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This is like "Fans making something out of Hopkins being in Toronto Part III or IV" in this thread. Guy spends a lot of time there. Probably even has a place up there.

I do think there's a possibility that Anderson becomes so undeniable as a Special Teams player that he's kept for that reason alone. But I think it's a small possibility as our roster is very tight and most of our core ST'ers provide more at their natural positions than Anderson would as a 5th Safety. But again, no one is being traded at Safety. Hyde, Poyer, and Rapp aren't going anywhere. There's zero possibility after everything Hamlin went through that if he returns to playing form, we'd ship him off to another team. That would be terrible for the locker room, terrible for PR, and terrible for him to learn a whole new system on top of everything else he's being expected to overcome. And when it comes to Dean Marlowe, Zayne Anderson, and Jared Mayden - no one's going to give up a pick for any of those guys. Anderson was cut by the Chiefs and spent all of last season unsigned. We traded for Marlowe at the end of last season only because we were completely ravaged by injuries at the Safety position and he knew the system already. Literally no one else would have traded for him but us. Even when we did, we gave up one of the last picks in the Draft for him and the Falcons were thrilled to give him to us for that. He then spent all of this offseason without any takers. All 3 of these guys are guys will go unsigned to a 53 if released (and at least 2 definitely will, if not all 3) and might be a Practice Squad player for another team, if not brought back to ours. But yeah, no one's trading a pick for any of these players.

Benford isn't going to Safety. That was a fall back plan if FA played out poorly and was an idea that was never confirmed. With the expected line up of the 53 at CB & Safety - we have better depth than we've had in years. Trading away that quality depth doesn't make sense. The way I see it shaking out is fairly simple: Outside CB: Tre White Kaiir Elam Christian Benford Dane Jackson Nickel CB: Taron Johnson Siran Neal (ST) S: Micah Hyde Jordan Poyer Taylor Rapp Damar Hamlin (if he can return to form, Dean Marlowe if he can't)

It's Rapp v. no one. He is clearly the 3rd Safety. With the re-signings of Poyer and Marlowe, Hyde and Hamlin returning from injury, and the addition of Rapp - there's no need to move Benford to Safety anymore. I think that was something that was discussed in the event we lost Poyer and with Hamlin's uncertainty. Now that we're getting both back plus all the other things we've done, Benford will give us great depth at CB. Between White, Elam, Benford, and Jackson, all 4 of our Outside CB's on the 53 are players who have started for us. Ultimately, it comes down to Hamlin v. Marlowe for the 4th and Final Safety spot on the 53. And Marlowe is probably more insurance than anything else. If Hamlin returns to form and doesn't miss a beat, the job is his. If he cannot or is a different player, he'll probably be out on some sort of IR designated list so he can get his 3 years and be a vested player in the league eligible for a pension and Marlowe will be the 4th. Mayden is most likely just a camp body. But if he proves undeniable as a Special Teamer, maybe they keep 5 and eliminate another Special Teams player at another position to carry him. No one is being traded. No one is going to trade for Marlowe if Hamlin returns to form. If Hamlin returns to form, we're not going to trade him after everything that has happened. And Poyer, Hyde, and Rapp aren't going anywhere either. Benford will be a CB. Always slays me when we have good depth across the board at a position and fans want to trade players away.

It always cracks me up when Hopkins says something about us and everyone freaks out and says "we're back in it!". As someone said earlier, we know he'd like to play with Josh. This isn't news. But we still don't have the money to make it happen. This doesn't make the Cardinals change their stance about wanting to keep him. The only thing this does is get fans excited. Hopkins talking publicly won't change Beane's stance. Unless the Cardinals throw in the towel, agree to trade him for peanuts and pick up a bunch of his contract, or Hopkins is released and willing to take SUBSTANTIALLY less to play with us - nothing has changed. Is it possible? Yes. But Beane spreading out cap hits, years beyond his contract ending is not something Beane does or is comfortable with. If it was, he'd have probably done it already.

As a #3 Outside WR with limited reps, as his role on this team will be? Yeah, 36/570/3 is extremely encouraging. 570 as a situational deep threat is very good.

Okay, just took a look at that. But even that post you're once again lamenting on the WR core in a vacuum when Kincaid is way more WR than TE. He's a big slot. This is like looking at the Chiefs WR core and saying it lacks when they have Kelce on the field. While I'm not anointing him as Kelce either, he's going to be utilized in the same way. Harty's 2021 campaign was extremely encouraging before he was injured at the start of the 2022 season. Sherfield performed admirably as Miami's 3rd option last season. Fans are underrating them as the 3rd and 4th options because they aren't household names. On most downs, we're going to have Diggs, Davis, Kincaid, Knox, and Cook on the field. That's a VERY solid array of pass catchers that is better than most teams in the league, in my opinion.

