Crap Throwing Monkey

I'll defend FEMA as an agency. They had more resources in place before the storm came ashore than they committed to any storm last year after they came ashore. Their response has already been greater in three days than their combined response to all four major hurricanes (Charley, Ivan, Jeanne, and Frances) last year combined. They're simply hindered by physical conditions on the ground, and municipal leadership that can't do anything but scream "Help!"

Key word being "response". FEMA's responsible for managing the aftermath, not the civil planning that was apparently VERY absent. FEMA (and DoD, and a bunch of other people) are struggling to catch up to a situation that was in large part created by the New Orleans' municipal government's utter lack of preparedness.

There is if you move them somewhere where you know you can't support them, and don't have so much as a hint of a plan for moving them out. "Go to the Superdome and wait for help", when you don't know what "help" is, is a bad plan.

No, they can ration it if they want. Given the way people are making runs on gas stations, it's probably not a bad idea. Things are not THAT bad...refinery capacity's down, yes, but the eastern pipelines are partially up and transporting more as more power comes on line in the South. After this weekend, supply through the east should be enough that, while supply will be tight and prices high, no one's going to run out of gas for any length of time.

Honestly...I think if you look at my posts from the weekend, I was saying there was the potential to lose the city. I had no idea it would be this much of a horror show, though.

I think that's how the Dutch do it, but I'm not sure. It all comes down to money; either budgetary or property (you don't collect property taxes on levees, after all). I doubt property is going to be an issue after this, though...there's plenty of construction that's going to have to be razed after this. I can't see how a house flooded to the eaves isn't a total loss, and I can't see how the city proper returns to more than half it's pre-storm population. Finding the land to build internal subdividing levees isn't going to be a problem. Actually doing it - finding someone to suggest it, getting it through committee meetings, getting funding, maintaining funding through election cycles - is another matter.

Doesn't take many resources to see that putting ten thousand people into a shelter with no food, no water, and no plan for getting them out is bad !@#$ing management. It doesn't take a hell of a lot to go to the state or federal level and say "I'm putting ten thousand people into a cave, I don't have the resources to get them out or get food and water in if things go to sh--, is there anything you can commit to me so I can plan?" And that wasn't a spur-of-the-moment plan, either...they've known for years that they'd use the Superdome as a shelter, and were caught completely unprepared in almost every sense. And that's just one example. The allocation of resources he had was apparently ad-hoc, his management has been so poor that he's lost a good chunk of those resources (having about 20% of your police force walk of the job in the middle of a crisis is not evidence of good management), the external authorities apparently have no idea what's going on inside the city. New Orleans' emergency planning was clearly bull sh--...and this bozo's blaming everyone but the person who was the primary point of responsibility for emergency planning: himself. I can accept that he's overwhelmed by events - who wouldn't be? But he was showing himself to be unable to handle this well before it happened, and like a true incompetent, he's blaming everyone else for it.

And the whole "Nobody's doing anything about this corpse, so I'll exploit it for a photo op" thing...

Easily. He's a politician. He's playing to the media, because if he disagrees with them he'll get crucified.

I just want to know if he had any sort of a plan for maintaining thousands of people at the Superdome long-term. I do recall him saying "Bring food and water, because we can't supply it, and plan on being there for a week". Now he's bitching because there's no food and water, and it's been less than a week? And he put thousands of people there, and didn't have a plan for getting them out??? His emergency plan must read like the Underpants Gnomes' business model... 1) Go to Superdome 2) ??? 3) Profit. This guy's a !@#$ing idiot. The city's his responsibility, he dropped the ball, and now he's trying to pass the buck. With leadership like that, it's no wonder the city's !@#$ed.

I don't know anything about Bombay, so tell me this: is Bombay practically surrounded by water, and inaccessible during a flood? I think that's a big part of the problem in New Orleans; the city's so flooded and wrecked, it's difficult as hell to get to or out of. Plus, I'm assuming Bombay drains naturally. New Orleans doesn't...flood waters don't recede, they get pumped out. Both factors make for a much bigger disaster. The second thing is that, frankly, Americans are !@#$ing stupid, loathsome, lazy, and irresponsible. It's not "What can I do to help?", but "Why isn't anyone helping me?" This has all finally convinced me that this is a useless and weak society I'm living in.

