SectionC3

I think this is an interesting question and it's one that I pondered this morning. I think Daboll has done great work with Allen -- think about where we were with him the last time we played the Texans. But we were far too conservative with the lead yesterday. The thing I keep coming back to is trusting Allen with the ball. I think the kid is very good now, and is going to be outstanding. It will take longer for him to develop coming from a community and small college than it might for someone who played more snaps at a major college program. But the ball security issue is a major problem. He's far too casual with the football, and I wonder if some of the conservatism is traceable to a broader view of the game from the coaching staff, namely, minimize risk and take points where they can be had given our above-average defense. If the kid can just get a little more trustworthy with the ball (e.g., not dropping it once a game, and limiting the risky throws), we are really going to be on to something. He has everything else, and we have the right leadership in place and the right circumstances (cap space, picks, youth, etc.) heading into 2020.

I think we’re set at TE. Doubt they pay an edge more than the guys who have put the work in for years in Jerry and Shaq. You have a point about WR.

Need to upgrade corner #2. New LG. New RB2. New RT if ford kicks over to LG. Might be heresy, but I think the safeties weren’t all that great down the stretch. They both stay, but I’d like better tackling there.

Cleveland 1989. Younger fans need to google Ronnie Harmon. We will be back.

Yup. No doubt. D knew, too. Watch tre on the replay.

Almost as bad as the delay of game on 3rd and 18 they declined to call.

Completely agree. So does Brian Schottenheimer.

I think I about Jalen hurts for that role. It might work for him.

I agree with both of these. If it's a play, it's obviously the 4th and 12. If it's a Bills play, then I'm with you on the Allen sneak. It's the symbolism of what Allen did; it was the play of that game, and that was the game where we seem to have shucked off the mediocrity of most of the past two decades.

It’s not that we haven’t tried screens. It’s that they don’t work. (Think the Spain holding call, I believe it was against Pittsburgh but could be wrong on that.) Allen played two series against the Jets, and his throws were on things that he/the offense need to work on. (Screen left to Gore; looked like WR screen right - I sit on the other side of the stadium, so not completely sure what the design was there; and deep shot to Williams). There’s no sense in running something that isn’t going to work. On the identity point, if you prefer that we line up 3 x 1 all of the time and attempt to dictate play to every opponent, we simply disagree. By way of example, following the Ravens experience, we went heavy to avoid having Dupree, Watt, and company wreck the Steelers game. It worked. 3 x 1 against the Ravens wasn’t so effective. On the Gore point, if memory serves Singletary has received the vast majority of the carries during the second half of the season and after he regained his health. Gore’s carries tend to come when we’re trying to control the game on the ground, and his skill set does not lend itself to running outside the tackles frequently. Think the first play in the “three run” goal line series against Pittsburgh where he was swallowed up. Or think of the screen that had a bit of potential against the Jets that amounted to only five or so yards. Gore gets the ball because he doesn’t fumble, and if he’s getting the ball he’s running between the tackles. Given Allen’s progress, I desperately want continuity next year. Even if Daboll goes, I’d like same terminology, same philosophy, and similar group back. O’Shea seems to make sense if Daboll leaves, or an in house candidate that McDermott trusts.

sigh. personnel is not a great fit for the screen game. guards are slow and receivers are small. But we should run it anyways so people can complain about how we run too many ineffective screens. Want to beat aggressive blitzes? Have John brown win a slant against Baltimore. Yes, Allen generally has to be better in that respect, but it’s not all on him or daboll. Sometimes it’s personnel.

two of those were a setup (gore throw) and the third was to preserve FG after the trick play failed.

Complimentary football holds that back, too. Winning is the ultimate barometer.

I’m with you there. John brown throwing the ball twice isn’t all that conservative to me. Throwing the ball 18 times in a row (or whatever it was) to start the season against the Jets also is not conservative to me. Maybe the NE game is a fair criticism - too many runs in first down - but the entirety of the season otherwise has been pretty modern and progressive.

Bingo. We play complimentary football and choke out teams at the end of games.

Very fair assessment.

It’s a fair point that Allen’s development is due in significant part, and perhaps most significant part, to Allen’s own hard work and diligence. I don’t see how daboll’s work isn’t part of the equation, though. Mayfield and Darnold seem like hard workers, too, and they haven’t progressed at Josh’s pace.

And according to a beat guy for the patriots daboll was a leading candidate to replace McDaniels if McDaniels left. You haven’t refuted that point.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.providencejournal.com/sports/20170105/martellus-bennett-praises-potential-offensive-coordinator-replacement-brian-daboll%3ftemplate=ampart

I didn’t say it was daboll’s decision. I said he pushed for it, which you haven’t denied. On the other points, as much as I hate the term, you’re setting up strawmen. Nobody said a thing about “developing” Gronkowski. And nobody has denied that bill belichick hired this guy twice.

I like the O’Shea idea. Brady would be interesting, too. Maybe DeFillipo gets some consideration if Marrone’s staff is blown out in Jax. McD would have intel on him through Eagles connections, and he allegedly had a big part in wentz’s growth. Not saying I want defillipo, but it’s not the worst idea in the world if we need a new OC.

care to clarify what the “BS” part of job was at NE? I didn’t realize that the most accomplished coach on NFL history has BS jobs on staff. and yes, daboll was at bama for just a year. And in that time he started to modernize the offense and had the guts to push for the benching of championship QB b/c he (correctly) recognized that the backup was better.

McCarthy probably let capers hang around too long.

Bystander at bama? Come on. Nothing to do in NE? He had a 20/20 job. Go back and watch Bama’s win over Georgia in the national championship game. Check our who took control of the huddle before Tua hit the game winner. It was daboll. And he got to run an offense for nick Saban in part on belichick’s recommendation. I just can’t believe belichick would mislead a friend like Saban in a hire like that.

On the Peterman point - Allen didn’t even know the protections early last year. McCarron was even more mediocre. They didn’t have much of a choice in that respect.