You say Crowder is better. But we didn't have Crowder for 90% of the 2022 Campaign. So I don't know how you can even count him. You also said nothing about Dalton Kincaid. This idea of looking at the WR core in a vacuum of who is technically listed as a WR and excluding Kincaid that's been going around is so flawed. Kincaid is more WR than he is TE. I expect he'll be on the field in the slot, alongside Diggs and Davis on most downs. He may become our actual #2 WR and will at the very least take coverage off of Davis, allowing him to work more as what he did in years prior as opposed to last season.

I've gone over this with another poster. Morris was #54 on my roster. Ultimately, it came down to a few things. One was that unless there's an injury, we don't use more than 2 TE's. Tommy Sweeney was only used in 5 games. And those were the 5 games that Dawson Knox or Quintin Morris wasn't available. Clearly, those two TE's will be Dalton Kincaid and Dawson Knox this year. Morris' role on this team is as an on the line blocker and Special Teams player. Last season, Reggie Gilliam signed a 2 year, 4.6m extension through the 2024 season. Gilliam started his career as a TE. His position now is a bit of a hybrid role and he's not on the field on all downs. I feel that with the amount of money Gilliam is making and the addition of a very good blocking back in Damien Harris, that Gilliam can play both FB and blocking TE on the line when Harris is in the backfield. And with the additions of guys like Trent Sherfield, Justin Shorter, and Dorian Williams - in conjunction with core ST'ers like Matakevitch, Neal, Dodson, and others returning, that we may be good on ST's as well without Morris. Also, I feel like the odds of getting Morris back on the Practice Squad are pretty good. I'd be surprised if a team is going to put him on their 53 man roster after final cuts with no offseason with their team. But in the event that did happen, we also have Zach Davidson. A 6'7" former 5th Round Pick of the Vikings that we signed to the PS in September of last year who we retained after the season. If we were to lose Morris, that's pretty good insurance. Ultimately, the roster being as it is, a difficult cut or two will be made. If Morris represents the toughest cut we make, that's pretty good in my opinion. I don't see that. 10 DL between 5 DE's and 5 DT's is the standard number for us. And if it's down to a Tim Settle, Jordan Phillips, or Boogie Basham vs. Quintin Morris - I don't see any way Morris is being kept over one of them. When it comes to OL - the magic number is 9. Sometimes we carry 10. But 8 is too few for the OL. If Morris is to be kept, then the next likely to be lost on the roster would be either one of Tyrel Dodson or AJ Klein at the LB position or Latavius Murray at the RB position. Alex Austin being the 8th last pick in a weak draft... I mean, anything's possible. Anyone can look undeniable and force their way on to a roster. But 7th Round picks almost always don't. His ceiling to me is the Practice Squad and the floor is being released. Between Tre, Elam, Taron, Benford, Jackson, and Neal - the 6 CB's we generally carry are pretty much all set in stone. And I don't see us carrying 7.

Reportedly we offered Yannick Ngakoue an incentive loaded deal (if ECB and Cover 1 are to be believed) that he turned down. I tend to feel that makes sense given our cap situation and the large amount of finessing we've already done via restructures. I feel like if there were more restructures to be done that Beane was comfortable doing, that he'd have done them by now. DT extensions to free cap space are a popular cap freeing sentiment amongst fans. But Beane has said he won't look to do that until into Training Camp, at the earliest. He wants to see who's looking good, who's interested, and talk to them about numbers first. He may also want to see how Poona Ford looks this year before committing to others. He also said he looked into getting DE's in here post Draft and wasn't able to do it. That's why he claimed Cline and brought in Ray for an extended tryout and decided to sign him. Long story short, I think a move for someone like Houston may have sailed with the signings of Cline and Ray. We currently sit at 9 DE's in Camp, with all 5 of our DE's from last year's 53 returning, Von reportedly on schedule to miss no time (at most a game or two), no cap space with little wiggle room, and 88 of 90 roster spots filled - when Beane said he didn't want to bring 90 to camp. If Houston were to sign here, he'd have to be agreeable to a fully incentive laden deal for league minimum. That seems to be the most we're willing to do. If we're interested in adding a 10th DE at all at this point.

