ROSCOE P. COE TRAIN

--------------------------- that was awesome, thanks. that was some serious weight there!

He is a risk taker. Can't imagine he will paly more than 10 plays. With the brace he will wear, he will be fine. THis offense is going to be excellent. ROnnie Brown is the real deal adn Chambers and McMichael add some deep serious play making. their D should be good again. I hate to say this, but their will most likely sweep us. ..

Look, lets pretend this's Appomattox. You are General Robert E. Lee and I am U.S. Grant. Let ends the war, okay? Someday, when we are old and gray, and wearign 'Depends,' we can look back on this and laugh. I love you as a person as a bills fan. The 2001 pro bowl had patroits in it. Simple as that. The 2001 pro bowl had patroits in it. you want to go back to the year 2000, next you will be talking about 1999, then 98, 97. THe nice lady and you are a little off. I am a little off sometimes, mostly in bowling, dart throwing and karaoke, but here i am right. But who cares. lets enjoy that it is friday and almost bills time. Season is coming up, and all is good. I officially hang a white flag out to all of you folks who i have offended. lets make peace and not war. i can hear peter, paul and mary singing somewhere...

---------------- ------------------------ There is an expression that: "pigs get fat, but hogs get slaughtered." As such, I let you off the hook last night after you posted a lie, and relied on the nice lady's research on the 2001 pro bowl team above. I thought you would yield on your cyber lynch mob mantra, and we could act civilized. But I was wrong, you can't control your aggression. But you should have backed up the nice lady's research, but you chose to go to sleep and not follow up her mistake and ignorantly wrote: "because the 2001 Patriots had NO PRO BOWLERS." The fact is, the 2001 pro bowl team had Brady and Milloy, and I think troy brown too. Are you recently familiar with what a FACT is? Your latest post and attempt to add to your 24,000 (twenty four thousand) void of substance posts was off the mark, yet again. Make sure you research before you post. A lot of people on these types of fan website 'shoot from the hip' and 'pull crap from their as$.' Worse yet, they rely on their little cyber buddies research and then further assert it. DO you wear glasses? Maybe you see that the 2001 Pro Bowl roster does NOT include pat players? Are we all blind and you have 20/20 vision regarding this? Please explain, I can't wait for the contrived answer... And I imagine that about 4-6 of your cyber lynch mob buddies will respond for you. I can see their frantic IMing now: "gee, (giggling to self) let me get him for you Darindumb, I have wit, talk to you later, Ramius." "I am satirical, in shop class everyone says i am funny, i'll get him for ya, all the best, Dibbs." THE 2001 pro bowl team had no patroits!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NEws flash -- Daron from alaska has found that in hawaii, in 2001, NO patroits played in the game. the roster and box score stats were all a orson wells like hoax!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

=+++++++++++++++++ Lady, it tOok me a second to respond to this, as I have the "stadium wall cyber lynch mob" jumping all over my back like lice at every turn. Super Bowl XXXVI -- New England 20, St. Louis 17 -- February 3, 2002 Pats All Pros 2002 = law/ izzo/ seymore/ milloy. And I would say that mcginest, troy brown (97 catches), vinatieri are talents by any standard.

----------------------- ---------------------------- we may have less or more talent, but does that translate to wins? think context. if the titans bring in a rookie in vince young -- can he beat us if we are jelling midseason? does JP take 5, 6,7 games to find his game? i think the chances for 5 wins is reasonable, regardless of talent. I mean, a good team will go through a moment of 3 or 4 games where they paly poorly. maybe we catch them on the wave. weather? maybe a injury takes place. my talent evaluation is only part of the equation. anyway you look at it, i say 5 wins. how many you got for this club?

----------------- ---------------- 5 right? jets twice, GB , lions and titans. i think in math that = 5. are you using another type of mathematics? i dont see any of those teams beating us. 5 wins is nothing to get excited about. in light of OUR TALENT (HAHAHAHaaaaaaaaaaaaa)

---------- --------------- jets blow. that is tow wins right there. GB sucks. Lions suck. at home, with the context of the season in mind, and their talent at issue, we can win 5. FIVE wins is nothing to get excited about. read my breakdowns. makes sense. don't try to light a fire where there is no smoke haus.

Scotty is awesome. I would love to see him join Ruff behind the Sabres bench. Imagine that little bastard in the dressing room in the playoffs with this lot? Piss and vinager...

