BillsFanForever19

You shouldn't be. If you listened to Beane instead of this board, you'd have realized this was going one of two ways. 1.) He would be extended or 2.) His price tag in the Offseason was out of our reach. He was never going to be traded. And if he wasn't in our plans of the future, they'd have looked to move him or not signed him to the 5th year extension before last season.

Metaphorically on this board? Yes. "Spewed hyperbole" is in regards to how bad the whipping boys actually are in comparison to how they're spoken of. Oliver isn't consistent. But when he's on, he's dominant. His play fell off when Von Miller went down. When he was playing and teams weren't focusing on Ed, he was playing more consistently good than bad.

Because he's the new whipping boy of the board now that Edmunds is gone. This place isn't happy unless they have at least 1 player every year that they can spew hyperbole about how terrible they are and verbally chase them out of town with pitchforks. Like I said all offseason, him being extended was the most likely outcome. He was NEVER going to be traded.

It will give us space to possibly do it. But in no way, shape, or form is Beane signing a player to a 4 year extension for that kind of money simply to sign another player.

Considering we started at -18.5 over the cap and had 24 Free Agents, to be 1.4 under after signing our draft picks as well as: FS Jordan Poyer (Re-Signed) RB Damien Harris OG Connor McGovern SS Taylor Rapp DT Poona Ford WR Deonte Harty OT Brandon Shell DE Shaq Lawson (Re-Signed) DT Jordan Phillips (Re-Signed) WR Trent Sherfield OG David Edwards RB Latavius Murray P Sam Martin (Re-Signed) QB Kyle Allen OT David Quessenberry (Re-Signed) LB Tyrel Dodson (Re-Signed) LB Tyler Matakevitch (Re-Signed) DE Shane Ray SS Dean Marlowe (Re-Signed) OG Ike Boettger (Re-Signed) LB Travin Howard CB Cam Lewis (Re-Signed) WR Marcell Ateman .... is pretty gosh darn impressive.

Side note: the title of this thread no longer fits how it's being used. It's clear that the 2 Free Agents he was speaking of were Poona Ford and Latavius Murray, both of whom were already signed.

If that was his primary wish, he wouldn't have passed on our offer. Stable home meaning more than 1 year and SB contender surely meaning one that will pay his price as well. Because again, if that's all he wanted, he'd have signed here.

It's better than last year. With upgrades at Slot with Dalton Kincaid (who is a TE in name only, actually a WR) and better depth underneath Diggs and Davis with Deonte Harty and Trent Shefield. Our core on paper is better than most teams in the league not named Cincinnati. People are obsessed with the idea of taking it from a core that is in the top echelon to the #1 core in the league. But even without Hopkins, we still have a Top 5 WR and have made moves to take things off of his and Gabe Davis' plate - who even in an underwhelming year ranked among the top half of #2 WR's statistically last season. That's what makes Hopkins a luxury, not a "need".

You, like many other members of the board, are looking in a "haven't heard of him" Madden sense. There's no saying just because Hopkins is a "name" superstar that he's clearly going to provide our offense more than some of the others. GM's don't spend 1st Round picks on pass catchers and then go "yeah, we can't rely on them, better get further coverage on top of the 1st we just spent". You spend a 1st Round pick because you have plans for them and big plans. Harty may not be a superstar name, but he got a pretty hefty contract because teams around the league saw his 2021 campaign in his first extended duty as a speed WR instead of simply a return man. Teams, mainly us, saw untapped potential that could lead to a Superstar. That's why we paid what we paid and with that contract comes obviously a plan of usage. A 2 year 9.5m dollar contract is not a "flyer". As for Sherfield and Shorter, one is a guy who was the #3 WR for most of his career, including a good year for Miami last season in that role. He'll be asked to do even less here. And Shorter, while "underwhelming" in College, has traits and size that could be untapped potential while developing. Neither of these players are going anywhere. And there's still Gabe Davis. And while most of the board feels he's trash and shouldn't even be here, it's clear Beane doesn't feel the same way. So while you or others may worry about what could or couldn't be with people like Kincaid and Harty, Beane put heavy assets into them for a reason. He obviously believes in these players. In conjunction with what we already have. We had needs. Those needs have been addressed to a point where there isn't holes anymore. Whether you or others feel those moves were enough is moot. They were made and they aren't going anywhere.

