PBF81

Well, it'll certainly be interesting if he gets that step back in Houston this season. LOL

No, because of a $13M dead cap, or thereabouts, he's a lock. You don't seriously think that they would cut him, do you? We haven't signed a single WR with a significant contract. MVS signed a $2.2M contract, he's the highest paid WR besides Samuel. Half of that was SB. Hollins has a slightly bigger contract but costs less against the cap to cut. Hollins has been on 4 different teams in six seasons. He's averaged 18 YPG and not even 2 TDs/season. There's zero chance that Samuel gets cut.

There's some lack of perspective on this discussion. It's not so much the price, there are several reasonably priced WRs in the league, for a few years at least. The rookies that come in and perform aren't high-priced, for several years. Look at what Minny got from Jefferson. Chase, waffle, St. Brown, Nacua, Place, Wilson as examples. But if you don't draft them. And now we go for a WR like Coleman with limitations. Sometimes you create your own problems. These are failures and issues of the front office. Aka, it's not simply the price in terms of dollars. We could have drafted Jefferson instead of trading for Diggs and immediate big money. Instead, we accepted known risks that played out. There should be little surprise. A lot is going to come out in the wash this season. Nonsense. Dorsey didn't have, as one example, Diggs regularly running crossing routes at line of scrimmage. Hell be fine in Houston. His resurgence will be a "miracle." I mean how does one otherwise regain the "step that he lost "

Well, we disagree here. That was also the context of the ongoing discussion. Insofar as free agents go, most people view Samuel as the most significant pickup, and certainly by contract. Your not going to find too many people that don't think that he's a lock to make the roster and start. He's also the only one with a significant deal capb and by far the most playing experience. Remember, he has Brady Carolina ties, so he's not going anywhere. If I understand you correctly, your vision is that none of the WRs stand out but that several will log in the (just say) 700-900 yards range with none distinguishing himself. Could be, again, the one thing that I would bet on for sure is, is that the whole, offensively speaking, is less than the sum of the parts.

Well, 8 seasons is more than enough time to "adjust." If they don't have it by the end of this season ...

Well, and LOL, what's he supposed to say. Let's be honest, this is hardly the team's braintrust that's been the most forthright and honest with fans and media over the years. But I hear ya, the circumstances are going to force their hand either way. My issue with it is that it doesn't play to Allen's core strength(s).

Roger I don't remember, was there that much support for Rosen over Allen? As to Coleman, maybe I'm off, but the majority angle here anyway appears to be positive? No? Exactly! But as to the scouting departments, consider how many times they're off. So no, I don't necessarily trust them anymore than I trust anyone else. My track record, the public one, is better than theirs on the top picks anyway. It's largely because I don't care if I'm wrong on a few, I call it as I see it. I'm not trying to keep a job doing that and therefore hiding behind the prevailing analyses. Here's the thing, when reviewing players, I far too often see the end results of assessments/analyses highlighting only the highlights, which again, are often against competition that's not typically found in the NFL, or situations that aren't. Point being, it's our professional "expert" scouting staff(s) that produced the likes of players in rounds 1 & 2 like Rousseau, Basham, Ford, Zay Jones, Lawson, Darby, Ragland, Watkins, Kouandjio, Spiller, Troupe, Hardy, and others. I offered my diametric dissension on a bunch of those, at least insofar as being drafted in rounds 1 or 2 went, and particularly players like Watkins and Jones (and now Coleman by similar standards), and Hardy from years prior. Sure I've been off, but not as much as the professionals. So I'm quite comfortable with my methodologies and I'd be happy to put 'em up against anyone in the business, at least for the handful of picks that I do look at. I make my mistakes, just not as frequently. I was big on Edmunds, but so were they, obviously. But you're right, none of it matters, and I didn't say the above as a LAM, just to say that I trust my own anaylses more than I trust those of others, again, for the picks that I actually spend time on. In fairness, media guys don't have that kind of time to analyze a couple hundred players like that, but entire scouting departments should have all the time in the world, particularly for the players that they're heavily interested in. So no excuses at all there. And they travel to games too.

Well, I don't claim to know, I'm on the incredibly curious side of the tracks.

LOL

To make the roster, absolutely. I thought that we were talking about being the "top dog" in the WR department though. And yeah, agree on MVS.

I couldn't tell. You seem to have implied that they brought in Samuel and some other lesser WRs because they did not think that Shakir would be their big hope. My point is that it's simply their MO to stocking the team at WR. Apart from Diggs it's to sign low-end starting WRs at best for relatively inexpensively and undistinguished FAs otherwise.

