macaroni

correct me if I'm wrong, but ....... Wasn't the contract Peters signed based on RT money (which he was playing at the time)??? IMHO, the Bills opened them self up to to the possibility of having to renegotiate Peters' contract when they moved him to LT.

What's he gonna do ......... retire??????

Being a Bills fan in the epicenter of dolphins/Jags/Bucs country, I find it necessary to fly my BILLS gear at every opportunity. Being there is a diappropriate number of WNY snowbirds/retirees in the area I often get a "thumbs up" or a "how bout them Bills" or an occasional high five while walking through the local establishments from other ex WNYers. The other day shopping at the local Wally-world a guy walks up to me and askes if I'm from Buffalo (the hat and T-shirt may have been a clue). I say yes. He then proceeds to tell me his cousin used to coach for the Bills ......... I say WOW cool, what is his name. His answer ...................... Mike Mularkey ........ and he beems this big old smile at me. My jaw drops ...... I start to laugh ........ then I say ........ Ohhhhhhhhh I get it ...... you're a Bills fan too and are just pulling my leg. His jaw drops ...... he starts to studder ....... ahhhhh ...... well .... no .... Mikes my cousin. I go into my "that meatheaded SOB singlehandedly set my beloved Bills back five years, he couldn't coach a local pee wee team" rant ...... my voice goes up a few octives ....... "don't you know the Bills fans rode him out of town on a rail"????? Both our wifes start shifting from foot to foot convinced at any moment the loud speaker is going to blare ........... RIOT ON ISLE 3......... DEPLOY THE WAL-MART SWAT TEAM He looks at me sheepishly and mutters .......... Yeah I guess he did pretty much suck while he was up there, and starts to laugh I reply ........ Why yes he did ...... but it's nice meeting you anyway .... and I start to laugh We shake hands and go our seperate ways both laughing and shaking our heads.

IMHO ....... You have kind of put the chicken before the egg ....... or is it the egg before the chicken????? What I'm trying to say is ......... Are these kids thugs ....... OR ....... are we (the sport) taking them from a semi-normal life making them zillionairs with too much money and time on their hands? Granted these kids have been pampered their whole sporting life from pee-wee through college ...... but even that does not prepare them for life as a professional "sports figure". I come from a ways back when even the Bills stars needed an off season job to make ends meet and put food on the table ..... today the players buy bottles champagne to use as squirt guns. Give a bunch of 22 year old kids with no real life experiance a few million dollars and a few months free time and what the heck do we expect.

IMHO ...... ya gotta be careful about that "peters is selling out on his word of honor stuff". The contract he signed was on a RT wage scale ......... the contract he is now asking for is on a LT wage scale. If you were promoted at work to a position of higher responsibility would you expect a pay raise??????? I would guess the answer is yes. The only recourse your employer MAY have is to tell you he/she wants to see if you can perform in your new job. Wouldn't you agree that Peters performance last year at LT (and subsequent pro-bowl nomination) demonstrates he can/is performing his new job at not only an acceptable level, but beyond reasonable expectations?????? Think again about Peters situation ....... brought in as an undrafted TE ...... converts to RT and beats out our #4 draft choice for that position ......... becomes our best lineman and switches to LT ....... wins a pro-bowl bid (was any of our other linemen sent to the pro-bowl last year) .......... and he's what third or fourth on the o-lines payscale?????? Again in my humble opinion ........ Peters is not selling his soul for the all mighty $$$$$$, he's asking to be paid what he's worth.

WoW ........... Flutie was arab-American too! Looks like the natural progression for me is to give up my crown as the King of the Flutopians, and declare myself the King of the DamnHamdanians

WE WANT LAMONICA ........ WE WANT LAMONICA ....... WE WANT LAMONICA Just a little something us old timers can relate to.

ACTUALLY ...... in a camp battle RJ would beat both of them ............... but Flutie would just win period.

I disagree ..... Even though someone may never have been in that specific situation, I think some basic assumtions can be made based on ones past performance ....... if one would stop and leave a note on a car they have dented in a parking lot accident ....... I think they would stop to render aid to a hit pedestrian ......... if someone who just accidently hit and killed a dog goes out of his or her way to knock on doors to try and inform the owner ...... I think they would stop and render aid to a hit pedestrian. If someone sees a woman and children beside the road with a flat tire and stops to help even if it makes them late for work/church/dinner .... IMHO would stop to render aid to a hit pedestrian. see there are a whole bunch of behaviors that would indicate someone is a decent enough human being to stop and help someone they may have accidently injured.

What I find amazing about this thread ...... and to tell the truth I'm a bit befuddled. Is that some people seem to be indicating that the people who would stop to render aid to someone they have injured are the "bad" or "dishonest" by the derisive lable of "holier than thou". I also would stop, and if that makes me "holier than thee" IMHO maybe it's you who need to reassess your priorities not me.

