PBF81

No one thinks or wants McD to be fired right now. This is a discussion, or should be. Some people get way too upset over it. It's only at "crusade levels" because McD apologists argue back, and apparently get their panties all in a bunch. One could argue that the "crusade" is that McD is the perfect head coach argument. Which is ridiculous. Maybe not getting all twisted up over it would help your own cause if you want it to calm down, while simultaneously not ignoring all of the rumor floating around about McD. Those rumors not spawned by people here, are out there for a reason. Just like for all we know he may take us to the Super Bowl and win it this season, you have no idea if the Diggs thing is going to explode further, the rookies are going to be what's been billed, how McD's D is going to be, whether we find out more about Frasier and why he quit, and a bunch of other things. But what if by the end of the season a bunch of that does unfold for McD negatively? You don't know with certainty that it won't. Take me for example, I enjoy the back-n-forth if it's civil. I don't merely go starting threads and "crusading" as you say some do, but I've been accused of doing that. I typically only respond to some, not all, posters in a polemical manner. If people don't respond to my posts, then the conversation ends. Often I'll simply state agree to disagree. What's wrong with that. Likewise for me. There's certain posters I won't even bother giving one reply for that very reason. Some people get so upset over things that absolutely not one of us has any control over. I don't get it. In the meantime, until the games start, or at least camps & preseason, all we have is talk amongst people that choose to come here, read, and/or respond. But that choice is theirs. If it upset me as much as I seem to see people getting upset by it, and given that not one of us can do a damn thing to change even an iota of it, I think I'd take a few months break and relax a little, enjoy life, family, whatever. It's football, not everyone's livelihood.

I see. So it has almost nothing to do with a poor secondary or pass defense. OK Agree to disagree. Again, I'd be curious as to poll results if you posed that exact question. Question however, since it's game-planning, how come we're not always open against the better pass defenses? What's McD doing differently in those games? Telling the WRs to fake it and not get open? I honestly cannot believe that you're arguing this. Did you watch that video of Davis' TD plays?

I fully agree, but my point is that nothing's going to change prior to the end of the season, and what I was referring to as "being premature," was which coach(es) we should go after. I'm also allowing for what you and I consider to be an incredibly unlikely scenario where McD for some unbeknownst and unforeseen reason all of a sudden becomes the coach that he hasn't been to date. Otherwise, it stands to reason that several other great coaching candidates will emerge as well in addition to the handful that are now spoken about as being "next in line" kinda thing. For better or for worse, we're stuck with what we have. Differing opinions aside, we're all going to be rooting for the team no matter the circumstances. I really do believe, strongly, that the reality of the situation is going to become painfully clear as the season wears on. But we'll see what happens. I wish there weren't so much seeming animosity here over simple disagreements as to things of this nature.

BTW, I think that if you go back and rewatch those four TD plays, like I just did, you'll notice that it was largely individual effort that generated those, not great plays much less a great "game plan" as you insist. On all four Knox was also wide open. On the last one Diggs was as open as Davis. The KC D looked entirely overwhelmed talent wise. If the excuse last season was that "we were flat," it's equally valid that we were simply on for that and the NE playoff game a week earlier. But I have no idea how after rewatching those how anyone can claim that Allen-Davis in that game was game-planning. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d63gipMMUeA And again, KC's D was average at best.

No, not true at all. I don't give McD the same leeway because of "13 Seconds," the Cincy defensive debacle, his feigning that he has little to do with it and otherwise not coming clean, the Diggs drama, which is likely far from over, etc. "13 Seconds" and the Cincy debacle is enough for me. As I've said, those are high-school coaching errors, despite some spinning it that only the experts can know or whatever nonsense. LOL Again, show me where Reid ever did something as egregious as "13 Seconds"? I've asked this question, what now, a half-dozen times to varying people, and we have yet that it gets answered with a straight answer. The season's going to play out however it plays out, regardless of what anyone here says or thinks, let's wait and see and discuss further towards the end of the season. Hopefully it'll work out so that I look like a moron.