*expletive deleted*! This thing was dead and on Page 4 or 5. Let it die.

It's Khalil Shakir. I imagine Dalton Kincaid will get the majority of reps at the Slot. But Shakir will still get a lot of reps there cycling in for Kincaid in certain packages and playing there when Kincaid is occasionally lining up with his hand in the ground. Harty and Sherfield are outside depth behind Diggs and Davis. Harty will be moved around a lot as a gadget guy depending on the package.

That's not going to happen. We did that before he came here and he had to work his tail off to get us out of cap hell when he first arrived. He's not going to turn around and do the same thing himself. A big part of Beane getting hired by Pegula was that he was going to be smarter about these things then his predecessors were. He's said time and again that his vision is to keep the team from ever having to do a tear down by acting reckless for a year or two. Whether you agree with it or not, it's foolish to expect him to do otherwise. As long as Josh is playing at a high level, we are always in the window. Teams have done it with less than what we've had this year with a QB catching fire in a given year. In a vacuum, Ray could have been a nothing signing. But in the context of Von scheduled to not miss any time and at worst, a game or two, having Groot on the other side, still having Epenesa and Basham, bringing back Kingsley Jonathan, re-signing Shaq, claiming Cline, and now signing Ray - at a time where we have 88 players on the roster when he said he was planning on not bringing 90 to camp, 9 DE's already on the roster - the signing of Ray represents something else. He said he was unable to sign a DE post draft. Reportedly, we offered Yannick an incentive deal he turned down. This makes it pretty obvious he tried to get one or more from the list and couldn't do it under the constraints we have. He said he would probably look to add "a" (singular) DE before Camp and was "kicking the tires on Ray" as that possibility. He then signed Ray. I really don't see a 10th DE coming in. And I hope you don't throw another child like temper tantrum and fill the thread with "little baller Beane" comments if this is it like you did in the Hopkins thread.

Oh, I see. You're one of those people that thinks no matter how many countless moves have already been done to finesse the cap already, that there is no limit. That the cap isn't real at all. Gotcha. No. They don't have money. As it is, we have to come up with a few million for the Practice Squad and emergency money for midseason. Extending someone takes both the team wanting to do it as well as the player and both agreeing on the price. Releasing a player to save money requires their contract to be written in a way that releasing them will save money and not cost us money. Trading players would involve someone wanting a player, their contract, and us being cool losing them. There isn't really a player that a team would want to trade for and we'd save enough cap space for, that wouldn't cause a significant hole. If it's just that simple and Beane was comfortable with any of those things to get more money, he'd have done it already. Beane doesn't do these types of moves just to get money to spend. He has to want to make those moves. And it's pretty clear he's done all the moving around he's comfortable with. We already have NINE Defensive Ends on the roster. We usually keep 5 tops. Much like your complaints about WR, he decided to claim Cline and sign Ray within the past week or so to address the DE position. You not thinking it's enough isn't going to make him add a 3rd. The roster sits at 88 of 90 right now as is. Which is more than he said he wanted to go into Camp with. If someone's added, I doubt it's a 10th DE.

Melvin Ingram? Yes. It's been reported/rumored we offered Yannick an incentive laden deal and he turned it down. What that says to me is we weren't offering anyone anything more than minimum up front and the ability to make more in uncapped incentives. Which falls in line with our cap situation. It's easy to say "we can extend a DT and get some money". But a.) That DT would have to want to sign an extension b.) We'd have to want to extend that DT and c.) Beane would have to be agreeable to their price. Short of that, there is no more money to be had. We scraped the well with restructures time and time again just to do what we've done already. If there were more to be done that Beane was comfortable with, he'd have done it. After signing our picks and the small moves we made, we have no more money. Incentive laden deals aren't going to cut it for a Yannick or an Ingram. From the sounds of his presser that I quoted in the same prior post, it seems the people we wanted weren't agreeable to what we could offer. So Ray it was. That's wishful thinking to me. Logic says we don't have any money. And that we already have 9 DE's on our Roster. Including our entire depth chart from the 53 last season. Von and the staff are all in lockstep of saying he's unlikely to miss any time or at worst a game or two. So adding a 10th at this point seems unlikely. If that were to happen, they wouldn't have bothered to do all of re-signing Shaq, claiming Cline, and signing Ray. And like I said Beane's presser seemed pretty clear that he tried to get deals done with some of the big names on the list and they weren't agreeable to what we could offer. Which is reportedly little to nothing up front and everything in incentives - on a team that has Von and Rousseau locked in as starters.