Huh??? All I want to know is does sitting out a few OTAs put the fear in the heart of a team ........... or does the implied threat to sit out a game when the team hasn't had literally months to groom a replacement "plan "B" player to take my spot make them pee their pants more.

But it's not just this case ....... it seems to happen more times than not. Maybe it has to do with how much money a team can fine or dock a players salary for missing a workout/training camp verses missing a game. anybody know the rules????????

All of this holdout talk has got me wondering ...... Wouldn't the player have more "leverage" if he shows up at all the OTAs, and has perfect attendance at all of the mandatory workouts, mini camps, and training camp (all the while telling the front office how he wants a new contract of course). Then a week before the opening game declare that he was at an impass and was sitting out until he gets a new contract. It seems to me by boycotting OTAs and work outs etc just gives the team time to come up with a plan "B" to get a player in my spot. Can anybody with more knowledge than I enlighten me why we play this dance before training camp????

I think where the main differences are; 1.) Plex negotiated a WR contract to play at his best at that position for the duration of his contract and the Giants are asking him to do just that. Peters on the other hand signed a contract to play his best at RT, now the Bills expect him to play LT (for which he was voted to the pro-bowl by the way). 2.) Plex has a degenerative ankle injury that may never heal .... is he still a good reciever even playing "through" the pain .... you bet, but I'll just about guarentee he will not get better than he is right now (maybe even be out of the league in a year or two). Peters on the other hand, although he suffered a groin injury that kept him out of the pro-bowl, is generally healthy and inexperianced at LT ..... will HE get any better in the next few years ....... all indications seem to point to yes. So with Plex ..... we have a player that in all honesty may see the end of his career looming on the horizon and realizes if he doesn't cash in now he never will. and with Peters ..... we have a young upper tier LT being paid yeoman RT wages and wants his due.

99% of the time I agree with your philosophy ..... but .... In Peters case his original contract was for an undrafted TE. He was converted to RT and quickly became the only bright spot on our O-line. He arguably became our best lineman, so the Bills renegotiated his contract to pay him closer to RT wages .... keep in mind, they didn't give him "premier" RT monies .... paid him well for sure, but not top tier. Shortly thereafter they covert him to LT, and while I do agree he has little experiance at the position BUT, if memory serves me right, he did go to the pro-bowl as a LT (correct me if I'm wrong). I guess what I'm trying to get to is .......... who deserves to be our highest paid O-lineman??????? If reports are correct Peters is scheduled to make in the 3.5 million range this year, what exactly IS a pro bowl LT worth????? It's not like Peters negotiated an upper tier LT contract, and now a few years later his eyes get full of the $$$$$$ the league is paying draftees and demands to a renegotiation. All he wants is for the Bills to turn his RT contract into a LT contract.

To Blue, Kelly, and Ramius Very logical next step ..... Now think real hard on this next one ..... if the situation was actually as we've painted it (and I agree it's very possible), what do you think the lawyers advice would be ........ to clam up, cover for your buddy & avoid the authorities ......... or ..... you have tell them what happened even if it means throwing the DD under the bus because this is his mess not yours.

Actually I love your explination ...... it's very possible. Now let's take your senario one step further ...... this night it's your car ...... you are NOT the DD so you are one of the guys passed out in the back seat. You wake up the next morning to see your fender crumpled ..... call the guy who was the DD and he tells you he accidently bumped into a guard rail ..... after all it WAS dark and wet out ........ and he's contrite and offers to pay for the damages. Soon there after the police show up on your doorstep investigating a hit and run in the neighborhood you were in, about the time you left, that resulted in damage to the car that matches the damage to your car. Do you "clam up" ....... or do you tell what you know?????????

Very good ...... and I agree, that conversation very well may have happened. But in all honesty I have heard the response (even given it one or twice myself) "NAwwwwww, I can drive .... I'm too drunk to walk ..... so I gotta drive". But let's just say he did the "right thing" and handed over his keys to someone less impared. Now give me a plausable excuse why he wasn't in the car at the time.

long time Bills fan here ....... and I want this to be a big BIG misunderstanding .... really really I do. BUT Bottom line is he was either driving ...... was in the car ..... or knew something about the incident after the fact. In either situation he would have done a lot better (in my eyes at least) to come out immediatly and tell officials what he did/saw/knew. IMHO if preople feel anything less they are diluding themself and being blinded by their love of the Bills. In my OPINION he was drunk/high, hit the girl and fled ......... simple as that ..... the reason for his silence could well be he now understands the severity of what has been done and was scared to go to the police when he sobered up, and is now taking advice (IMHO bad advice) from his lawyer to keep mum until he (the lawyer) tries to quell this somehow. Another thought is taht maybe he was high, and wants "time" on his side to "clear his system" for when the inevidable drug test is administered. Once again ....... this is all my own opinion, as for those of you about to flame me ..... think about ..... and please provide in your post .... any plausable excuse as to why you think he wasn't driving or in the car, in the area of local night spots at 3:00 in the morning under the influance of something.