Correct, that's how it began. Then you insisted that that the entire reason for that win was "game plan." To which I [wholeheartedly] disagreed. I've already pointed out that only Oliver did much on offense, we allowed more points to the Chiefs, with the #1 D, that only a few other teams, three to be precised, having scoring D's ranked from 18th to worse, much worse, that our running game did nothing, Diggs did nothing (3 catches for 7 yards), etc., and by implication you're now claiming that that wasn't "stunk." LOL, seriously? So question then, how many games do you think we win, say this season, if our running game runs for 41 or so yards on 13 or so carries, and only one person in our front-7 logs a sack, TFL, or QB Hit, and without Allen throwing 4 TDs? I'm guessing that on those two points alone, if you put this question out to the football loving world, the answer with the greatest frequency would be akin to "not too many." Allen's only thrown for 4+ TDs 9 times during the regular season, only three times against playoff teams, never against any team that's gone past the Divisional Round. He's done it twice more in the playoffs, in the season that we're talking about, vs. KC and NE the prior week when he had 5. ... for reference purposes. Go ahead and post a poll here, ask if the results of the KC "13 Seconds" game, to the extent that we excelled, were "game plan" or simply Allen being Allen and Davis posting a career day. And BTW, the other thing to keep in mind here is that KC, while good, had anything but a good Defense, which ranked 15th in Scoring D and 28th in Yardage D. Their passing D was very average. It's not as if we were playing the '85 Bears while we were on offense. That's relevant as well.

I'm not talking about "choking." I'm talking about making egregious errors. I'll admit that perhaps there's something out there that I'm unaware of. I'll defer to your expertise or more knowledgeable disposition to point out to me, so that I can educate myself that is, to point out Reid's or Dungy's "13 Seconds" or otherwise repeatedly having his defense play 10-15 yards off the ball on critical short-yardage situations. I'm always game for updating myself. Let me know please. Thanks for your offer.

If Andy Reid had Josh Allen, he wouldn't have lasted five seasons had he not at least gone to the Super Bowl. A major rebuild wouldn't be necessary. Competent drafting on the GM side would be. On the coaching side, the simple avoidance of drastic errors, that quite frankly no coach that's ever coached a team to a Super Bowl win has ever made in the playoffs, and the proper utilization of the talent that currently exists on the team offensively is all that's needed here. Who knows, maybe the 7th time's the charm for McD.

All fine and dandy and a lot of common sense in there. But this exchange began with you stating that Allen-to-Davis with both posting career games while the rest of the team stunk the joint up to epic put performance, was the game plan. I'm simply looking for clarification there. If that was the game plan, why hasn't it repealed itself, even with Diggs, in several seasons now. IMO your digging a hole here. Might be time to put the shovel down. 🙂 Happy Father's Day BTW, presumably you are! 🙂

It's funny too because the OP's original question was who would be a better candidate, forget the fact that there are never any guarantees about that. Them it goes into another debate as to whether or not he should go. LOL Perhaps the most hilarious thing about all of it is that not one of us has a single shred of control or influence in the outcome. The reality is that McD could make a huge leap forward in coaching progress, but he could also regress significantly too. None of anyone here knows with any certainty. Nothing's changing 'til after the season of anything changes at all. We're all going to be bitching at the TV over bad calls and bad plays, and conversely cheering our brains out when we succeed. Getting back to the original proposition,ho knows who the best choice would be if it were to happen. The season will provide all those answers.