------------------ ------------------- 11-5? Love to see it, but that is a lot of wins. LEts break this down: at New England Patriots -- that will be hard to win. they are healthy. 0-1 Miami Dolphins -- that will be hard to win. ronnie brown and culpepper make them a threat to win the east. - 0-2 NEW YORK JETS --- they have no running game or passing game. their D will be okay. 1-2 MINNESOTA VIKINGS --- they are going to have a dynamic running game. Chester tayor will have a great day. their Def. front and retooled backfield makes them the central champ over Chicago. 1-3 Chicago Bears -------- they got great balance and Smith is an excellent coach. they will bruttalize us. 1-4 Detroit Lions -------- our stong nickle and dime packages cover Marxs passing game with Kitna. JOnes is a force. Close game, their D is suspect. 2-4 NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS -------------- if they are healthy, i dont see a win here. they are jsut to strong across the board. JP's head will be spinning. Belechek will run it down our soft def. front's throat. Tim anderson and tripplet along with the lightweights shoebel/ denny and kelsey will be plowed into by dillon and their TEs. 2-5 BYE WEEK GREEN BAY PACKERS ---------------- GB is hurting. at home we win with a field goal. favre is washed up. 3-5 at Indianapolis Colts* ------------ they will spray the ball around. we lose by 20. 3-6 at Houston Texans* ---------------- we shut down dom davis and carr. moulds is a no show. their Def. is soft. 4-6 JACKSONVILLE JAGUARS* -------------- their def. will pulverize JP. and their balanced off. attack will win it for them in the 4th quarter. 4-7 SAN DIEGO CHARGERS* ---------------- LT, 200 total yards in this game, as he revenges Mcgahee's rude comments. 4-8 at New York Jets* ------------------- we win, they stink. 5-8 MIAMI DOLPHINS* ------------- to many weapons on offense for us. saban will have them playing for the title. 5-9 TENNESSEE TITANS ------- fisher is a great coach. but he has little talent here. vince young will be starting and we will be peaking. 6-9 at Baltimore Ravens* ------------ they might be in a playoff run. if at home we may have a chance. but their D play nasty at home. they have some great player who we can't solve. 6-10.

--------------- ------------------ Gee look, the peanut gallery has woke up. WHo you fooling crap throwing geek? I remember when you first came on the site, i'll try to dig up one of your frist posts which was hilariously void of any logic or careful thought. I see that you are still preaching that mantra. like i told the other big mouth, stick to nfl and stop with the barbs. I know some people on the site think they got a PHD in wit and satire, but they don't. No wordsmiths here. lets talk ball. keep it real.

------------ 101 times. How many am I at?

---------------- ----------------- I liked you better when you had that little yellow rain hat on. Now you are a lizard of some sort and a little off your rocker, i see. Let me quess, your dozen or so cyber lynch mob buddies here at the site all IMed you to be the guy who attacks me and acts on their behalf, as they are "feed up" with me? I can see the IMing now: "Hi Ramius, please go after Roscoe, he is mean...go get him, are you up for Dungeons and Dragons later?" What. you are the wordsmith of the bunch? Are you the one with an MBA or some other advanced degree you got off the internet? Give it a rest. I thought we were done with the personal attacks and childish antics? I love you man. You got seven thousand posts and have always been a class act. Why act so mean? I am not your enemy. YOu are not impressing the rest of your buddies. I know, the whole gang is reading and giggling and you are going "show me" right? Naw, tehy jsut want to talk football and have a sober debate. This is a democracy. Chill out, be nice. It will keep you regular, it will allow the stress to not build up, it will make your days more rewarding. I can tell you have a nice aura about you and a friendly disposition. The probelm with your post, and this problem is often seen on these fan sites, is that you instantly respond with emotion. Most inferior thinkers do this. They lash out off the top off their head with out concentrating and focusing on context, substance and overall logic. I can see you no shirt on in the end zone, drunk, with your face painted yelling the same things you have asserted in your fluff posts here in this thread. My long widned post above sorts out my position on the club and gives a fair account of the talent. ALl you want to do is protect the player at any cost. Are you recently familair with the premise: rose colored glasses or home towner or bias? Braylon Edwards is the real deal. Everett is not at this point. How can you refute that?!?!?! Think out side the box. Charles Woodson has stood out as a lock down corner since his 1st yr. Injuries get all corners. When playing he is top shelf. Who would refute that?!?!?! Point is, he stand out. He is a talent. I said Crowell might be good. I said he is a starter now, and your love affair with Ed Kilgours reporting of him at training camp has nothing to do with reality. Ed Kilgour never played a second of organized sport and was stuffed in lockers in high school. Willis has not shown top end speed. Has he? He runs between the tackles. Great backs stand out even with poor blocking. Tomlinson is the best example of this. Other examples would be: Jamal Lewis 3 yrs ago; FAulk always stood out with the crap colts pre-mannng teams; I thought Ronnie Brown stood out with an average Miami team. Willis is good, I love the guy. BUt common, he may not be the answer. He has a cadevors legiment in his knee. Until he hits the second layer of a defense and takes one to the house, he is a 15-20 best back for me. Plus he dont catch & comes out on 3rd down. His balance and speed and cut back ability and vision is not better than any other back IMO. I'll take Rudi JOhnson over him anyday.