My feeling is Beane looks at Hopkins as a luxury item. Maybe he'd like him. But with the additions of Dalton Kincaid and Justin Shorter in the Draft to go with the signings of Deonte Harty and Trent Sherfield combined with having Stefon Diggs, Dawson Knox, and Gabe Davis already - he probably doesn't feel he's a "need". The idea of doing restructures that he may or may not be comfortable with (as if he were, he'd have done those amongst the many he's done already), moving on from someone he had plans for, and/or uncharacteristically backloading a contract with dead cap hit years - doesn't jive with a luxury item. Maybe he'd do some of these things if he felt he needed it. But I think we're beyond that point now. My guess is he probably looked into it and he's watching how things go. If Hopkins really wants to come here, he'll accept what Beane is comfortable offering. Which won't be on par with what he can probably get elsewhere. Probably incentive laden and not near what Cover 1 has implied we "could" do. Just because we could do that doesn't mean it's something Beane would do. Especially not for a luxury. In the end, my guess is Beane is waiting for someone to overpay for him and that'll be that. If he comes around to our team friendly offer, great. If he doesn't, he's not stressing it. But one thing is for sure, Beane's not going to go balls to the wall and getting into a bidding war at this point.

Whether Part 1 is true or not doesn't eliminate Part 2. And that being a team trading for Ed Oliver on a 1 year deal for 10.75m guaranteed cap hit this late into the Offseason is more unlikely than us landing Hopkins. Hopkins himself probably isn't going to get a 10.75m cap hit with whatever team he signs with this year. If that was something Beane was interested in doing and if there was a team calling interested in taking him on with that deal, it would have happened by now.

That's great that you'd rather have Hopkins than Oliver. But that's a totally moot issue. There's two massive problems with that - 1.) There is close to a zero possibility that Brandon Beane feels that his #1 DT is worth less than another WR that he surely looks at as a luxury item at this point and 2.) Even if he did, there's also a close to zero possibility that a team is going to take him on his 1 year 10.75m guaranteed contract. It would have been difficult at any point in the Offseason and a near impossibility now. In a vacuum, I see some of the points you and others are making. But the means to make that a reality for us and for Hopkins is as the reporters are saying, extremely unlikely. Doubly so when you take into account as I said that after moving on from Hopkins and Beane addressing the pass catching room with a 1st and 5th Round pick in Dalton Kincaid and Justin Shorter, and signing Deonte Harty and Trent Sherfield to go along with Stefon Diggs, Dawson Knox, and Gabe Davis - Beane more than likely looks at Hopkins as a luxury and not a must have like you and other posters do.

Lot of fans showing telltale signs of being in Denial. It's not just "Timmy Graham" saying this. I's also ESPN reporters and simple common sense. If he's taking on an agent, going on a tour of the country, and taking his time - this is completely about the money. And if Hopkins was interested in that contract and Beane was interested in giving it out, we would have traded for him. And if both of those restructures were something Beane definitively wanted to have done, he probably would have done them earlier in the Offseason. Or at least by now. I get people wanting him here. I want him here too. But when you have to say "if we do these restructures, if Beane is willing to do a deal that is uncharacteristic of him, if Hopkins is willing to accept a backloaded deal with dead years, if Hopkins is willing to accept less to come here - he could still be a Bill" - you should realize that while that's a possibility, it's a very slim one. If this had happened earlier in the Offseason, before the Draft where we made moves on weapons because we moved on from Hopkins and had some more money - it would be more likely. Now, while it is technically possible, it's just not very likely.

We keep 9 OL with 5 IOL max. Between Mitch Morse, Connor McGovern, O'Cyrus Torrence, Ryan Bates, and David Edwards - we're more than set already.

Making something out of Hopkins in Toronto Part V - Toronto Strikes Back

This is true. He was unhappy in Arizona because he wanted a new deal that paid him up front. Reportedly, he wasn't interested in renegotiations with teams that wanted to trade for him (surely us included) that wanted to backload deals and get creative to make it happen. He hired an agent to create a market and get him the most money. Surely if money wasn't a factor, he'd be a Bill. But regardless of what he's said about Josh and the organization, that's secondary to who is going to give him the most money. And honestly, it should be. It's easy for us to say money shouldn't come first. But any employee in any field of work is always going to go for who is offering them the most first.