It's a bit premature for this. Let's see how the season plays out. It's a foolish proposition to think that this is going to be another drama-free season given the Diggs situation, the murkiness as to exactly why Frasier left, Miller's status, White's status, Davis' status, Dorsey's coaching, McD calling the D AND head coaching, etc., and that we're a shoe-in for another division title and a trip to the AFC CG. If it happens though we'll all be ecstatic. If not, then there will be heightened criticism and unrest in the media and among fans. If McD did end up getting replaced, then I'm sure that they'd be looking at how things develop during the season and making a decision in November (to themselves) at the earliest, not prior to the start of training camp this current season. McD's set himself up to either succeed to a greater extent, or he's given himself enough rope to hang himself. What he does depends upon him, not any of us. It seems highly unlikely that the sentiment remains the same as it is now. It seems far likelier that he'll either cement the trust in him by our fanbase, or that things are going to start falling apart for him. Most of us have our suspicions, but at the end of the season there isn't a Bills fan that wouldn't be ecstatic if he took us to and won the Super Bowl.

I've done that, several times. Just not in this thread. Sorry you've missed it. I understand however. Sleep well! By the way, I'm guessing that by the end of this forthcoming season the narrative around here is going to be quite a bit different. If it is, then hopefully it'll shed a little more light on "where I've been wrong."

Well, OK, I won't say that it's bad. Why don't you tell me what's good? I've already asked this once from someone, nothing came back. People cannot simply keep screaming over and over that it's not bad, without pointing out why not. So again, what's the good? What are the above-average much more impact draft picks that Beane's made, besides the obvious one of Allen, which many claim is carrying the team? 13-3 and "made the playoffs" are not draft picks. Let's start there. Doesn't matter the round, the percentages, etc. Who's good? I'll let you prove me wrong, that there is no concerning trend or pattern here. Well that makes perfect sense if the reason why Allen & Davis went off, pretty much only in that particular game, was due to coaching. Are you signifying that what Allen and Davis did in that game was due to McD's coaching? Daboll's? Anyone's? If that's it simply say so. If not, I guess I've got a point, right? I don't know where else this goes. Help me out here ...

It may be too early to judge the last draft, maybe the 2021 Draft as well, but there's a clear pattern in his drafting and it's anything but good. It shouldn't be hyperbole to suggest that unless that trend takes a serious turn upwards re: his 2021 & 2022 Drafts, then it will be problematic for his career.

Which players did he draft that are good and on the team, besides the obvious single pick of Allen who singlehandedly revolutionized the team? ... that are "cornerstones" or even impact players?

So if Ryan had a better team, why is Beane getting love?

And Ryan's team at least scored more than they allowed by +20 to McD's -57. Also, our units ranked significantly higher. 12th & 13th in Scoring/Yardage O to McD's 22nd & 29th. Differences of -10 and -16. On D, 15th & 19th to McD's 18th & 26th. Differences of -3 & -7

The role of the coach is to see to it that two individual players post career days on offense while the rest of the team sorely underachieves? Well, OK. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree then. And what game plan? LOL Can you identify what the game plan was in that game? What, play worse with your #1 D than 80% of KC's opponents, don't run the ball well at all, and tell Allen to simply fling it to Davis all game for all the passing TDs? If that was the game plan, then why haven't they done it since? It was a fantastic game plan, who would disagree. It's foolish not to use that game plan again. I mean if it's that easy to get Allen to play like that, ... and Davis. I'd love to seen our $96M WR have a playoff game even half of what that was on a regular basis. Why can't McD get that into a game plan? Allen was simply hot that postseason. If it was a gameplan, he'd have done the same in any of the other postseasons, which he hasn't done. Either that or McD doesn't think it was that great a game plan I suppose. Just sayin' BTW, Allen had more passing TDs in those two games than he's had in 7 other playoff games total. That doesn't have game plan written on it.