Okay, looks like we are back to talking football here. We were sidetracked by the same few rotten apples who appear like flys on **** everytime someone 'goes against the grain' on OUR site here. For years I have witnessed this same cyber lynch mob attack anyone who dares assert that the club is defective in any way. Over aggressive and rude, they launch personal attacks and barbs that are over-the-top. Thus, it took me literally a day to be able to respond to the reasonable bill's talent question here, and talk football with those of you that have a cool disposition and are not insecure or in need of playing class cyber clown with the others who have been performing such antic for years. Thus, now that I have shut-them up for a while, we can actually talk ball. Talent in the dictionary is defined as: marked innate ability & natural endowment or ability of a superior quality. I define talent in pro football as what a reasonable fan or scout would see it as. Thus, how does this player stand up against thier peer? Is this persons pedigree, blue chip background bonified? Was their college performance for sure translatable to a pro career? What is their speed/ size/ skills at the combine? Out of 10 top scouts, is this a sure hit? Do they have the chance to be overweight, soft or slow in game speed? DO they show flashes in NFL training camps of greatness or having skill better than the others? A player who objectively manifests these factors well, to me, should be considered a talent. A palyer who has had a chance to show these things, and has be so-so with them, should not be considered a real talent. The Bills have not won many games. We start with that realization. The have looked like children against the Pats -- the best team in the league over the past 5 yrs. Coaching has been fine. Not as good as some coaches maybe, but we can't blame the coach for the player all the way, can we? The only players on this club to have stood out are CLements and Evans. San Diego 3 yrs ago had a L. Tomlinson. That team sucked, he stood out, and put up incredible numbers. Cincy sucked 4 yrs ago. A little known player named Chad JOhnson stood up and made a name for himself by torching corners. A guy named Dominik Davis had almost 2,000 total yards twice now on a team that is pathetic (texans). Charles Woodson has made the pro bowl several times on a crap Raiders team. Arizona's Bolton has had almost 100 catches in each of his seasons with a new QB & coach each season. Duce McCallister has shredded defenses for years with a brutall line. Joe Horn has racked up fantastic numbers with a piss poor qb, coaching and no WR help on the other side. For two years now, Ed Reed and Ray Lewis have continued to play amazing for the Ravens who are depleted and had a rookie Kyle BOller who is no better than JP. Roy Willaims of the Lions has made some of the best catches in the sport the past two seasons and is double teamed ever down. Brian Urlacher of the Bears has single handedly been the defense for years and years. Braylan Edwards, last seaosn showed all the signs of being a great WR for years to come. Carson Palmer, two years ago was zipping balls all over the field on an average Cincy team. With all that said, our bills had shown little of the same. Clements has shown the ability to make great plays. He is our ONE (1) game changer in the past 10 seasons. That is why TD brought in the Miami guys -- to simply give the team some big play talent. Willis was the bomb in college. He can't get to the outside now. How many rushes over 30 yards does he have? Evans is a sure handed 5 yr college player. Is he a pro bowl type? Is he better than Santan Moss -- who is the 10th best WR in the league? JP was a late 1st roudner. His footwork adn pocket awareness dont sem sound. Can he buy that 1 oe 2 seconds of time to make a play that changes a game? Sam Whyche worked with him for a yr and a half. This season, he either moves around a little and makes plays, or he goes to the bench. But nothing has shown a swagger or talent lable on him whatsoever thus far. NOthing stands out on the guy. Jason Peters was a TE last season. He may be a fine switch player ala James 'Big Cat' Williams (Bears former DE moved to RT) -- but that is pathetic that he is our bell cow. Have you seen our line move any Def line off the ball in the past 10 years? HAve you seen Philly's OL? Watch them drive block gusy off the ball 5 yards -- then compare our guys. Their line is filled with pro bowlers and young stars. They drafted Shawn Andrews when we should have. He is a force. OUr line could jell, but Larry Felser did a study on the top Offensive lines and the need to get a coach with experience years ago. His article outlined the need for talent there and talked about coaches like the PAt's: Dante Scarnecchia ; Alex Gibbs, Mike Maser, Howard Mudd and others. We don't have one drafted starter on our line. What does that say to other defenses coming in to play us? early 1990s bills teams had an all drafted line. The TE Everett is a big time talent. But he got injured. He was junior to start. He is a kid. He can't start. Royal is a blocker cut from the Skins. JOsh Reed was an amazing college player. BUt he has shown little agaisnt pro corners. we know his top end game speed is slow. THe defense has a talent in Whitner. If you watched him at OSU, you could tell that a transition to the pro game would be easy. he is size, balance, leverage, angling, smarts, professioanlism and ability to be coached make him such. He played in a bog program and practiced against bog time WR and RB talents. We dont have enough gusy like him. We got to many depth - role type players. We wasted 2 2nd roudners on Kelsay and Denney who are situational pass rushers. Shoebel is a nice player, but he aint scaring any LTs in the AFC. JOnathan Ogden will toss him into the front row of any stadium he wishes. Fletcher is a talent. I retract me inital grade on the guy. He is a stopper and is sure in form. Crowell is a project. He never excited me much at UVA, and his brother was an idiot for Detroit, but he could flurish ala Marcus Washinton (Redskins). But he could also end up like Marcus PAtton. One you get the start in teh NFL, and you no longer come off the bench fresh -- you stand out and it is a lot harder (see Carlton Bailey). Clements is a talent. Guy can pick off 3 passes in a game. MCGee is okay. I dont see him shuting anyone down. He was servicable. But with 5 wins, did he realy do much to sto pthat side of the field from being worked over? Vincent is a joke. There you have it. That is that talent reviewed quickly. To distinquish, look at the Redskins offense and defense and compare.

