Einstein

Ok so the Bills shouldn’t take any money from the state then, right? They should cover the stadium costs with the price of tickets, right? When you go to Home Depot, do you only pay for your tool? Or did you pay for the building, then pay for your right to enter that building, and then pay for the tool? Because unless it’s the latter, your comparison makes no sense. 1) We pay for stadium via taxpayer money. 2) We pay for it via PSL’s. 3) We pay for it via the ticket (this is the comparison of the power tool). The first two are no comparison to home depot, movie theaters or anything else. This is not the Bills stadium. It’s the taxpayer stadium. That’s why the Bills don’t own it. It’s owned by the State. .

That comparison makes no sense. My money pays to see the movie that I chose. I didn’t pay for the building and then pay for the movie on top of it. PSL’s only go the stadium. That’s why they exist. They were invented to pay for stadium building. They do not go into owners pockets. Nope. That is NYS tax money. If it didn’t go toward the stadium, it would be earmarked for something else. The fact that it’s going toward the stadium means that taxpayers are paying for the full amount of whatever that Seneca money would have went to. Either way, taxpayers pay for it. Pegs will end up paying around 10-15% of the total cost out of pocket.

5th most playoff wins with the 2nd most playoff appearances is the opposite of success if you ask me.

Another regular season success thread. I look forward to the playoff success thread at some point ever.

I don't think Pegula gets over 15% of the cost. The majority of Tpegs contribution is coming from an NFL loan that will be paid back by PSL's (so not actually Pegula's money). Fans will pay for the taxpayer portion, and the PSL portion. It's a taxpayer stadium, we just dont have no say in what it looks like. Odd how that works.

Don't be so sure!

The items that are different and make a huge difference. 1) The Tottenham roof is the perfect mix of open air stadium and dome. The field is still open to the elements, but every seat is covered by the canopy. 2) The seats are not blocky and jagged. They are shapely with perfectly stacked sections. 3) The design and amount of glass is beautiful. This is is in the eye of the beholder obviously. There is a reason why Tottenham is an award winning stadium.

Inflation has risen about 20%. Throw in another 20% for NYS and you have $1.4B ... our budget.

And Tottenham was only $1B. Someone going to tell me the cost to build that stadium has risen more than 40% in 3 years?

That's the problem a lot of us have. We don't want to have a $1.4B stadium that is comparable to old stadiums like Pitt, Cleveland, NYJ, etc. I don't see any happy medium here. It's an old-school outdoor stadium with a shiny exterior that has an entrance that looks like a Macy's.

Yes. At least Tottenham.

For the Vikings stadium. Or even the Tottenham stadium.

McDermott just said that the plan is for Benford to play Cornerback next season.

yes... I'm not sure you understand what inflation is. It is all encompassing.

Yeah, that's all inflation. Falcons opened their massive stadium with a mall apparently in it the following year (2017) for $1.5B. Now THAT is a much sharper looking stadium. The mini-roof appears to cover way more seats, and the seats are not blocky. I like the curved seat section in the endzone (or goal area). Looking at the Tottenham stadium (thank you Figster) why didn't we do this? It was even designed by populous! We would still have the snow/rain/weather games that people love, and fans get to stay dry. This blows what we see in our new renderings out of the water.

I fear the point went over his head. The #1 plane manufacturer in the world has watched as their planes fell out of the sky twice in the last several years due to a terrible engineering design of their MCAS system and lack of redundancy in the sensors. To say that a big firm can't make mistakes if foolhardy.

I don't think they will. You will be hearing about this for 30 years. Unless the renderings are purposefully misleading, we can see the size of the scoreboard relative to the stadium around it. It's very small compared to the new stadiums of the NFL. We can see how the layout of the seating sections in the renderings. We have an above view, sideline view, and endzone view. Not sure what other view we would need. All these things are NORMAL for stadium's. There is nothing unique about this stadium that will raise costs over a typical NFL stadium. There isn't going to be a surprise section made out of gold raising the cost. Therefore, we can compare this stadium to other NFL stadiums that were built for similar amounts. US Bank Stadium (Vikings palace of a stadium) was built for $1.1B in 2016. Including inflation (using an inflation calculator), that stadium would be $1.3B in 2023. The Vikings domed, beautiful, stadium cost less than we what we are spending for this bedpan stadium.

Being in the business world as long as I have, I can say unequivocally that you would be SHOCKED at the glaring issues that don't get considered until very late in a project, or NOT AT ALL. A few examples: 1) When they designed the kingdome, they didn't take into consideration Seattle's near-constant rainfall. After a decade, the roof became so waterlogged that it began to disintegrate. 2) The teflon roof on the Metrodome that when the sun was shining and the lights were on inside, would create a eye-blinding glare at times. Oh and it couldn't withstand Minnesota snow. 3) The roof on Olympic stadium that ripped every time (seemingly) they opened it. 4) The Cowboys stadium that has punts hitting the scoreboard ever year.

We can see, via the renderings: - The non-shielded concourses - The ugly bed pan design - The small scoreboards - No dome - The blocky and jagged seating sections We have been told (or intimated) by the Bills: - Less than half of the non-VIP seating will have covering - Only the VIP areas will have radiant heating The only things we DON'T know are the actual sizes of the concourses, the width of the seats, and what food options there will be.

If others are “whiny men” for not liking what nearly $1B of taxpayer money is getting us, what does it make you for crying about others crying? A super whiny man!?

The same things that go into every stadium, you mean? We just saw Minnesota build the taj mahal with the same budget a few years ago.

So far we know: - The stadium resembles a bedpan - The wider concourses won’t be shielded from the elements - There is no real discernible standout features to the stadium - The roof overhang doesn’t appear to cover much - Radiant heating will only be in the VIP areas - The scoreboards appear oddly small (like one of those weird widescreen monitors) - The entrances look like you’re going into a department store - The sections are very blocky and jagged. There is probably a good reason for this (crowd control?) but it looks ugly. I am so bummed that this is all they can do with $1.4B .

I want to be excited about this, but I also know that it’s McD’s defense regardless. Nothing will change schematically.

That's what my Carolina buddy told me! He said it looks like a bedpan. I guess I can see it. Maybe we can call it "the pan". We went from "the Ralph" to "the Pan".

It was an agreement between Seneca tribes and NYS. Seneca got exclusive rights to casino in Buffalo and surrounding areas, and in return they would pay NYS 25% of slot money.