I know you probably don't want to hear it, but I really think between the waiver claim for Kameron Cline and the Shane Ray signing - that's it for DE. At his presser yesterday when asked about Shane Ray, Beane said: "You know, we didn't hit on any DE's after the Draft as far as guys to sign. And that's why we were excited to get the kid Kameron Cline last week that we claimed from Indy. And then you know we probably, at some point may look to add a DE between now and the start of Camp. And so we're just instead of doing a workout, here's a guy out there, let's bring him in here for a couple days, again test his knowledge, test his skill set, see where he's at, and um ya know, we call it kicking the tires" So to review, he said he tried to get something done with at the DE position, but couldn't. Whether he's talking about UFA's or UDFA's is unclear. But he first claimed Kameron Cline. He said he wanted to add "a" DE between now and the start of Camp (implying one more). Then he "kicked the tires" on Shane Ray and liked what he saw enough to sign him. That's two signings at the position in the past week or so at DE. Combined with what he already have, I would be shocked if we added another. You're not happy with how Beane chose to address a position in Free Agency or the Draft? This is my shocked face. We started the Offseason 18.5m over the cap with 24 FA's to fill, plus come up with money for Draft picks, plus Practice Squad, plus spending money for emergencies during the season. He's done a great job doing what he's done. If you were expecting "I've heard of him!" superstars across the board - you were deluding yourself and letting yourself down by getting crazy expectations.

I mean, I personally think it makes perfect sense. Gilliam plays limited reps in a hybrid FB role. I think he can take on both his limited role and Morris' limited role, justifying his 2 year 4.6m extension he signed last season until 2025. I also think Morris is unlikely to be signed to a 53 following cut downs and less likely to be poached than Murray, if placed on the Practice Squad. We also have TE Zach Davidson, a 6'7" former 5th Round pick of the Vikings, who we signed to the Practice Squad at the beginning of last season and has remained on the team through a Futures Contract. Providing insurance on the Practice Squad in the unlikely event we were to lose Morris at TE. Likewise, we have little to no insurance at RB. Ultimately, in Morris, we're talking about a guy who averaged 13 snaps a game on Offense last season, almost exclusively as a Blocker, getting 10 catches on 11 targets for 102 yards and 1 TD. He played more on Special Teams, but we've also added a number of Special Teamers and retained most of our core. I don't see him as irreplaceable as you do given all of this. But we can agree to disagree on that.

That's fair. I don't think that's crazy at all to surmise. Morris was #54 on my roster. I think what swayed me was a video from the Cover 1 guys talking about Kincaid being Drafted not being good for Morris. I think Gilliam could cover both roles and get more reps, making the contract he signed last season a worthwhile investment. Reggie Gilliam started his career here as a TE. Even as a FB, he's sort of a FB/TE hybrid. And with the addition of Harris, who's a very good blocking Back and a Power Runner - on run downs you could put Gilliam on the line as the 3rd Blocking TE, who can catch some passes. Morris plays on Special Teams. But we've added Sherfield, Shorter, and Williams to play mainly Teams (to go with core guys like Matakevitch, Neal, Bernard, and others). So we may be good there as well. Again, I don't think it's crazy to surmise that Murray is released and Morris stays. I just think with the general makeup of the build of McBeane's rosters that they wouldn't feel comfortable dressing Cook, Harris, and Hines every week as they will and not have something they're comfortable with dressing the following week in the likely event that one of them goes down. I also feel that with Beane calling up Murray's people and getting the deal done on Draft Day, facilitating a Trade Down in lieu of Drafting a RB in the 6th (who I think would have been on the 53) speaks some volumes. I think they liked what Murray did last season and want a 4th guy they can rely on instead of grabbing whomever off the scrap heap, if one of our core 3 guys go down. I also think that when push comes to shove - the likelihood of a team giving Morris a spot on their 53 after cutdowns is pretty low. And that he'd be less likely to be poached off the Practice Squad then Murray would be, at a generally league wide war torn position like RB. Murray was the go to guy for teams last year who had injuries at the RB position. Signing to two different teams and being activated to play because of league wide injuries at the position.

Definitely worthy of posting a thread.

Pretty sure the plan is to start whomever wins the battle between Bernard, Klein, Williams, and Dodson. But that the "starter" won't be playing all downs. Because whoever the starter is won't be at the level of Edmunds, we'll probably be cycling in different MLB'ers to keep someone fresh there. Also, I imagine there will be times when Milano is playing the MLB spot with someone like Williams alongside him at the OLB spot. And there will surely be packages with Rapp on the field further up the field. The long and short of it is between the other players we have on the field, 3-4 guys that can be cycled in, the strength of the D-Line and the secondary, and creative scheming - I don't think MLB is remotely as big of a worry to the front office and coaching staff as it is fans.