I would agree with everythig there except for ... ... McD did next to nothing to win that game. Allen & Davis got into a zone and did everything themselves. Only one other offensive player did anything, Beasley had 6 catchess for 60 yards and a pair of 1st-Downs. Diggs did nothing. Our running game apart form Allen sucked water buffalo balls. Davis had 8 catches, all of which went for either a 1st-Down or a TD. Allen had 6 rushing 1st-Downs. The rest of the team including Diggs (1) logged 7 total. The defense sucked and in regulation only allowed the Chiefs more points than all but teams that were ranked 18th, 20th, and 26th ranked scoring Ds did during the season. We ranked 1st. If ever there was a chance for McD to shine, perhaps not allowing that many points as the first ranked D would have been it. “13 Seconds” was icing on the cake. The Chiefs had 27 1st-Downs and a significant edge in time-of-possession in regulation. Ironically, Oliver’s the only member of the D that played well in the only playoff game he’s ever done anything in besides the game vs. Skylar Thompson last season. He had 1 sack 2 TFLs, and 2 QB Hits. Not one other member of the front-7 logged a sack, TFL, or a QB Hit. Not one. That game was entirely Allen/Davis in a zone. McD had little if anything to do with it besides say nothing and let Allen be Allen and Davis happened to be hot. I suspect we'll see more of that if the fans can be patient and allow him to fully recover from his ankle injury. If you have a different take, based upon factual info, I'm all ears as to why, besides the elusive "intangibles," McD did anything to help the team. If our QB hadn't been Allen we'd have lost worse than we did the year before.

I guess what I don't understand is why there's some kind of assumption that having a coach that knows how to win at the top levels, and more importantly, one that simply doesn't make the kinds of mistakes that coaches that do win at the top levels don't make, and coaches that relate well to their players are somehow mutually exclusive, either in part or in total. Jimmy Johnson, Andy Reid, the list can go on and on here. If the team were to dismiss McD, why is there even an assumption by some that the next coach would be rubbing the entire team wrong or otherwise not relating well to his players out of the gate. Of course a coach needs to relate well to his players to win at the top levels. If he doesn't have that then they call that losing the locker room. Making the dumbest decisions in the history of the game also causes that if it happens often enough thereby prematurely ending seasons, which usually isn't a huge number of times. And as a case in point, Siranni, Shanahan, Taylor, and Reid, the four coaches in the CC games, they all seem to be well liked and have great relationships with their players. I would guess that only a few coaches, ones that are either on the hotseat or otherwise won't last long, don't have good relationships with their teams/players.

Well, it is debatable, but yes, that is my take. Most of what gets stated here is peoples' takes. Hence the disagreements. LOL

If there's someone better on the roster, I'm sure they'll replace Davis with that WR. Until that time ...

A lot of people outside of Buffalo are also starting to question our coaching. If the Strength-of-Schedule holds, this will be the most difficult schedule that McD's ever had to work against either here or in Carolina. I've already pointed out in another thread that of the last 23 seasons (the drought era), McD's tenure and the drought years, he's had 5 of the 9 easiest SoS's working for him. 2021, our best season, was the third easiest during that time. Last season we split with the Jets and Fins and the Jets are definitely better this season. As it was, four of the five games vs. the Fins & Jets were by 3 points or less. The game that we beat the Jets we were actually outplayed and their two fumbles were the difference in that game. We couldn't score more than 20 points in either Jets game. If we're as good as we all think and if McD's really a good coach, we should easily win the division. Allen alone gives us that edge. What happens after that is another thing. I wouldn't bet a nickel that Tua stays healthy the entire season.

Well, I would say this, which I didn't see mentioned, we have the same schedule as the other three teams, except that we play the Jags, @ Cincy, & Tampa; the Fins play Carolina, @ Baltimore, & Tenn; the Jets play Atlanta, @ Cleveland, & Houston Assuming that the Jets sweep those games, that'd be a one or two game edge on us. I wouldn't bet on us right now @ Cincy. Presumably they'll be favored. Jags will be much tougher this season with Lawrence in his third season and after having posted numbers over the last half of the season that had he done all season would have placed him in the top-5 QBs, and they finished their season 7-2 and 6-1.