The American College Dictionary defines 'dribble' -- as meaning drivel; slaver (1970 Page 367). You and RJ are probably two high school english teachers, with glasses as thick as bullet proof glass and pocket protectors, who go on this board-- while on lunch break eating a hot pocket or leftovers-- and attempt to assert what "wit" you think you have. How do you two losers rationalize the definition of the word 'dribble' -- you attack above? You can't. Like the post I put forth re: the talent level of the club, you two twits are focused on smoke and mirrors and not the substance. Once again, the post is about talent and a sober look at that. Speak to that. Stay out of the gutter and barbs and yarns. And if you want to use the barbs and yarns, please consult a dictionary first. I am sure there is time before you two start teaching Robert Burns poetry to the sophmores today.

Agreed, the-on-the-field performance will speak volumes about where we are. BUt how different is this team from last season? That is what I am saying. The line is patchwork with a TE project Peters as its bell cow. We know that GAndy aint going to pancake anyone. The TE is upgraded on blocking, but Everett is in lala land and Royal is a blocker ONLY (seen him play in Dist. of Colum. for months). Evans is a great player, but he is now double teamed. Moulds protected Evans from the Safety help. Price rusn straight lines. He was laughed out of Atlanta where he stole millions. Parrish is a nice little gem. But WR take 3 seasons. Can he really make an impact? Can he get the ball? Willis is a fien back. He is known as a power back who runs between the tackles, and comes out on 3rd downs. He supposed to catch balls this season and run Fairchild's sweeps and get involved in screens. Can he make get into the 2nd layer of the defense and "take it to the house?" In 3 seasons he has shown little in that department. His top end speed is no where near the best in the game. NOT EVEN close. JP is JP. He is guy learning the game. There will be mistakes. Big Ben was special b/k of his size, his footwork in the pocket (nimble as hell in pocket and he has the finest OL in the game). JP has suspect footwork adn pocket awareness (IMO) and a bruttal line. Hey could be jsut fine. But I dont see him winning 10 games. On defense, the squad is the same with a new Coordinator. Perry instructs the cover 2 bend but dont break defense. Keep everything in front of ya style. Whitner will be in the point-of-attach-box ala Lynch and Mike Dose. Takes good cover corners and LB tackling and a pass rusher (Simeon RIce (Tampa) ; Dwight Freeney (Colts)). Denney and Kelsey may not be everydown players. They were 2nd rounders. We have two 2nd rounders right there who are situational. I love McCargo. But he is a senior in college. He is a baby. The division is good. Miami is making all the right moves and Saban, as I said last year at this time, is a GREAT COACH. NE is still a powerhouse and they are healthy again. The Jets are bruttal. Agreed, it is all conjecture. I see a good division with us having limited manpower. We are "all hat and no cattle" (i.e., we got great coaches with little in the way of players) -- like we were last season. Marv will add fiber and fabric to the club. Another 3 seasons....