ALLinALLEN

If it counts/replaces an international game we play once every few years, sure - but if they make it a 1x a year thing for 5 years or whatever, we riot

There are quite a few interesting names on the FA list, but I doubt we dip into that so early.

I’ve seen enough - I want this guy for the year. Bye bass.

Ok man, whatever floats your boat. Sorry we disagree.

You're changing topics now? I'm saying I wouldn't label them as Antifa unless they are active in those communities, or write some sort of manifesto claiming that. Sheesh.

Abortion, trans people, gay people....there are certainly MAGA issues that have even lead to shootings. If I change my example to trans people...someone writes"down with trans" on bullets, same point stands. But yes, if said person is in MAGA chat rooms, MAGA rallies, photo with hats on...then yeah can label. Same here - if this kid is in Antifa chat rooms, at meetups, has branding..then yes, label it. I'm not lumping them into a basket yet - just calling them a deranged mentally ill person for now.

Sure. In a short example: Say a person with anti-illegal immigrant views shoots up a facility full of illegal immigrants...Say he even writes "go back to your country" on his guns/bullets. I don't state that he is "Part of the MAGA movement". He just shares views that MAGA also shares. You (from what I can tell) would lump said person into MAGA. You are lumping this kid into "ANTIFA" when he has no direct affiliation other than some of his views. That's what I think (at least) we disagree on.

Ok, agree to disagree...respectfully.

I think you are missing my point in what I'm saying, but if you believe that he's Antifa then ok, no changing that. It does nothing for me (whether he is or isnt) as the fringe far-left and far-right groups need to quell tensions and their rhetoric.

My point is that if a crazed anti-abortion person committed a shooting, It would be wrong to say they were "part of the MAGA movement!" Sure its a shared view, but unless you show me that same person at rallies, on online forums, encouraged by others...then I would conclude the person was just a crazy person acting out tat happened to share similar views. I think this kid shared some (or alot even) of Antifa views, but I'm not saying he is part of the Antifa movement. As facts come out, that could surely change.

Not if he had no affiliations with Antifa (via online communities, meetups, etc.). Otherwise it would just be that he shared some viewpoints of that movement.

Has this come out yet? I haven't seen anything on this.

Well yeah, I agree the rhetoric is the real danger. Whether someone claims the far-right, far-left, or no group at all, violent language can still push lone actors to act. That’s why I think it’s more important to call out and reduce the toxic messaging—no matter which side it comes from—than to argue over labels like ‘Antifa. It's meaningless.

An individual’s motive can overlap with a term without signifying membership. Unless there's credible evidence that he engaged with Antifa groups online or in person (which could still come out, then obviously I'd agree), it's more precise to describe him as an individual who carried out a violent act and happened to use anti-fascist rhetoric - not as a member of Antifa.

From the details coming out about the family, he grew up in a deeply republican family, who loved guns (father was law enforcement 20+ years), religious, educated. He was smart (saw a pic he was a 4.0 student), went to college, probably started to have experiences and conversations that challenged his ultra conservative home he grew up in. He probably began to differ from his family's beliefs which further confused him. He then sees a character like Kirk as someone who was further promoting said topics he doesnt agree with. Then he acts, horribly, and commits an atrocity he seems fit. It doesnt mean he's ANTIFA or whatever. He was a crazy person that we all can agree was just evil. Not part of some "movement".