LOL Right, like it changes all that much during the regular season. Then it turns into schizophrenia whack-a-mole depending upon Sunday's result.

Samuel's not making a lot of money either depending upon how we define a lot. It's starter money but not so much that if he doesn't do much more than he has that it would be overpaying. Just looking at it in terms of where we're going to get our production from. I'd guess 5 WRs but who knows. Oddly, MVS has been about as equally productive as Samuel has on a per-season basis to date, As to MVS' postseason production, have you looked at it? In 11 postseason games he has two notable ones, an average of 37 ypg and a TD every third game. This past postseason, his most mature, he logged a total of 8 catches for 128 yards and a TD. That was an average of 2 catches for 32 yards/game.

So in short, you object to people repeating themselves, being redundant, and saying the same things over and over again then?

LOL By Christmas I'm not sure that too many people will be.

So the implication is that Samuel is their "big hope"? We didn't sign anyone else that's even capable. IMO their WR signings are merely once again trying to get away on the cheap for a lack of planning. Three years for $24M and $7M SB is hardly breaking the bank. Either way, unless it's a Diggs type, i.e. a top-10 anyway WR, which Samuel isn't, how smart is it to rely on a WR that has never even played with Allen? Anyway, as mentioned, I wouldn't be a rusty penny on how our passing game is schemed or structured. I would bet that whatever we do, that it's less than optimal given the talent that we do have on the offensive side of the ball. But if Shakir isn't at least in the running for being our big passing hope heading into the home stretch it will likely mean that things haven't gone well.

Same thing. LOL What's the best that came out of either, who, Aikman? He was good, but he was hardly a prolific passer. Personally I would never draft a QB from the PAC-12. Their defenses are too weak. That's just me though.

Not sure what you mean by that. You operate under the assumption that the majority of "draft analysts" actually do much of their own analysis, rather than drawing on existing narratives and the "analysis" of a few. The number, from experience that is, that conduct their "analysis" from highlight video is telling enough. Either way, to each his own in that way.

Well, Shakir, Samuel, and Coleman are three WRs that will be on the roster, given that we have Kincaid as a significant passing threat, we carry what, two more WRs? It's anyone's guess who those last ones are, but Claypool's contract is about as minimal as it gets, suggesting that the team didn't necessarily go in thinking he was a shoe-in. Either way, who the other two then? Claypool, MVS, Hollins, Shorter, Hamler?

I have no idea what anyone saw in Rosen at any time. I would never ever draft a QB from USC. It's very analytical. That's how you get better info, from independents that really do independent research. Two guys from FSU put out a great piece on Manuel at the time with insights that no pro scout had produced. As to Coleman, you'll see what I'm referring to this season.

Allen was the best QB that Sherfield's ever played with as well. He posted only his fourth best season of his six last year. Allen was the best QB that McKenzie ever played with as well. He posted only his 9th best season in a 12-year career. Allen was the best QB that Andre Roberts ever played with as well. He did nothing here. As to Claypool, IF a lot of things. His contract suggests that he'll really have to shine in camp and preseason to even make the roster.

Part of that field is deep however and we have fewer deep options now. Many people think I'm wrong. They also thought I was nuts in my assessments of Zay Jones and Watkins too. We will see. Hope he works out, I simply don't see it. What I meant by his weakness is that he's not particularly good, below-average even I'd say, at reading all his options, being patient should his first not develop, and often taking the wide-open guy on the sides/flats/etc. that would be a big gain bc they're so wide open, he continues to look deep often. Also, is that why we drafted him and his "ability to make any throw," so that he could throw it like all the QBs that can't make any throw in a short game. Rhetorical, just sayin'. I would agree with you if the sample were lumpy in terms of constiency, but it was more patterned as the season wore on under Brady. We'll see, we only have two months before the first preseason game. We'll see. I'm optimistic and bullish on Shakir. What I'm not bullish on are McBrady and how they craft this offense. It could hold Shakir and Allen down. GO BILLS!!!

Well, as is always the case, there are narratives about him, the single biggest being the contested-catch one, which is flat out false. I've posted that analysis that someone posted over at PFF that disproves that as well in contrast with his draft peers. We'll see, but your statements above are a double-edged sword as well. Keep in mind, even more was said about Watkins and Jones.

Well, at a career average of 37.2 yards-per-game and an extrapolated TD production of 4/season, and having only eclipsed 656 yards in a single season once, are you prepared to argue that that's been above-average?