Stupidity? Seriously, why do most people do the dumbass things they do? Some idiot saw that there's no authority, got himself a rifle, and decided to have a little fun. Doesn't take much more than that. I agree with you...but if we'd been stuck for three days with no food, water, air, or lights hand-pumping ventilators for critical care patients, we might be less upset about idiots with guns than we would the lack of help...

Not much leadership at any level in this case. The state response is nothing to brag about, and the municipal response is horrible. Somebody at the state or federal level needs to step up and say "Okay, here's the plan..." instead of relying on the overwhelmed (and, in my opinion, incompetent) municipal authorities to get control.

I don't see how it would have mattered. The city still would have flooded from the breach in the lake levee. What I want to know was: why wasn't the city subdivided by internal levees? Anyone with even a passing book knowledge of shipbuilding knows you compartmentalize so that if the hull is breached only a few compartments have their integrity violated and not the whole ship. It makes sense to do the same thing to a city susceptible to catastrophic flooding...particularly since wise design would allow the internal levees to be used for emergency transportation routes in a crisis. The "why not" is probably cost, I know. I hope they have the good sense to do something like that when they rebuild. No, I just said let the upstream flooding wash the city out. Never suggested blowing the levee. Though now that you mention it, if you're going to do it there's a lot more to be said for constructing the situation and having control of it rather than waiting for the river to crest...

Wasn't seeing much before that, either. The mayor took them of enforcing order and put them on rescue work early. In hindsight, that was almost certainly a mistake, and killed more people long-term than it saved short-term.

Quote one. Show me case law. People who know far more about the subject than you are hindered by posse comitatus...maybe you should go and give them your expert legal advice. Sounds like you'd be a big help.

Go. A few days after 9/11, I went to the movies despite not feeling like it. The couple hours' distraction helped my mental state immensely. Getting away from the news for a little while will help, trust me.

If I were him, I'd be less than thrilled as well. Hell, I AM less than thrilled. But - and this is an important point - there's no reason to think that simply because of proximity his opinion is an informed one. Considering that he, as the mayor, has the most direct responsibility for the city, and the condition his city is in, I could easily make the argument that he is the last person anyone should go to for sound bytes on "How To Manage A Crisis 101". And in fact, the breakdown in law and order that completely !@#$ed up rescue and evacuation efforts is most directly his responsibility; he's the one that made the decision to task the police with rescue at the expense of control (though in his defense, it had to be one or the other, and there was little precedent to guide him. I consider that less an "I !@#$ed up" thing than, "Holy sh--, I just learned an expensive lesson" thing.) And now there's reports of the police in NO actually quitting their jobs and leaving the city. Generally when things like that start to happen it's yet more evidence of bad management. Now, maybe in normal situations Nagin is an effective mayor and has just been completely overwhelmed by events - I don't know, and very few people wouldn't be overwhelmed by this event. But that doesn't change the fact that he sure as hell hasn't been effective this week, and his screaming for assistance is fundamentally little more than asking for help executing his responsibilities he can't manage.

Not seeing any law enforcement either. Considering it's a law enforcement issue, and the military's constitutionally forbidden from enforcing domestic law... Just proof that just because someone's smart, it doesn't mean they can't be stupid.

That's what they've BEEN doing - prioritizing rescue over order. Turns out you can't do rescue work in chaos.

Ditto. I keep saying it: this isn't like deploying help into a city. It's like deploying help into a swamp. New Orleans is gone. Maybe it'll come back...but right now, it's ceased to exist. This is a vastly different situation from even the tsunami devastation, where it was possible to support people in-place. In NO, it took three days to reopen a single runway at the airport...and people are wondering why supplies haven't been flown in?

Invest in a good wood-burning stove. Seriously. They're supposed to work pretty well.

That's pretty much the definition of the federal government. Put it off until tomorrow and hope it doesn't bite you in the ass.

I highly doubt they'd be putting her in harm's way, considering they're trying to take people out of the city. I can't imagine anyone's practicing medicine in anything other than the most basic, bush-medicine sense inside the city anyway, so I can't see them putting more medical professionals into situations where there only treatment tools are their hands and brains. Basically, if you're afraid of looters, she'll almost certainly be okay. I can't imagine they'd put any medical professionals other than EMTs into New Orleans.

I would...but I'm less afraid of losing my life than I am frustrated at my inability to contribute. But that's just me. And I know no one believes me...I'm okay with that...