I buy that just as much, maybe even less, than they have Hopkins info. Just a bunch of homers that are hoping Josh gets that cover, see it as a realistic chance, and want to "break" a story like all social media "insiders".

I don't doubt it's a possibility - if not this year, then one of these years. But these guys are homers that have no inside information with anyone. Especially not the Madden Franchise. I don't believe it until someone more reputable announces it.

Buffalo Fanatics claim to have heard something that they'll post later tonight. I'm sure it's worth about as much as your random Twitter account post. https://instagram.com/stories/thebuffalofanatics/3115106099346972426?utm_source=ig_story_item_share&igshid=MTc4MmM1YmI2Ng==

In the past year Brandon Beane has: - Spent a 2nd Round Pick on James Cook - Spent a 5th Round Pick on Nyheim Hines and gave him $4m up front in a restructure to keep him. - Signed Damien Harris - Signed Latavius Murray How exactly do we "need" another RB?

Or just the same one except with video.

Awesome to see the "take that with a large grain of salt". You've come a long way 😛

Again, it's not just between us and the Chiefs. The Chiefs being handcuffed worse than us just means it's less likely they'll get him than us. Those 4 teams may be who's in it now as far as the talking heads now. But I doubt they're the only 4 who are involved right now and especially when everything's said and done. As you said, this will probably be a long process. And I'm willing to bet neither of us get him. Though I'm hopeful it is us.

In a vacuum, I'm sure they want him. And if money wasn't a thing, I'm sure he'd prefer to be here. But getting the most money (as it is with any player or employee anywhere) is the most important thing. And when it comes to 31 options, he and his agent are going to choose the best team fit offering the most amount of money. It's not as simple as just "we either want him and he's ours or we don't and he's not" like fans of this board like to make it out as. We have to make it work in a fiscally financial manner and he also has to choose us over 30 other options.

This has always been the case. I've been called a pessimist and someone who "rationalizes" him signing elsewhere. Truth is, I want him to sign here and be on the Bills. But realistically, the means of doing so don't seem to add up with Beane's motus operandi and Hopkins is less about wanting to play on the Bills and more about money than fans want to admit to themselves. I remember watching this from the Rich Eisen show earlier this week. It's mentioned that his main issue with Arizona was wanting a deal that paid him big money up front and that he wasn't willing to renegotiate his contract with other teams that involved back end language to facilitate a trade: As I said in earlier posts, this magical Cover 1 offer that fans think would get the deal done with him is the same exact deal he wasn't interested in doing via trade. So why would he want to do it now? Also, it's not the type of deal Beane traditionally does. He's hyper focused on the condition of the cap years ahead of time. He may put himself over in future years, but he does so around plans of restructures, extensions, and releases that can get us under the cap when the time comes. He seems to have done as much as he's comfortable with already. I can't see him adding more hits, especially that far into the future. Fans got punchdrunk on listening him talk about Josh and the Bills and thought that means he was willing to make things easy on us to come here. But it appears his main motivation (as it is and honestly should be) is money first. As I've said from the beginning, the only way he's coming here is if wants to be here bad enough that he's willing to take less and have an incentive laden deal with back end language. I never saw that as realistic. I personally don't look at his hiring an agent as a good thing, as @HappyDays alleges. I don't see that as his offers suck and so he's hired someone to navigate language. Agents are about 1 thing and 1 thing only, the bottom line. He's hired him to get him the most amount of money and create a market. Ultimately, the Chiefs situation may make them less likely than us to get him. But there's 29 other teams in the league, not counting Arizona. And my guess is neither of us get him. He listed the Ravens, Chargers, and Eagles in the same breath as the Bills and the Chiefs. And all 3 teams have cap space in the double digit millions. If this is about the most money he can get up front and not back loading his deal, we can't compete with other teams. Him liking us and Josh is nice. But it's not the bottom line. It's not over until it's over. But realistically, what Schefter is saying makes the most sense.