845 told me so. 6. I have a friend who watches tape and can determine if someone will be a pro-bowler or not. (This guy is a goldmine! Sign him up! Does he do lottery numbers, too?). Please list the evidence - lay it on the table once and for all.

He means your nuts (or a troll). I concur with the diagnosis.

Did they play all their games in a dome? What kind of information would actually make you "feel better?" We won't know squat until they play a few games. BTW, you need to calm down and worry about important things or you'll have e heart attack.

How about at least through the draft? Perhaps give him an extension through training camp but the first game we lose he's gone.

Please provide examples of what it would take to "address the line?" Which players should/could have/can sign and for how much? What is wrong with: Gandy, Preston, Fowler, CV, Peters? Who needs to move, sit, add?

Pro-life Nuts and Indians (uh) "Native Americans" Doesn't have the same ring but won't be any less interesting. "Ladies and Gentleman, tonight, Randal Terry will play the part of Custer . . ."

He was joking. Instead see: VABills

Funny, but I didn't think that was going to be your conclusion. I liked Sam, when he was on - he was on; but he drove me crazy b/c he just didn't seem to work that hard most games. In the end, this new defense appears to rely on quick responses and assignments; that is, multi-dementional . That didn't seem to be Sam's forte, instead it was line up, get to the QB and let other people worry about the run and other assignments. Moreover, Sam was making a lot of money and aging. Even if he played for less money I just didn't seem him around for the following season. That's why I thought you were going to say we should get Brodrick Bunkley. Granted he's not a proven player like Sam, but he'll be much cheaper, younger and possibly much better than Sam would be by 2007.

Do ya think this can explain it or does Royal think Eric Powell should start at DE? PFW: Who have you struck up friendships with? Did you have some friends in Buffalo before you came up? Royal: Of course, I was familiar with Josh Reed — we played together at LSU. And I knew Craig Nall — we played together at LSU. And then Matt Bowen came in from the Redskins, so it’s been easier to make the transition. I’ve been hanging with my man Eric (Powell, a defensive end from Florida State). I’m just seeing who fits as the players I want to be around. I’m one of those guys that can hang with anybody and everybody.

Yes they did and it was completely unexpected. But even after their first 9 games I'm sure most people never would have imagined the careers they've had. Not so coincidentially, they succeeded immediately on well constructed teams bullt for their talents. I do wonder how they would have fared in a Bills-type situation. Kurt who? Brady . . . Brady . . . Michigan State, right? Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying JP could have done anything on those clubs, but there is little doubt Kurt and Tom tremendously benefitted from an ideal situation. Therefore, it's nearly impossible to rationally dismiss JP as a failure until he's put into a position to succeed -- or until another QB (Nall?) demonstrates that indeed JP is part of the problem and not part of the solution.

The way I see it we're not going to win games (let alone the Super Bowl) unless: 1. We have a much better OLine with some semblance of a run game and give the QB at least adequate opportunity to make the play. 2. Can adequately stop the run and not give up every other 3rd and Long. 3. Have an offensive and defensive identity; i.e. gameplan that can improve game to game. I honestly don't know if JP is the answer or not. I just don't think it's possible to write him off or have no hope he can succeed unless we address the broad problems above. I see Holcomb as a "safe" choice but not taking us to the SB unless our defense is superb (not likely); Nall is a total question mark, while even the biggest cynic can agree that JP has great potential (or a great bust). I just don't see any legitimate alternative and no reason to draft another QB or bring in another FA because I don't think ANY QB will help the team succeed if we don't build around them. In other words, there is enough "potential" in JP to make him way down the list of problems to address first.