IMHO ...... the original poster wasn't trying to say if T. E. doesn't make the play-offs he'd be considered a "Bust" ....... I think he/she used that phrase in the sense the "old timers" would hang a sign on the back of their wagon prior to a long trip along the lines of ...... "California or bust" to signify a determination to attain a specific goal. Kind of like saying the Bills will make the playoffs or kill themselves trying.

Sept. 7 Seattle Seahawks 1 p.m. Win Everybody healthy ... home crowd has them amped up .... good start for the season Sept. 14 at Jacksonville Jaguars 1 p.m.Win Everybody still healthy .... team feels it's on a roll .... the beast runs wild Sept. 21 Oakland Raiders 1 p.m. Win The Raiders stink .... we don't Sept. 28 at St. Louis Rams 4:05 p.m. Win Does anybody even play for the Rams anymore??? Oct. 5 at Arizona Cardinals 4:15 p.m. Loss Oops ..... getting a bit full of ourselves ...... looking forward to the bye by overlooking the Cards. Oct. 12 Bye Oct. 19 San Diego Chargers 1 p.m.Loss As good as we looked at the beginning of the year the Bolts are still a bit better than us Oct. 26 at Miami Dolphins 1 p.m.Win The Dolphins stink worse than the Raiders Nov. 2 New York Jets 1 p.m.Win Closer than more people think ..... but we pull it out Nov. 9 at New England Patriots* 1 p.m.Loss God I hate these guys Nov. 17 (Mon.) Cleveland Browns 8:30 p.m.Win With the Buffalo monday night crowd how can they lose Nov. 23 at Kansas City Chiefs 1 p.m.Win I think KC is in a death spiral Nov. 30 San Francisco 49ers 1 p.m.Win Niners stink worse than the Raiders, but not as much as the Dolphins. Dec. 7 Miami Dolphins (at Toronto) 4:05 p.m.Win They still stink Dec. 14 at New York Jets 1 p.m.Loss Here is where my team starts to break my heart ..... one of those games we SHOULD win ..... but don't Dec. 21 at Denver Broncos 4:05 p.m.Loss West coast game .... playoffs on the line ..... must game for the boys in blue ... panic time for us fans Dec. 28 New England Patriots* 1 p.m. Loss We could have rapped up a playoff spot with a win ..... game means nothing to the *'s ..... ghosts of the Bills Steelers season ending game of a few years ago rears it's ugly head.

I don't think it's a "perception" but it's a reality ............... while I agree that it may be too expensive to tag him, and keep him, next year in addition to LT ....... what if LT has a career ending injury this year? It costs S.D. nothing this year to have a pretty darn good insurance policy at the ready. I'll be the first to admit that I'm no expert on the tagging rules ......... but to my limited knowledge ...... it would seem to me that the Chargers could swing some type of "tag and trade" deal on Turner next year if LT comes through this year unscathed. It's just my opinion that the need for another team to aquire Turner is more pressing than the Chargers need to dump Turner. Since everybody seems stuck on the term "worth" I guess the bottom line is ...... is it "worth" more to the chargers to have a known quantity sitting on the bench in case of an unfortunate injury to LT this year ...... or is what the other teams are offering "worth" more this year. While I assume that there is some kind of accounting "magic" the Chargers would be able to pull, to save them from disaster next year, IMHO the main focus for most teams in the NFL (especially teams like the chargers who are one or two players away) is on THIS year.

IMHO ......... AJ and the Chargers are the people in the drivers seat here .............. Now I understand that Turner becomes a free agent NEXT YEAR, and the chargers risk losing him with no compensation NEXT YEAR ....... but the chargers should be worrying about THIS YEAR .......... LT is a broken leg/foot/arm/rib etc away from sitting out a significant amount of time, and it would sure be nice to have Turner sitting on the bench. NEXT YEAR will take care of itself ..... the Chargers could tag him, give him a new contract for what he's worth, cut him, or whatever ............ I don't think the Chargers are in dire straits to dump Turner, any teams wanting the services of Mr. Turner will have to "pay the piper" .......... they can hold out for a damn good price. The only remaining question is ...... Are the Bills (or any other team) willing to pay the price?

I would guess the report is false .......... all of the teams in the NFL HAVE names.

Didn't Travis Henry beat out Chris Brown as the starting running back for the Titans????? I'm not trying to be a smart ass here .......... I honestly don't recall, and I don't really follow Tenn.