Shorter will be on the roster as the 6th WR on the 53. Barkley will have the same role as last year, he'll be the 3rd QB on the Practice Squad. Josh and Kyle will be the only QB's on the 53. Hines is a lock. We just gave him 4 million dollars upfront in a restructure to keep him. I see Murray being here on the 53 as we always keep 4 and to try and keep him on the PS would be to lose him when teams get injuries at RB. He wouldn't stay on the PS if playing time and more money was available elsewhere. He'll be this year's TJ Yeldon or Matt Breida "break glass in case of emergency" RB4. To me, the 53 is pretty clear. A couple decent guys may be released. But "so many good players that the Bills will have to let go" and "teams like the Pats and NYG will be salivating waiting for cutdown day knowing all of the talent the Bills will have to let go" is an overstatement. To give you an idea, when I did mine, the biggest releases were Quintin Morris, Baylon Spector, and Cam Lewis - with Tommy Doyle starting on PUP. Other additions at DE or OT may change some things (making Boettger and/or Basham on the outside looking in, Basham being a trade candidate). But right now I see it like: QB - Allen, Allen RB - Cook, Harris, Hines, Murray FB/TE - Gilliam WR - Diggs, Davis, Harty, Shakir, Sherfield, Shorter TE - Kincaid, Knox OL - Dawkins, McGovern, Morse, Torrence, Brown Bates, Edwards, Quessenberry, Boettger DE - Miller, Rousseau, Lawson, Epenesa, Basham DT - Oliver, Jones, Ford, Phillips, Settle LB - Milano, Klein, Bernard, Williams, Dodson, Matakevitch CB - White, Elam, Johnson, Benford, Jackson, Neal S - Hyde, Poyer, Rapp, Hamlin ST - Bass, Martin, Ferguson PUP - Doyle But yeah, nothing crazy being released that would have teams salivating.

From Brandon Beane's presser today regarding possible DT extensions: "You know me well, ya know, we've found a way to sometimes do an extension or two, ya know, in Training Camp. So maybe we look at it at that point, see where the guys are at - who's all in, who's looking good, and if there's a chance to get one extended, we might look to do that then" Seems he's not going to do that until he sees the guys in Camp, takes a look at them, and talks to them and their people. Takes two to tango with extensions. It isn't as simple as just saying "extend this guy and sign this guy". Maybe Daquan isn't interested in signing an extension before hitting the market. Maybe he wants more than Beane is offering right now But Beane isn't the type to do an extension simply to sign someone else. Yannick is going to get a gig before Training Camp. Beane's also not the type to make an offer and then double back and offer substantially more. Seems to me he may want another Edge. But it will have to be at his price of an incentive laden deal. Somebody is going to have to settle for that and we're going to get a steal. But it won't be Yannick. We made our offer, he said no. We'll wait and move on to the next guy who will take it.

The Cover 1 guys (and your boy ECB) talked about hearing that the Bills offered an incentive laden deal to Yannick Ngakoue and that he declined. Which doesn't surprise me. He can get a guaranteed contract from someone. But if true, it goes to show what we're looking to do and that someone else is more likely. As I said before, I'd keep my eye on someone like Justin Houston, Robert Quinn, Jadeveon Clowney, or Carlos Dunlap having to settle for that kind of deal.

I watched Josh with Kyle Brandt yesterday. There was a moment that could mean nothing, but raised my eyebrow a bit, given the rumors. Kyle was asking him about keeping mementos. Josh in his answer said: "It's good to have keepsakes. I'll probably keep it in storage somewhere, and hopefully show it to my kids someday. I'm sure they'll be pumped about it, (said very quickly) if I ever have kids... um, but uh... which I hope to have kids. But, yes... it'd be something for them" Again, could mean nothing. It could have been he realized the rumors floating around and his discussion of kids could be read into (like this) and it made him nervous. But it seemed like a bit of an overcorrection on a subject he hasn't really broached before: From 20:38 to 21:09 -

Maybe before we renegotiated Nyheim Hines deal and gave him millions up front to keep him. Maybe before we signed Damien Harris. Maybe before we signed Latavius Murray. Now? No way. We're set at RB and Cook is going to command money we don't have.